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About Dorje Shugden => General Discussion => Topic started by: Lineageholder on May 17, 2013, 08:03:38 AM
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http://www.tibetanreview.net/news.php?&id=12179 (http://www.tibetanreview.net/news.php?&id=12179)
Chinese police beat, kill Tibetan monk for possessing Dalai Lama videos
(TibetanReview.net, May16, 2013) Chinese police in Chamdo (Chinese: Changdu) County of Tibet Autonomous Region have beaten a Tibetan Buddhist monk to death in Apr 2013 after they arrested him for possessing two videos of speeches by the Dalai Lama, reported Radio Free Asia (RFA, Washington) May 14. Kardo, who formerly belonged to the county’s Jampaling Monastery, was arrested from his home in neighbouring Dzogang (Zuogong) County on Apr 21. He died on Apr 28 after severe beating in police custody, the report added.
Chamdo police had told the monk’s sister, his only surviving relative, to claim the body.
Kardo was a student monk at Jampaling Monastery for a long time but left it later on reportedly because of the monastery’s worship of a controversial deity called Dorje Shugden which is discouraged by Tibet’s exiled spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama.
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How does the Chinese authorities justify the reason for killing the Tibetan monk? The Chinese police had beaten and then killed the monk to death because the monk possessed the Dalai Lama videos. This is really illogical and outrageous! Furthermore we witness the attack by the authorities against the sangha. Have the Chinese people lost their respect toward the sangha members? Clearly the Chinese police in Chamdo is not in favour of any Tibetan in possession of anything Dalai Lama.
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Gosh, this is really shocking and sad news to be heard!
Although I am not agreeable to the act of the Chinese police, I hope the monk would have a good rebirth after hearing the teaching of HH Dalai Lama.
On a second thought, it shows that the Chinese police in Chamdo are very against HH Dalai Lama. Maybe this is the reason behind that HHDL have the ban on Dorje Shugden in this Dharma degenerated time so that the lineage of Tsongkhapa can still be spread in China since China would be more in favour to things that is against by HHDL.
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Perhaps the monk has said something to provoke the Chinese authorities further just so that he would be beaten to death. I dont think if he had remained quiet in custody that he would be beaten to death so cruelly like this. I wouldnt blame the Chinese authorities too much because the monk should have known better than to provoke the authorities further. But while this is a more neutral article on what happened, this thread has a copy of the spiced up version that is done by phayul: http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=3473.0 (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=3473.0)
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My point was, the monk left his monastery because it was a Shugden practising monastery. By turning his back on Dorje Shugden, perhaps he lost his protection and as a result, had to suffer terribly. Perhaps if he had maintained his faith in Dorje Shugden, none of this would have happened.
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My point was, the monk left his monastery because it was a Shugden practising monastery. By turning his back on Dorje Shugden, perhaps he lost his protection and as a result, had to suffer terribly. Perhaps if he had maintained his faith in Dorje Shugden, none of this would have happened.
Perhaps.. though i do believe that everything that happens to us is a result of our karma so whatever beating he took, it is the result of negative karma. I guess he had guru devotion to Dalai Lama which is what made him stick to his guns regardless of the consequences. Though i of course completely disagree with his animosity to Dorje Shugden, I do respect him for having stuck to his principles. He could have easily just said he would accept Dorje Shugden in order for self-preservation, but he did not. Regardless of whether the Dalai Lama is a Buddha or not, I guess Kardo believes that he is, and that belief alone should bring him to a decent rebirth. I hope so anyway.
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My point was, the monk left his monastery because it was a Shugden practising monastery. By turning his back on Dorje Shugden, perhaps he lost his protection and as a result, had to suffer terribly. Perhaps if he had maintained his faith in Dorje Shugden, none of this would have happened.
Perhaps.. though i do believe that everything that happens to us is a result of our karma so whatever beating he took, it is the result of negative karma. I guess he had guru devotion to Dalai Lama which is what made him stick to his guns regardless of the consequences. Though i of course completely disagree with his animosity to Dorje Shugden, I do respect him for having stuck to his principles. He could have easily just said he would accept Dorje Shugden in order for self-preservation, but he did not. Regardless of whether the Dalai Lama is a Buddha or not, I guess Kardo believes that he is, and that belief alone should bring him to a decent rebirth. I hope so anyway.
That's an aspect that I did not see, that he was too, holding on to his Guru devotion to the Dalai Lama on the Dorje Shugden ban. But what was unfortunate was how he would regard the Dalai Lama whom he has never met before to be more close than him compared to the Lamas that he sees everyday in his monastery and allows the Dalai Lama to overwrite the instructions of his own lamas that he sees everyday. I dont think that this sort of behaviour is something commendable at all.
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"...because of the monastery’s worship of a controversial deity called Dorje Shugden which is discouraged by Tibet’s exiled spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama."
Urgh. Clearly whitewashing the whole issue. Discouraged, my arse. I dont call it discouragement when your kicked out of the monastery for doing the very thing the monasteries tell you you SHOULD do which is to hold on to the practice your teachers gave you.
