CTA, no wonder you are downgraded

[Ensapa]

Its a matter of priorities Ensapa. Once they get their heads out of their arses theyll realise no one gives a toss about Dorje Shugden, and the only reason anyone gave a toss is because THEY made such a big fuss (wallies).

Honestly if theyd just shut up about it after the Dalai Lama banned the practice and had just gone about it quietly, whod have ever lifted their eyes away from the atroicities being committed everywhere else in the world? I have to say though, the CTA are usually pretty rubbish about remaining committed to anything they do. In that light their twisted commitment to this ban is both admirable and stupid!

if only they were this committed to building their teeny weeny community up the way they are committed to the ban, they wouldnt have been downgraded. Or maybe HHDL is trying to train them to be more committed...if they can enforce the ban, it might also mean that they can create a proper sewerage system for their tiny village, at long last and talk about real issues and how to solve them like an actual government would. Then maybe they will get their title back, and when their village becomes a city, maaaybe, just maaaaybe they will get tibet back. But china is doing a better job than them...how?

[Lineageholder]

Good job with seeking international support...but how about starting by establishing more humane policies such as allowing religious freedom for exiled tibetans in India, a land where the government of India allows tibetans to freely practice.

Isn't it a shame that India allows Tibetans to practice as they wish, but Tibetans themselves turn against their own?

With that said, I am still keeping my hopes up high for Lobsang Sangay to turn things around. It's not easy to undo hundreds of years of autocratic rulership under the Dalai Lamas.

No one can, or will, go against the Dalai Lama's edicts.

It's as simple as that - there's no hope to restore religious freedom unless the Dalai Lama changes his stance, therefore although the Dalai Lama has 'retired' he's still controlling things from the background.

[beggar]

No one can, or will, go against the Dalai Lama's edicts.

It's as simple as that - there's no hope to restore religious freedom unless the Dalai Lama changes his stance, therefore although the Dalai Lama has 'retired' he's still controlling things from the background.

And that is precisely what is most frightening for the CTA... After so many years and centuries of dependency on the Dalai Lama, what will they do when he passes away eventually? HHDL has even hinted that there may not be any incarnation after this one. So what will they do? Who will make the decisions now? And how will previous edicts such as the ban be upheld or maintained?

Perhaps it will be a good thing (not that I wish for the Dalai Lama's passing). It could finally push the CTA out to develop some guts and move forward into the 21st century, to adopt truly secular and progressive policies that will help their own people, instead of focusing on witchhunts and confusing secular progress with old (not necessarily relevant) religious traditions.

[Barzin]

it angers me a lot when i read about CTA's movement, it's silly, irresponsible, irrelevant and immature. Isn't the Government suppose to take care of the citizen's welfare?  Since when religion and politics mix?  Just sending letters, talking about it and ban certain deities is a job of a white house?  Totally absurd. 

If it's like what beggar had said, to push CTA to buck up moving into the 21st century then i would said they failed miserably because look at the damage they caused among their own people, not to even mention the sangha community and the effect it had in Buddhism alone and politic.  They are still sending letters to people to justify?  The move is simply immature and childish.  If they are more in control, perhaps people might listen to them.  I am sorry to say that people had lost respect for them.

[Lineageholder]

Perhaps it will be a good thing (not that I wish for the Dalai Lama's passing). It could finally push the CTA out to develop some guts and move forward into the 21st century, to adopt truly secular and progressive policies that will help their own people, instead of focusing on witchhunts and confusing secular progress with old (not necessarily relevant) religious traditions.

I think if the Dalai Lama passes away without changing his stance, it will be written in stone forevermore.

Just look at the 5th Dalai Lama's writings.  Even though he later changed his mind about Dorje Shugden, wrote a praise, created Trode Khangsar, made a statue, etc, it's his formal writings that everyone is clinging to as evidence that Dorje Shugden is an evil spirit of someone who broke their moral discipline, etc, etc.  The 14th Dalai Lama says that he has to follow what the fifth and thirteenth Dalai Lamas said about Dorje Shugden - that's actually about the extent of his 'extensive research' that justifies his position.

