Oh boy oh boy oh boy

[yontenjamyang]

We can speculate all we want and everything is a possibility. If the Great 14th wants to he can achieve anything for the sake of all sentient beings. He can even get another buddha in disguise to murder him. Then no karma will be generated by the assassin.  I do think the message is:

1) He will be the last DL.
2) China is the "bad guy". Bad guys do what I say you should not. Good guys do not practice DS. Bad guys do. So China practice DS.

So brace for more drama. The rise of DS!

[lotus1]

This is rather ridiculous to know we can kill someone by putting poison on hair and scarf.  Furthermore, the one that they tried to kill is HH Dalai Lama, an emanation of Chenrezig, a Buddha! Buddhas do not have the Karma to be killed unless they allow it for a bigger picture.

I found a contradictory fact too. HHDL said he will at least live until the age of 90 in a recent video in April 2012. http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=1912.msg26519#msg26519
So, which is real?

I think HHDL is trying to emphasis that he will be last Dalai Lama and warn his students that they better work hard and do their practice before it is too late. This will be a skillful means that is used by DDHL to train his students. 

[Ensapa]

Yes, it is rather odd for HHDL to say he would live to 90 the month before and now say that there are plans to kill him by China, and by khatas, poison and women, no less. Perhaps there is something brewing in the CTA that CTA does not want us to know or see and it would somewhat be a shameful thing that is causing HHDL to be wrathful and frustrated at them, perhaps it is something they are not doing...

China is after all a dragon. Dragons are powerful and quick to react but they are not very smart as they can be easily manipulated by their enemies to do certain things, like what HHDL is doing to promote Dorje Shugden to the people in China and HHDL is using their blindness to the avantage of the Dharma. Perhaps, China can really benefit from Dorje Shugden and this is HHDL's way of bringing the practice to them.

If China wanted to assassinate HHDL, they would have many, many chances over the years. Why only choose this time? isnt it rather odd to wait for over 50 years to try and assassinate HHDL? Also, China does not get much from the assassination of HHDL and it is definitely something that they are not keen to do since HHDL is a public figure and it will only result in more negative publicity.

CTA really has no hope of taking over Tibet, mainly because they already fail to take care of Dharamsala and improve its conditions...how can they do so for Tibet? I dont see the connection, and neither will China respect them as a government because they are not a government. Until they do something to prove that they are like lifting the ban to prove that there is separation of church and state, China will not listen.

[negra orquida]

If we put this:

The Dalai Lama says reports indicate that Chinese agents have trained Tibetan women for a mission to murder him, the Telegraph reports.

and this:

How can His Holiness be poisoned by touch, but the Tibetan women who have the poison on their scarf or in their hair not be poisoned too?

together..  me thinks it is a "secret" message to say that HHDL's life will be shortened due to the (three?) poisons of the Tibetan people (how come the Tibetan women would become traitors and agree to be trained by the Chinese to poison HHDL?), and the Chinese of course.. definitely the collective negative karma of at least Chinese and Tibetans may cause the life of HHDL to be shorter than otherwise. If HHDL keeps saying that he will be the last Dalai Lama, I'm guessing it means that there is not point to come back as a Dalai Lama and continue his works if no one is going to change themselves to improve the current situation of Tibet and China? Probably he is planning to come back in a different form or in some other country where he can work more effectively.

[Ratna Shugden]

Rinpoches laying their hands on the heads of their disciples & faithfuls is an expression of their compassion to them. It's a sign of approval. It's also a form of encouragement to them. It's also one of the many means used by Rinpoches to grant blessings to their disciples & faithfuls. It's a sacred act.

Never have I in my whole life heard of this being used as a means of assassination.

It's a very malicious of the individual to conceive this idea. Such an idea may be adopted by others in future should another Rinpoche become the target of assassination.

. Irregardless of whether this is true & the outcome of this attempt on the Dalai Lama, one thing for sure is, this individual has left a negative imprint on the minds of all sentient beings who heard this news,  including myself, through the introduction of such a sadistic idea to our minds. Everyone who is reading this post should take act to purify his/her mind of this, so that this imprint will not ripen in the future.