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My point was, the monk left his monastery because it was a Shugden practising monastery. By turning his back on Dorje Shugden, perhaps he lost his protection and as a result, had to suffer terribly. Perhaps if he had maintained his faith in Dorje Shugden, none of this would have happened.
Perhaps.. though i do believe that everything that happens to us is a result of our karma so whatever beating he took, it is the result of negative karma. I guess he had guru devotion to Dalai Lama which is what made him stick to his guns regardless of the consequences. Though i of course completely disagree with his animosity to Dorje Shugden, I do respect him for having stuck to his principles. He could have easily just said he would accept Dorje Shugden in order for self-preservation, but he did not. Regardless of whether the Dalai Lama is a Buddha or not, I guess Kardo believes that he is, and that belief alone should bring him to a decent rebirth. I hope so anyway.
That's an aspect that I did not see, that he was too, holding on to his Guru devotion to the Dalai Lama on the Dorje Shugden ban. But what was unfortunate was how he would regard the Dalai Lama whom he has never met before to be more close than him compared to the Lamas that he sees everyday in his monastery and allows the Dalai Lama to overwrite the instructions of his own lamas that he sees everyday. I dont think that this sort of behaviour is something commendable at all.
There can't be many of the Dalai Lama's students left in Tibet.
How could a young monk residing in China claim devotion for a lama (the Dalai Lama) that he has never met while showing doubt and breaking his samaya with the teachers that directly take care of him?
I do not understand...
There soon will be, in China, no more of those that can claim to have the Dalai Lama as their guru seriously.
Very soon, with the passing of the Dalai Lama, we will not hear of Tibetan independence much more ever.
Tibet will blossom together with China and with Dorje Shugden as a spiritual ally.
Dorje Shugden is not against the CTA nor the Dalai Lama, neither is he supporting them, because this is mere politic, nothing to do with Dorje Shugden at all, nothing to do with Buddhist practice.
After the slow disappearance of the independence dream of some nostalgic Tibetans, Buddhism will flourish even more in China, free from politic, free from power games, free from controversial issues within the Tibetan community and also the Sangha community.
This is a simple matter of facts and logic.
Perhaps this is how Dorje Shugden assists us in propitiating Buddhism, by freeing it from politics and getting support from the most powerful rising power in the world: China.
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I believe that he broke samaya and that caused him his misfortune unfortunately. Hence, even the Dalai Lama was unable to protect him nor Dorje Shugden. I think just because he rejected his monastery and lineage doesn't mean that Dorje Shugden wouldn't want to protect him.
I remember reading that broken samaya is like blindfold and handcuffs on the Dharma Protector and so they find it difficult to come to our aid. This is actually very sad and tragic. He must have been tortured while in custody and its sad. Many monastics have been tortured by the Chinese and thanks to the Dalai Lama Shugden practitioners and lamas have been largely spared this fate due to the ban. I doubt the Chinese government are really in cahoots with them but more like using them to get back at the Dalai Lama. Anyway, it works out to the advantage of the lineage.
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Even if there are Dalai Lama's students left in Tibet, they would have adopted to the times and also since the ban is actually quite a recent phenomenon, I doubt that the Dalai Lama's existing students in Tibet would receive news of it or believe it because before this the Dalai Lama was so devoted to Dorje Shugden. Clearly, unless CTA has been sending secret updates to the monasteries there and urge them to ban Dorje Shugden, there is no way to know about the ban. The fact that all the monasteries in the area still practice Dorje Shugden strongly speaks a lot on the Dalai Lama's actual influence in Tibet.
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I believe that he broke samaya and that caused him his misfortune unfortunately. Hence, even the Dalai Lama was unable to protect him nor Dorje Shugden. I think just because he rejected his monastery and lineage doesn't mean that Dorje Shugden wouldn't want to protect him.
I remember reading that broken samaya is like blindfold and handcuffs on the Dharma Protector and so they find it difficult to come to our aid. This is actually very sad and tragic. He must have been tortured while in custody and its sad. Many monastics have been tortured by the Chinese and thanks to the Dalai Lama Shugden practitioners and lamas have been largely spared this fate due to the ban. I doubt the Chinese government are really in cahoots with them but more like using them to get back at the Dalai Lama. Anyway, it works out to the advantage of the lineage.
That is a very valid cause for what happened to him. Obviously, to consider the Dalai Lama as his Guru when he has never even met the Dalai Lama in his lifetime and disregard whatever Gurus he may already have in his monastery is a clear act of breaking samaya. How can it be that you can go to a higher ranking lama and suddenly you are allowed to overwrite your Guru's instructions? makes no sense at all to me, but unfortunately, many people still think that way. I dont think its really to our advantage, but the tale has been spun by phayul to make Dorje Shugden look bad.
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This is very sad indeed both for the monk and the police. Both suffer from negative karma, one from killing the other, and the other from involving in politics of the country. If one knows that situation will cause one to be captured and potential death one should not provoke or get involved in the situation. This is because one create the conditions for other to do negative actions, and also one will not have freedom to practise Dharma freely or prevented from practising.
