dorjeshugden.com
About Dorje Shugden => General Discussion => Topic started by: Mana on October 29, 2011, 10:18:41 PM
-
"The 3rd Dorjechang Buddha" put up a full-page advertisement in Taiwan newspaper sometime in August this year, claiming that he, among the hundreds if not thousands of recognitions, is a Buddha, is recognized by (see for yourself the picture below) Penor Rinpoche, Sogyal Rinpoche, gurus of Karmapa, gurus of Dalai Lama, Sakya Trizin etc etc. Besides that, the 3rd Dorjechang has won the highest world peace award on par with (see pic below) Ronald Reagan, Gandhi etc. And if you read Chinese, there are many more recognitions being awarded. Interestingly, he is also in the list of most wanted criminals in China Police website for con job (see pic below).
So, Tibetan Religious Police (CTA), since you are so paranoid about preserving the purity of the Tibetan Buddhism and protecting the name of the Dalai Lama, this is a good chance for you to at least come out and say something, it is a full-page newspaper advertisement right in your face, so since you are so good in persecuting "deviant" Buddhists like Dorje Shugden practitioners, then please say something about this, please do something, please suppress the 3rd Dorjechang's supporters, please close down his temple, in short, please help make this world a better place since you are so holy about protecting your Tibetan Buddhism. Dont lose this opportunity for you to shine!!!
(http://www.dorjeshugden.com/images/dorjechang3.jpg)
(http://www.dorjeshugden.com/images/dorjechang3b.jpg)
(http://www.dorjeshugden.com/images/dorjechang3a.jpg)
(http://www.dorjeshugden.com/images/dorjechang3c.jpg)
-
Out of no respect, but where is this lineage come from ? Is "H.H. Third Dorje Chang Buddha" are belong to Tibatan Buddhism, does he belong Nyima, Gelug, Kagya or Sakya? If the linage holders of 4 main Tibetan Buddhism sect will never address themselves as a Buddha (although their mind are no different from the Buddha) why "Dorje Chang Buddha" will address himself as a Buddha? I thought humble is one of the basic practice of all Buddhist ?
If "Dorje Chang Buddha" is a qualified Lama or teacher from all four lineage, why we did not hear anything about him? Where did he got the recognization from, in which monastery? The World Peace Prize that he received, it's NOT Nobel World Peace Prize but from a foundation that founded by a Korean, it's just look so unrealistic to me.
CTA spent all the time, effort to stop all the qualified high lama such as, Gangchen Rinpoche, Dagom Rinpoche, Domo Geshe Rinpoche or Trijang Rinpoche to spread the real Buddha lineage , and even gave followers of the perfect teaching of Tsongkhapa a real hard time, they should check out and protect the real teaching, and prevent con man to use Holy lama's and Buddha's name to cheat on the sincere people. But they are ok with it, this makes me wonder does CTA really care about people or just want to look good simply because they follow what Dalai Lama said.
It's time to wake up, more and more con men are using Buddha's name to get benefit from the people, but if we do not stop it, people will lost faith in Buddhism, this will be even harder for people to meet the real dharma. If CTA really want to do something good for the society and gain respect from the public, please do something good, and stop wasting your time to create more problem for all the lineage masters.
-
Well, this sure is a display that Taiwan doesn't give a hoot about CTA. Why should they! They support and "shout from the roof top" whoever they feel for.
Taiwanese is progressive, they are intelligent and can certainly deduce for themselves what is logical or not. And I think more and more people will start to not be bothered by what CTA has to say because they have operated from a standpoint of "non-substantial basis". (no disrespect intended)
-
It's just incredible that here's a guy in Taiwan who goes around masquerading as a recognized Buddha(recognized by high Lamas, teachers of the Dalai Lama), advertises himself brazenly in the Taiwan newspaper and has gathered hordes of followers and supporters, and yet goes unnoticed by the Tibetan Religious Police! At the same time he is wanted by the China Police for a con job or jobs!
He is tarnishing the name of Tibetan Buddhism and the Dalai Lama. So why aren't the Tibetan Religious Police doing anything about it? Leaving him alone will mean he is going to lead thousands and thousands of people down the garden path of fake spirituality and to their detriment. Surely this is a case when to preserve the purity of Tibetan Buddhism and to protect the Dalai Lama's name, the CTA should have sprung into immediate damage control action. Instead, they are distracted elsewhere and forever barking up the wrong tree and hounding and condemning great authentic Lamas who practice Dorje Shugden, never(in the first place) having shown any convincing proof or evidence that practicing Dorje Shugden is a negative practice, hurting or harming Tibetan Buddhism or the Dalai Lama.