Out of security concern, it's possible that the Dalai Lama will not be laying his hands on faithfuls for the time being, it will be sad for them.

When security becomes a concern, disciples & faithfuls wishing for the safety & longeivity of their Rinpoches, and those directly involved in their security, should regard their Rinpoches as ordinary human beings, so that they will be careful in all matters & not take things for granted. This is not an act of disrespect, because only by thinking in this way will a proper job be done.

I believe this rumour has also delayed the decision to lift the ban on Dorje Shugden.

If this tragedy really take place, pro-Dorje Shugden community will definitely become one of the prime suspects.

As for the Dalai Lama's statements in recent times regarding his longevity & succession, for onlookers like us, it's better to see this as an expression of his undying compassion for all sentient beings, this cultivates a virtuous thought in our minds rather than seeing it as a means to gain sympathy for political motives, which would be a view possibly held by the Dalai Lama's political opponents, we do not need to cultivate such non-virtuous thought in our mind like them, as we are not directly involved in the political struggle.

[Ensapa]

Rinpoches laying their hands on the heads of their disciples & faithfuls is an expression of their compassion to them. It's a sign of approval. It's also a form of encouragement to them. It's also one of the many means used by Rinpoches to grant blessings to their disciples & faithfuls. It's a sacred act.

Never have I in my whole life heard of this being used as a means of assassination.

It's a very malicious of the individual to conceive this idea. Such an idea may be adopted by others in future should another Rinpoche become the target of assassination.

. Irregardless of whether this is true & the outcome of this attempt on the Dalai Lama, one thing for sure is, this individual has left a negative imprint on the minds of all sentient beings who heard this news,  including myself, through the introduction of such a sadistic idea to our minds. Everyone who is reading this post should take act to purify his/her mind of this, so that this imprint will not ripen in the future.

Out of security concern, it's possible that the Dalai Lama will not be laying his hands on faithfuls for the time being, it will be sad for them.

When security becomes a concern, disciples & faithfuls wishing for the safety & longeivity of their Rinpoches, and those directly involved in their security, should regard their Rinpoches as ordinary human beings, so that they will be careful in all matters & not take things for granted. This is not an act of disrespect, because only by thinking in this way will a proper job be done.

I believe this rumour has also delayed the decision to lift the ban on Dorje Shugden.

If this tragedy really take place, pro-Dorje Shugden community will definitely become one of the prime suspects.

As for the Dalai Lama's statements in recent times regarding his longevity & succession, for onlookers like us, it's better to see this as an expression of his undying compassion for all sentient beings, this cultivates a virtuous thought in our minds rather than seeing it as a means to gain sympathy for political motives, which would be a view possibly held by the Dalai Lama's political opponents, we do not need to cultivate such non-virtuous thought in our mind like them, as we are not directly involved in the political struggle.

There is also another mystery in this element, which is if the women used poisoned khatas and hair to assassinate HHDL, wouldnt it cause harm to themselves first before it even reaches His Holiness the Dalai Lama? Why choose to assassinate HHDL in that way when there could be snipers, poison in his food, bribing the ladrang staff etc...because logically this rumor does not make sense.

I have a feeling that the same person who spread this rumor was also the same person who championed the ban for whatever reason...he or she has a very malicious nature like what Ratna Shugden had said and the intention of such a rumor is to delay the lifting of the ban and to create fear, chaos and misunderstandings for the people of Tibet regarding the Dalai Lama.

To me, it didint really made any impressions of my mind because it is something that is logically not viable as you will need to hold the khata with your bare hands for a period of time before it can be offered to HHDL and HHDL will have to place it back around your neck anyway so the assassin will die instead. In any case, it does sound like a very malicious rumor to block HHDL from blessing people.

Equally interesting is the HHDL announcing this when he could have kept quiet and pretend nothing happened and continue life as it would. Perhaps, this is another sign that HHDL would like to reduce his activities more, or that the person who started this rumor is threatening HHDL in some sort of way or form that causes HHDL to act in this way? Perhaps in time this person will be revealed..

