Author Topic: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner  (Read 6057 times)

WisdomBeing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2096
    • Add me to your facebook!
Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« on: January 25, 2013, 10:19:50 AM »
Just when Tai Situpa thought that his legal woes were over when the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley was exonerated from the currency laundering charge, he is under the magnifying glass again. I thought this might be of interest to our forum participants because of the recent articles on the dual standards the CTA has on the Karmapa issue and Shugden practitioners.

Tai Situpa has so much secular controversy but there is no action against him from the CTA yet Dorje Shugden practitioners are constantly being vilified just for their religious practice??

it doesn't make sense.


Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-news/HimachalPradesh/Karmapa-s-mentor-under-land-law-scanner/Article1-999286.aspx

Gaurav Bisht and Naresh Kumar, Hindustan Times
Shimla/Dharamsala, January 24, 2013

Even as the Himachal government adopted a neutral stance on the cash haul from the monastery of 17th Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje, now questions are being raised over land owned by the Palpung Munishahan Dharma Chakra Trust, which is helmed by a close aide of Tai Situpa Pema Sonyo Nyingche, Dorje's mentor. The land has been used for purposes other than permitted.

Since the law forbids non-Himachali to purchase land in state, the trust, headed by Ani Sewa Devi, had sought permission in 2001 to buy 38 acres at Battu village in Kangra's Baijnath sub-division for an old age home, eye hospital and school. The secretary, revenue department, granted the permission vide a letter dated January 27, 2003, under section 118 of the HP Tenancy and Land Reforms Act 1972. The letter, a copy of which is with HT, clearly mentioned that the land has to be used strictly for purposes mentioned while seeking permission.

But instead of a hospital and school, the trust raised a building that houses the International Buddhist Institute for religious studies. While the trust complied with the condition that the land has to be bought within 180 days of the permission, the government had also made it clear that the land should be used within two years from date of permission. And in case the land was used for purposes other than mentioned in the permission, it was to be taken over by the government.

When contacted, Lama Tsewang Dakpa, general Secretary of the Palpung Congregation in Battu village, admitted that work had progressed on a building for housing the international centre for Buddhist studies. Asked why the hospital and old age home had not been built, he said, "We do not have sufficient funds."   

Additional district magistrate of Kangra, DK Rattan said the administration was not aware about the violations. "We will have to probe the matter," he told HT.

Who is Tai Situpa?

*The 12th Tai Situpa, Pema Donyo Nyingche Wangpo led the search part of religious scholars who discovered the 17th Karmapa, Ogyen Trinley Dorje. The Karmapa is the head of the Karma Kagyu, one of the four main schools of Tibetan Buddhism

*Born in 1954 in a family of farmers in Tibet, Pema Donyo was recognised as the Tai Situpa by the 16th Karmapa, Rigpe Dorje. At the age of six, Pema Donyo left Tibet for Bhutan, where King Jigme Dorji Wangchuk had been a disciple of the 11th Tai Situpa. Later he studied at Rumtek Monastery in Sikkim

*In 1975, a disciple of the 12th Tai Situpa donated a chunk of land at Battu village in Kangra (HP), where he started the Palpung Sherabling that became his seat. The under-scanner 38-acre chunk in the same village was bought in 2003.

Kate Walker - a wannabe wisdom Being

vajratruth

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 706
Re: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2013, 11:36:47 AM »
Tai Situpa started making connections with Chinese government in the early 1980's and has built up a considerable network since then. At a time when  Sino-Tibetan talks were breaking down, Tai Situpa was making successful forays into China and established himself for a time as the Buddhist protector of Tibet with the blessing of the Chinese government. However, his success in China is looked upon suspiciously by the Indian authorities who keep a close watch on him and have charged Tai Situpa Rinpoche on a number of occasions, for various activities the Indian deemed to be illegal.