-
Hahahaha the irony. So at one point, His Holiness the Dalai Lama told Tibetans not to travel to Taiwan... and now Taiwans allowing stuff like this? The CTA should ask their new friends the Taiwanese to clamp down on him, or at least force their papers to do more research before allowing ill-informed, full-page adverts like this to be taken out.
And is it just me, or does he look like a very bad Michael Jackson impersonator? And dont many of the pictures look like they came off a Google Image search?
You know, on the one hand I love how shameless this man is, but on the other hand I hate to think what state of mind he must be in to take out a full-page advert. And how many people hes deceiving?
-
Surely this is a case when to preserve the purity of Tibetan Buddhism and to protect the Dalai Lama's name, the CTA should have sprung into immediate damage control action. Instead, they are distracted elsewhere and forever barking up the wrong tree and hounding and condemning great authentic Lamas who practice Dorje Shugden, never(in the first place) having shown any convincing proof or evidence that practicing Dorje Shugden is a negative practice, hurting or harming Tibetan Buddhism or the Dalai Lama.
So true and such a sad situation. What has "Tibet" got to offer the world...nothing, yet the greatest gift of authentic buddha dharma. So wouldn't Tibetan religious/political authorities promote their authentic lamas at all cost? Well, we certainly do not see it happening but like you said, authentic lamas are picked on and persecuted all because of their practice? Pretty archaic and illogical.
-
In this forum, any criticism towards any Guru is frowned upon. And yet, many people dare to claim that Dorjechang III is a fake, although he is a Guru. Why it is okay to speak badly about Dorjechang III but not about some other multi-number-gurus? If someone here says that Dalai Lama XIV is a fake, it is not allowed. Why can we criticize some Gurus but not others?
(And yes, this IS a trick question, with many big consequences. And yes, this question IS very important also.)
-
In this forum, any criticism towards any Guru is frowned upon. And yet, many people dare to claim that Dorjechang III is a fake, although he is a Guru. Why it is okay to speak badly about Dorjechang III but not about some other multi-number-gurus? If someone here says that Dalai Lama XIV is a fake, it is not allowed. Why can we criticize some Gurus but not others?
(And yes, this IS a trick question, with many big consequences. And yes, this question IS very important also.)
Why do you always look for faults on this forum? Why don't you just participate in threads you like and avoid those you don't? I mean that is something you don't like here, but there is so many other things that are good here. Just focus on those. I mean in Thailand you are not allowed to criticized the King, but there are so many other things in Thailand that we can focus on instead that are wonderful. If we don't like that one point about Thailand and we are so bothered, then don't be in Thailand. Stop looking for faults already. Move on and be speak up about other things. Add to our cause as we all have faith in Shugden. I am grateful that there is this open public forum pro Shugden available at all. This is the only open public forum for Shugden and active. I am happy to read and share views with other Shugdenpas here whatever our opinions of this or that lama.
There is no criticisms here. It is a newspaper clipping. It is asking the CTA why are they so unfair and criticize Shugden people and not look at other issues perhaps worth their attention. Try to see the post for what it is and don't read more into it. No hard feelings and no insult intended to you ok. :)
-
In this forum, any criticism towards any Guru is frowned upon. And yet, many people dare to claim that Dorjechang III is a fake, although he is a Guru. Why it is okay to speak badly about Dorjechang III but not about some other multi-number-gurus? If someone here says that Dalai Lama XIV is a fake, it is not allowed. Why can we criticize some Gurus but not others?
(And yes, this IS a trick question, with many big consequences. And yes, this question IS very important also.)
This is so funny!! You have such a unBuddhist fixated hatred of Dalai Lama XIV. You just find any opportunity to talk about him in anyway always. Anyone who does not share the same hatred is wrong and has 'no' other points of view 'worth' anyone's attention. This forum has so many other topics that is totally interesting, educational and engaging as well as significant. This is very entertaining. One thing for sure, you do have stamina towards your deep hatred of Dalai Lama. Glad you are on 'our' side. Relax. Talk about other things. Your big enemy is impermanent. Forgive. :D
-
Why do you always look for faults on this forum?
I do not look for them, they just appear to me. And I see them, because I see faults everywhere. If I do not see my own faults, how can I eradicate them? I could not. And should I then just close my eyes, and pretend that there are no faults anywhere else? If we want to help each other, we must be able to come to grips with our faults, faulty reasoning, faulty everything - if we take the stand that everything is just fine and great, and pat each others' backs, we do not learn anything. Then we would not be a virtual sangha, but just a mindless fan-club cheering on everyone who shares our fannyness.