[DharmaDefender]

You guys might be interested to note that the Italian media has picked up on this article. My Google Alerts picked this off the Internet... anyone read Italian?

http://www.ilgiornale.it/esteri/donne_addestrate_uccidere_dalai_lama/14-05-2012/articolo-id=587950-page=0-comments=1

The online translator churns out the following:

I am not so naive, in Beijing. But it was not difficult for the Indian authorities, to trace the masterminds of a plot which was officially attributed to the followers of Dorje Shugden monaco: a sect of fundamentalist than four centuries old in the picture of the Dalai Lama, exiled from the late fifties, Dharamsala, northern India, he sees his enemy. The rust among the followers of the fourteenth Dalai Lama and the extremist sect within which the plot was hatched in January discovered is centuries old. But only in 1996 the Nobel Prize Tenzin Gyatso forbade the worship of Shugden monaco, described as a sort of Lucifer, a little 'angel and a little' devil.

So its a pretty shite translation but clear enough for our purposes. Its interesting to note the distinction between the USA Today article that I originally posted and this Telegraph one (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/tibet/9261729/Dalai-Lama-reveals-warning-of-Chinese-plot-to-kill-him.html), and this Italian one where His Holiness outright blames Dorje Shugden practitioners.

So the British and Americans hint that it may be the Chinese, and the Italians are happy to hint it may be the Chinese... or Dorje Shugden practitioners. Wonder what led the Italians to include that false accusation as fact... so much for innocent until proven guilty.

[Aurore]

HHDL is making this assassination sound as ridiculous as how practicing DS can harm his life. To me he's reinforcing the fact that he can indeed make ridiculous statements so that people will start to think further for themselves. Being the last Dalai Lama also means that there is no need for the ban to continue after His Holiness passes on because there will be no more Dalai Lamas in future for DS practice to shorten Dalai Lama's life.

What other excuses can there be for banning the practice of DS? If CTA wants to use the reason that DS practitioners are chinese spies, what difference does it make now seeing that Tibetans never had a country. Quotes Lobsang Sangye.

[beggar]

I do wonder how, on a larger scale of things, that close and overt association between Chinese assassination attempts and Shugden practitioners is not deliberate?

The Dalai Lama's tone about Shugden has changed considerably in recent months, with him saying in Bodhgaya earlier this year that it is really "up to us to decide if we wish to take refuge with him or with Shugden" (not an exact quotation, but of the same essence). Then, suddenly, these kinds of accusations heat up again - implications of Shugden involvement in deathly acts against the Dalai Lama. It sounds like an old medieval feud!

Would the Dalai Lama really not be able to stave off mere political attacks? After all the countless stories we have heard of how Lamas were able to evade the Chinese invaders in the 1950s and 60s, or simply left their bodies before they could be reached and attacked - do we still believe these simplistic claims that the Dalai Lama could be just left wide open to attacks like this?

And surely, if the Chinese were going to get him, wouldn't they have done so already? Dharmasala is not exactly the strongest of forts. And really, what evidence is there?

All seems to me to be pretty strategically planned from the side of the Dalai, to fan the flames again as the embers are dying out. Get 'em excited again, give Dorje Shugden a bit of airtime so we don't forget him on the global scene. ALL publicity is good publicity, after all.....

[Ensapa]

HHDL is making this assassination sound as ridiculous as how practicing DS can harm his life. To me he's reinforcing the fact that he can indeed make ridiculous statements so that people will start to think further for themselves. Being the last Dalai Lama also means that there is no need for the ban to continue after His Holiness passes on because there will be no more Dalai Lamas in future for DS practice to shorten Dalai Lama's life.

What other excuses can there be for banning the practice of DS? If CTA wants to use the reason that DS practitioners are chinese spies, what difference does it make now seeing that Tibetans never had a country. Quotes Lobsang Sangye.

I dont know if it was just me who feels that HHDL will often make anti Dorje Shugden statements, only to pair it with a teaching to ask people to examine the teachings before believing them. I have observed HHDL doing this many times in many talks, and especially when he talks about the Dorje Shugden issue. You may have a very valid point there that the HHDL really wants people to think.