India has a particular interest in Tai Situpa's maneuverings because of his role in the Karmapa issue. Tai Situpa is the mentor of Karmapa Ogyen Trinley whom the Chinese and the Dalai Lama jointly recognized as the 17th Karmapa. However, the Indian courts found in favor of Ogyen Trinley's challenger for the Karmapa seat, that is Thaye Dorje who was discovered and enthroned by the senior regent of the Karma Kagyu's, Shamar Rinpoche. China's interest in the Karmapa is two-fold i.e (i) to get a grip over a large segment of the Tibetan community via the spiritual influence of the new Karmapa and (ii) to have a Chinese approved Karmapa occupy the Rumtek seat which is in Sikkim, whose merger with India, China has refused to acknowledge.

India on the other hand, is trying to stop pro-Chinese Tibetan lamas from gaining a foothold in positions of influence within the exiled Tibetan community as well as in Sikkim which it regards as strategic in its border issues with China. It is quite surprising that the CTA would go against its host, India and by supporting Tai Situpa Rinpoche's candidate as the 17th Karmapa, the CTA is essentially inferring that Shamar Rinpoche and his candidate, Thaye Dorje are impostors. CTA is also saying that the Indian courts have made a mistake.

Given that the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley may succeed the Dalai Lama as the absolute head of Tibetan Buddhism, I am quite shocked that the CTA has not handled this matter more delicately and with greater wisdom. For all its anti-China rhetoric, when it comes down to the crunch the CTA supported a Chinese-recognized Karmapa. So much for Shugden worshippers being Chinese spies.

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2013, 03:09:11 AM »
It strikes me that Tai Situpa has been riddled with problems and troubles from the Indian government, and most of them has something to do with him being a spy...but about this article, it seems to be him deceiving the government of India and I dont think so governments like to be deceived in this way. He has also been quite 'against' the Sharmapa for quite sometime now. This article does not paint the Tai Situpa in a good light at all, it makes him look like he is someone who deceived the government. Will the CTA kick in and help Tai Situpa clear his name like the last time? When the Tai Situpa was banned from india during 1994-1998, It was the Dalai Lama/CTA's intervention that allowed his return to India. How would Tai Situpa get out of this now?

diamond girl

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 282
Re: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2013, 01:37:44 PM »
What is wrong with the religious leaders??? Are they in religion to make the world a better place benefiting all beings or are they in politics???? This is somewhat disgusting if you ask me.... And both candidates for the 17th Karmapa seat have suffered being puppets since young. May I ask where is the compassion?

Tai Situpa's candidate, Ogyen Trinley Dorje, is also apparently the successor to HHDL? But they are from different sects?? Again, will this be political move since it is speculated that Chinese government will probably plant their puppet for HHDL seat after the current one passes, like how they did so with the Panchen Lama. AND Ogyen Trinley Dorje is approved by China. Is this messy or what???
Possible Successor to the Dalai Lama Speaks]
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KS4J1dsRrtc#]Possible Successor to the Dalai Lama Speaks
[/url]

Here is another question: what happens to the other Karmapa which the Indian government has ruled to be the right one? So India has one and China has one? Do they all get to go to HHDL's teachings and talks? Yes they do... Why? How come they can? And DS practitioners cannot? Aren't the Shamapa sect against the HHDL, they should be banned and discriminated too?

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2013, 04:33:34 AM »
What is wrong with the religious leaders??? Are they in religion to make the world a better place benefiting all beings or are they in politics???? This is somewhat disgusting if you ask me.... And both candidates for the 17th Karmapa seat have suffered being puppets since young. May I ask where is the compassion?

Tai Situpa's candidate, Ogyen Trinley Dorje, is also apparently the successor to HHDL? But they are from different sects?? Again, will this be political move since it is speculated that Chinese government will probably plant their puppet for HHDL seat after the current one passes, like how they did so with the Panchen Lama. AND Ogyen Trinley Dorje is approved by China. Is this messy or what???
Possible Successor to the Dalai Lama Speaks]
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KS4J1dsRrtc#]Possible Successor to the Dalai Lama Speaks
[/url]

Here is another question: what happens to the other Karmapa which the Indian government has ruled to be the right one? So India has one and China has one? Do they all get to go to HHDL's teachings and talks? Yes they do... Why? How come they can? And DS practitioners cannot? Aren't the Shamapa sect against the HHDL, they should be banned and discriminated too?