I sincerely hope he does change his mind before his passing, but I feel that he's stuck in a groove now and no amount of intercession from others is going to do it, therefore I'm not optimistic that the ban will be reversed by the CTA - whatever the Dalai Lama says is gospel.

[DharmaDefender]

I think if the Dalai Lama passes away without changing his stance, it will be written in stone forevermore.

Just look at the 5th Dalai Lama's writings.  Even though he later changed his mind about Dorje Shugden, wrote a praise, created Trode Khangsar, made a statue, etc, it's his formal writings that everyone is clinging to as evidence that Dorje Shugden is an evil spirit of someone who broke their moral discipline, etc, etc.  The 14th Dalai Lama says that he has to follow what the fifth and thirteenth Dalai Lamas said about Dorje Shugden - that's actually about the extent of his 'extensive research' that justifies his position.

I sincerely hope he does change his mind before his passing, but I feel that he's stuck in a groove now and no amount of intercession from others is going to do it, therefore I'm not optimistic that the ban will be reversed by the CTA - whatever the Dalai Lama says is gospel.

Im inclined to agree with you as far as your thoughts on the Dalai Lama not reversing the ban. I think its a bit late now given how far the bans gone, how many walls have gone up, posters have been stuck up etc.

But I do think that the ban will be reversed by the CTA because its a different time to the 5th Dalai Lamas. They havent got the balls to do anything without the Dalai Lamas backing. Once His Holiness passes away and the US / EU show a little more displeasure at the human rights violation that is the ban, the CTA will have no choice but to back down. At the moment theyre riding on the Dalai Lamas PR machine but once hes gone, they have nothing to fall back on.

Anyway doesnt matter. I think the Tibetan community will fade into obscurity once the Dalai Lama passes, and their issues will become non-issues until eventually even they themselves cant be bovvered to impose the ban (too much effort). Theres only so much shouting a nationless people can do once they lose the donation-generating support of His Holiness.

[Ensapa]

Im inclined to agree with you as far as your thoughts on the Dalai Lama not reversing the ban. I think its a bit late now given how far the bans gone, how many walls have gone up, posters have been stuck up etc.

But I do think that the ban will be reversed by the CTA because its a different time to the 5th Dalai Lamas. They havent got the balls to do anything without the Dalai Lamas backing. Once His Holiness passes away and the US / EU show a little more displeasure at the human rights violation that is the ban, the CTA will have no choice but to back down. At the moment theyre riding on the Dalai Lamas PR machine but once hes gone, they have nothing to fall back on.

Anyway doesnt matter. I think the Tibetan community will fade into obscurity once the Dalai Lama passes, and their issues will become non-issues until eventually even they themselves cant be bovvered to impose the ban (too much effort). Theres only so much shouting a nationless people can do once they lose the donation-generating support of His Holiness.

The approach to Dorje Shugden has been reversed before during the 5th Dalai Lama's time, and the ban on the Jonang School has also been reversed within this lifetime, and the Sharmapa line of incarnations have also been unbanned by the Dalai Lama, so I am pretty positive that no matter how deep the ban has gone into, it can be reversed. When it is reversed, i think many people will be very confused of what to make of the ban and how should they approach the whole thing. The whole ban thing is not a permanent one. For those who think that it is, they will be in for a very big surprise.

[Gabby Potter]

I can't believe that I am saying this, I am truly sorry but how ignorant can these people be man? I mean come on!... They are always making sure people don't practise Dorje Shugden and would always make sure that they themselves DO SOMETHING or whatever it takes to accomplish that, what they never realised is that they are going after nothing. Firstly, their information about Lord Dorje Shugden is wrong, so I don't see if there's anything else to argue with them because I doubt that they have the knowledge on who He truly IS. So what's with all these CTAs? What's the point???!!!