Why else would an enlightened master give people ridiculous and misleading statements, unless he wants them to think and really find out for themselves, or make them realize that making ridiculous statements can have results that are not always pleasant. It is funny that the Tibetans does not seem to be aware that the chinese are the world's most populous nation in addition to being one of the worlds superpower.

China has everything they need to wipe Dharamsala off the map anytime they need to, but they dont really have a reason to do that unless the CTA and their not so smart citizens push China's buttons further and at the end make things worse for the people who are currently in Tibet proper. Directly and indirectly this will ultimately result in even more people practicing Dorje Shugden than before.

I must say, CTA is doing a wonderful job of spreading Dorje Shugden to the chinese. I know they are very passionate about getting Tibet back, but to go head on against one of the most powerful nations on earth is pretty much a no brainer that will result in more causalities, needless deaths and a complete waste of energy while generating more negative circumstances for themselves.

[pgdharma]

Can the Dalai Lama, who is a Buddha, has the karma to be harm unless he chose to allow harm to befall onto him for a good cause? If the Chinese want to kill the Dalai Lama, why wait till now when he is 76 years old? If the women with poisoned scarf or hair can harm Dalai Lama, it shows that the poison is very strong and effective, wouldn't it  also harm the Tibetan women? Why not just ask Dorje Shgden to kill the Dalai Lama since Dorje Shugden is such an evil spirit? ILLOGICAL

The Dalai Lama kept reiterating that he will most likely be the last Dalai Lama.  Maybe he prefers to take rebirth and appear in other forms and play other roles but not as the Dalai Lama. Then  there is no more excuse to ban Dorje Shugden practice as this practice will harm the Dalai Lama's life and there's no more Dalai Lama to be harmed.

[Ensapa]

Can the Dalai Lama, who is a Buddha, has the karma to be harm unless he chose to allow harm to befall onto him for a good cause? If the Chinese want to kill the Dalai Lama, why wait till now when he is 76 years old? If the women with poisoned scarf or hair can harm Dalai Lama, it shows that the poison is very strong and effective, wouldn't it  also harm the Tibetan women? Why not just ask Dorje Shgden to kill the Dalai Lama since Dorje Shugden is such an evil spirit? ILLOGICAL

The Dalai Lama kept reiterating that he will most likely be the last Dalai Lama.  Maybe he prefers to take rebirth and appear in other forms and play other roles but not as the Dalai Lama. Then  there is no more excuse to ban Dorje Shugden practice as this practice will harm the Dalai Lama's life and there's no more Dalai Lama to be harmed.

At this point it is pretty clear that the Dalai Lama started the ban against his will and he is not exactly happy with having to declare the ban. Him talking so much about dying means that people complying to the ban is not the main issue here, but something else.  What would Avalokiteshvara want from his followers? I think the answer here is obvious: To actually practice and apply the Dharma.

The ban will be lifted before the Dalai Lama passes on to clear light and perhaps, assume another role where he can reach out to an equal amount of beings, or maybe not even manifest to human beings of this world system anymore due to the amount of negative karma that that his followers commit which they claim as part of his instructions to them when its only them distorting his words.

Perhaps, him talking about his death is a warning of sorts and a wake up call for his disciples to actually not break their samaya to their own teachers, or to him. It is one thing to not practice Dorje Shugden, but it's another to criticize, isolate and demean people who do the practice as this was not part of the Dalai Lama's original instructions when he told his followers to not practice.

What happens if we add in additional lines into our Guru's instructions and end up hurting many people as a result and then claim that it was HHDL's instructions when it cannot be found in any of his teachings where he explicitly said to attack Dorje Shugden practitioners. The CTA did just that and look where they are now. Unfortunately this mentality has spread to the west...

[Dondrup Shugden]

When the Dalai Lama was 76 years old, he claimed that the Chinese Government had planned to kill him in the same manner that praying to Dorje Shugden would shorten His life.

Last Sunday, the Dalai Lama celebrated his 80th birthday.  Another contradiction to the controversy.

I believe the Chinese Government is very efficient or that being a Buddha, the Dalai Lama has no karma to be murdered.

Why then the unrealistic accusations?  I have revived this post for your logical minds. Oh boy oh boy oh boy.