Perhaps, the Dalai Lama recognized Orgyen Trinley as the karmapa so that he can keep things in check in case the chinese decide to crown their own Dalai Lama in the wake of the current HHDL's passing. Obviously HHDL does not mind being recognized by the Chinese government in his next life but his followers do mind so in that light, he has chosen a workaround this by endorsing a karmapa candidate. Maybe the endorsed one would be the one responsible of quieting the CTA while the other karmapa will carry out the deeds of the karmapas that the previous karmapas have been doing all along.  I dont think the Sharmapa is against HHDL but he is not happy with HHDL's intervention of the whole issue.

Big Uncle

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1995
Re: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2013, 04:24:18 AM »
Ooohh this is a dangerous news. I think the committee that's in charge of this project didn't really want to build the hospital and old age home. They had their own agenda all along and they submitted plans that were false in order to get the building permits. I am sorry but I think they did it because India has a grand reputation for being corrupt. They thought if the authorities found out, they would just bribed them and all would be hunky-dory. But they were wrong, they were caught under bad circumstances as the Indian government is under strong suspicions of the Karmapa.

I wouldn't blame Tai Situ's followers or even Tai Situpa on this one. Unlike the Sharmapa, Tai Situpa does not seem to have much power in the upper echelons of the Indian government. Thus, they will encounter such problems from time to time. Very often, Tai Situpa has had difficulty getting his travel visas approved and he has all manner of governmental problems and obstacles. He should work on building relations with the Indian government or whatever he plans to do will have tremendous obstacles.

I don't think the CTA gives 2 hoots about Tai Situpa and the problem about comparing that and the Dorje Shugden ban. CTA would not want to create an uproar about sectarian issues because that's their trump card. The Dorje Shugden ban was instituted within the tradition by the Dalai Lama and so the CTA had free rein to impose this ban. On a bigger picture, it is always unfair in politics and that's the norm. I think it would be better to raise the issue of how the Dorje Shugden ban is adversely affecting CTA's opportunities to start fresh talks with China. I think that would have a bigger impact.

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Karmapa's mentor under land law scanner
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2013, 11:12:58 AM »
Ooohh this is a dangerous news. I think the committee that's in charge of this project didn't really want to build the hospital and old age home. They had their own agenda all along and they submitted plans that were false in order to get the building permits. I am sorry but I think they did it because India has a grand reputation for being corrupt. They thought if the authorities found out, they would just bribed them and all would be hunky-dory. But they were wrong, they were caught under bad circumstances as the Indian government is under strong suspicions of the Karmapa.

I wouldn't blame Tai Situ's followers or even Tai Situpa on this one. Unlike the Sharmapa, Tai Situpa does not seem to have much power in the upper echelons of the Indian government. Thus, they will encounter such problems from time to time. Very often, Tai Situpa has had difficulty getting his travel visas approved and he has all manner of governmental problems and obstacles. He should work on building relations with the Indian government or whatever he plans to do will have tremendous obstacles.

I don't think the CTA gives 2 hoots about Tai Situpa and the problem about comparing that and the Dorje Shugden ban. CTA would not want to create an uproar about sectarian issues because that's their trump card. The Dorje Shugden ban was instituted within the tradition by the Dalai Lama and so the CTA had free rein to impose this ban. On a bigger picture, it is always unfair in politics and that's the norm. I think it would be better to raise the issue of how the Dorje Shugden ban is adversely affecting CTA's opportunities to start fresh talks with China. I think that would have a bigger impact.

yes you are right, it is very bad news for Tai Situpa. Deceiving the Indian government wont be something that they can get away with that easily. It would only mean more obstacles for Tai Situpa and his choice of the Karmapa to manifest Dharma deeds. But all the same, both of them have Bhutanese passports so I wouldnt be too worried about that part. However if they are unable to enter india, it would weaken their ties to CTA. Like you, I dont think that the CTA will care about Tai Situpa. The Dalai Lama might have prevented the Tai Situpa from being barred permanently from India the first time, but I wonder if he would do it again this time if Tai Situpa and his entourage are kicked out from India.