Why don't you just participate in threads you like and avoid those you don't?
It seems you liked this thread and my post, as you participated here, yes? But honestly, is the purpose of this forum in your view avoidance of any, well, non-super-hugsy-agreementely-sweety-talk? Is discussion a bad thing? Would Buddha, Nagarjuna, Chandrakirti or Tsongkhapa be welcomed here? There is more to Buddhism than just being evangelical; being critical is part of our tradition as well.
Stop looking for faults already. Move on and be speak up about other things. Add to our cause as we all have faith in Shugden. I am grateful that there is this open public forum pro Shugden available at all.
I like it here too. But you see, while I do practice Shugden just as you, I might have a different cause than you. You individually, or you collectively. You, individually or collectively, might have a "cause", but I might not. Maybe there is not any "our cause", you see. We will never know if it is so, until we can talk. And talk without people like me being told to not to see faults but to just speak about the nice things, being non-critical but just evangelical.
There is no criticisms here. It is a newspaper clipping. It is asking the CTA why are they so unfair and criticize Shugden people and not look at other issues perhaps worth their attention. Try to see the post for what it is and don't read more into it. No hard feelings and no insult intended to you ok. :)
Well uh. The whole "CTA-asking" and the following posts were based on the idea that Dorjechang III is a fake. Implied claim of fakery is just the same as explicit claim of fakery. You know it, so please do not play innocent.
And so, my questions, made in my previous post, remain.
-
Namdrol, it is nice that you are so great a mind reader. Otherwise I would not have noticed my immense sarvastivadic hatred. :o
But seriously yes, I do hate certain things, and one is hypocrisy, the other is double standards. I also hate large spiders. And that one guy when I was 5 years old who laughed when I slipped while trying to skate. And samsara sucks too. It is all so unfair. :'( >:(
Even more seriously, did you really manage to avoid my point in that post? Hint: The point was not about any multi-numbered-guru, whether III or XIV, but about how people treat them.
-
In this forum, any criticism towards any Guru is frowned upon. And yet, many people dare to claim that Dorjechang III is a fake, although he is a Guru. Why it is okay to speak badly about Dorjechang III but not about some other multi-number-gurus? If someone here says that Dalai Lama XIV is a fake, it is not allowed. Why can we criticize some Gurus but not others?
(And yes, this IS a trick question, with many big consequences. And yes, this question IS very important also.)
no no, it is not just about a page in the newspaper, if you can read Chinese you will know what he said, what he did, which according to Lamrim, can totally prove that he is not a qualified Dharma teacher. And his claim be 'living buddha' is totally a lie in fact.
This is not uncommon, as like other body heavily promoted here, a lot of their activities in the Chinese community is filtered out...
-
Namdrol, it is nice that you are so great a mind reader. Otherwise I would not have noticed my immense sarvastivadic hatred. :o
But seriously yes, I do hate certain things, and one is hypocrisy, the other is double standards. I also hate large spiders. And that one guy when I was 5 years old who laughed when I slipped while trying to skate. And samsara sucks too. It is all so unfair. :'( >:(
Even more seriously, did you really manage to avoid my point in that post? Hint: The point was not about any multi-numbered-guru, whether III or XIV, but about how people treat them.
I don't have to be a mind reader. I am just a post reader. And your posts are very clear cut in your hatred of Dalai Lama. Among the things you hate besides spiders, people laughing at you and samsara, you also seem to hate the Dalai Lama tremendously. But that is ok. No one can tell you anything.
-
Well uh. The whole "CTA-asking" and the following posts were based on the idea that Dorjechang III is a fake. Implied claim of fakery is just the same as explicit claim of fakery. You know it, so please do not play innocent.
And so, my questions, made in my previous post, remain.
Dear ZP,
This is not about Dorje Chang. This is about CTA not making any comments about any subject matter that could matter to others within the realm of Tibetan Buddhism. It is about their unfair focus and attacks on Shugden and just Shugden. So kindly do not assume why I posted this up. Dorje Chang's case is very big in Taiwan and the Chinese speaking world. Whether I believe in Dorje Chang as a living Buddha or not is not the issue, it is an example I am citing in regards to the CTA. Please read my post carefully.
Thanks,
Mana
-
I like it here too. But you see, while I do practice Shugden just as you, I might have a different cause than you. You individually, or you collectively. You, individually or collectively, might have a "cause", but I might not. Maybe there is not any "our cause", you see. We will never know if it is so, until we can talk. And talk without people like me being told to not to see faults but to just speak about the nice things, being non-critical but just evangelical.