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This is very sad indeed both for the monk and the police. Both suffer from negative karma, one from killing the other, and the other from involving in politics of the country. If one knows that situation will cause one to be captured and potential death one should not provoke or get involved in the situation. This is because one create the conditions for other to do negative actions, and also one will not have freedom to practise Dharma freely or prevented from practising.
the monk who died obviously did some provocation so that the police will kill him and so that there would be news for phayul about Dorje Shugden and the Dalai Lama. I am not and will not be surprised if it is later discovered that the monk has links to the CTA and that he was hired or brainwashed by the CTA to perform this act with promises that he will go to a pureland or that he will be a hero of the Tibetans if he managed to do so. But still, China's police should not be that easily provoked to kill because it would make China look bad in the long run.
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Well, actually I believe that this whole incident has really got nothing to do with Dorje Shugden or the practice and I don't see how this makes Dorje Shugden look bad. Perhaps, Ensapa can explain further why he would say this. I think it makes the Chinese government look bad for its obvious cruel manner in which they torture people in order to get information out of their captives. Torture is a very primitive and authoritarian method to get information out of a captive. I think it was valid that they arrest him but I do not agree to torture and the subsequent murder of the suspect. That would reflect very badly on the Chinese government and would perhaps encourage even more protests.
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Well, actually I believe that this whole incident has really got nothing to do with Dorje Shugden or the practice and I don't see how this makes Dorje Shugden look bad. Perhaps, Ensapa can explain further why he would say this. I think it makes the Chinese government look bad for its obvious cruel manner in which they torture people in order to get information out of their captives. Torture is a very primitive and authoritarian method to get information out of a captive. I think it was valid that they arrest him but I do not agree to torture and the subsequent murder of the suspect. That would reflect very badly on the Chinese government and would perhaps encourage even more protests.
based on the other report, it seems that the videos of the Dalai Lama that was found on the monk were of the Dalai Lama denouncing Dorje Shugden. The interesting thing here is that how did the CTA know? Obviously with the other report, it is pretty clear that the CTA set everything up. This 'cleaned up' version does not have it. One thing for sure, tthis cleaned uo version makes the Chinese look bad for killing someone who has already been arrested, something that they should not have done and they should have exercised more restraint, especially when it comes to human life.
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It is just not right for anyone to kill any Sangha member. It is not only morally wrong, but it is also very bad to be killing a Sangha.
Even if the monk has posted positive things about the Dalai Lama, it is the choice of the monk. The Chinese do not have any rights to be controlling what the monk chooses to believe. Although it is in fact wrong for the monk to be promoting the Dalai Lama in China.
I believe that there is such karmic effects on the monk is because of the negative karma he has accumulated by leaving his monastery when he know that they practice Dorje Shugden.
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It is totally wrong and cruel to inflict harm on another human being regardless of position, color or creed. While the Chinese police were wrong in their action, the same is said of the CTA in supporting the ban on Dorje Shugden and taking matters into their own hands by furthering the ban via physical and verbal abuse to Dorje Shugden's practitioners. All this happening within the Buddhist community, which Lord Buddha taught love and compassion, forgiveness, patience and tolerance, etc. We are still living in the Dark Ages.
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In China, it is a serious offence if one is found possessing the Dalai Lama's picture, video or book as these materials are of sentimental value and heartaches to the Tibetans would lead to create uprisings and riots against the Chinese government. Hence the Chinese government implements strict rule to control the Tibetans by prosecuting them if found of these materials.
Lord Dorje Shugden's protection shines on everyone but if you reject the Lord, you are rejecting protection. Likewise the monk had rejected Lord Dorje Shugden and hence protection.
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Chengdu - Tibetan man arrested for possesion of Dalai Lama's speech
September 25: Reports have emerged that a Tibetan man has been detained by the Chinese authorities in Chengdu, capital of Sichuan province, in May last year for alleged possession of Dalai Lama's speech.
A native of Welpen township in Machu County, Lobsang Namgyal, 26, was arrested from a market in Chengdu city where he was doing a part-time job, said Lhamo Kyab, a former political prisoner living here. “However after 9 months of his disappearance, Chinese authorities informed his family members about his detention in Chengdu city,” Kyab added.
Lobsang’s family was told that he was arrested for printing “politically sensitive documents” and being in possession of speeches by the exiled Tibetan leader His Holiness the Dalai Lama, according to Kyab.
Lobsang’s family members were told that Lobsang had committed a “serious crime” and were barred by Chinese authorities to provide him food and clothes in the detention centre.
In 2008, Lobsang was arrested with many other Tibetans for staging a peaceful protest in Machu County but was released later.
In 2011, after completion of his schooling, Lobsang had written a book titled Tsol (search)
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I think that it's very unfair for a person or in this case, a monk who wants to practise what he wants to because he has great faith in Dorje Shugden getting beaten up. I mean how could you beat up a sangha? OMG...people are so mean, evil and malicious.