I am glad you like it here. You might have a different cause? I or we might have a different cause? Certainly our causes are different. You are not being told to just say nice things. But please don't tell me to always say unpleasant things about the Dalai Lama or go along with it. Certainly your label of my 'evangelism' is just your label.
-
This post clearly shows the double standards and unfairness in CTA. Instead of attacking Shugden practitioners... why have they not bothered about phony Lama's that has obviously created unlawful activities. These are what cause Dharma to go down/degenerate and those that are trying hard to spread it to have more obstacles as ppl begin to have doubts.
We are lucky we have our genuine Lamas to guide us but what about those who don't and society in general who are not Buddhist. How will this be reflected as ppl often stereotype looking at one fault and generalizing it on all Buddhist. I think that is probably an even bigger problem then personal issues of likes and dislikes here. Deal with it personally and move on.
Hence what Mana has posted here is a legit question for those in so called "power" (CTA) to act/make a change, to do something positive for the good of all (which will also help them be in good light), for preserving Tibetan Buddhism as they seem to be representing at this moment. This would be "smart" PR for them if they can see it as an opportunity. And Stop causing disharmony between Dharma borthers and sisters in their very own people, creating divisions and suffering for themselves.
Hope the CTA see this post and get it right!
-
The obvious onesidedness of the CTA is glaring. As Mana put it...
The post is not about claims of fakeness...
It is about the selectiveness about whom the CTA will stand up and make noise about regarding Tibetan Buddhism and its people.
I would not make any judgement as to whether he is a fake or not, there is no translations or history for me to base any arguments. So if people would be so kind as to make us more informed, i'd read more about it.
-
I think we're all missing the original point here that Mana was trying to make when he first started this thread. Please don't confuse the irony of his comments with a literal interpretation!
It is not about whetherthe Guru is real or fake or an in-between - we are in no position or ability to judge or determine this. I think the point of the original posting was to note the hypocrisy and inconsistencies of the Tibetan government and authorities - that on the one hand they justify their persecution of Dorje Shugden practitioners by claiming that they are preserving the purity of the BuddhaDharma, but then do nothing to investigate, speak up for or against certain individuals that are associating themselves with the Tibetan schools and lineages and Gurus, but have been questioned and under suspicion by other governments and people. If they were really preserving the purity of their religion, wouldn't they want to defend this Guru if he wasn't doing anything wrong? Or if he WAS doing something wrong, then wouldn't he "deserve" the same persecution as the "wrong, bad, dissident" Dorje Shugden practitioners?
I think that is the point of this thread - not about the authenticity or qualifications or merit of the teacher himself. So let's not make it about what's wrong with the forum or the participants or the people here, or all that!
-
I think we're all missing the original point here that Mana was trying to make when he first started this thread. Please don't confuse the irony of his comments with a literal interpretation!
It is not about whetherthe Guru is real or fake or an in-between - we are in no position or ability to judge or determine this. I think the point of the original posting was to note the hypocrisy and inconsistencies of the Tibetan government and authorities - that on the one hand they justify their persecution of Dorje Shugden practitioners by claiming that they are preserving the purity of the BuddhaDharma, but then do nothing to investigate, speak up for or against certain individuals that are associating themselves with the Tibetan schools and lineages and Gurus, but have been questioned and under suspicion by other governments and people. If they were really preserving the purity of their religion, wouldn't they want to defend this Guru if he wasn't doing anything wrong? Or if he WAS doing something wrong, then wouldn't he "deserve" the same persecution as the "wrong, bad, dissident" Dorje Shugden practitioners?
I think that is the point of this thread - not about the authenticity or qualifications or merit of the teacher himself. So let's not make it about what's wrong with the forum or the participants or the people here, or all that!
Thank you beggar!
With all due respect, I am sorry, I couldn't care less about DorjeChang because he is on a wanted list right now anyway. The point of the matter is the hypocrisy of the CTA and their fixation on suppressing Shugden practitioners in the name of the Dalai Lama and the purity of the Gelug teachings. I also think it is this hypocrisy that we should focus on and not whether we are criticizing Dorje Chang or not or whether he is legitimate or not.
-
This post actually shows how pretentious the CTA is: claiming to be a Buddhist government but they do not seem to care whether or not people are misled by dubious teachers but instead focus on a ban that is so small and that causes so much harm to so many people. If CTA can speak out against Dorje Shugden, they should also speak out against dubious teachers who cause harm to others. But they did not so far and chose to keep quiet. It only means one thing: that the CTA are not concerned with the people as they claim, but they're doing it for their own political purposes.