perpetuation of the Schism

[Mohani]

 

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DL Speech 01/09/10
« on: September 02, 2010, 09:09:28 AM »
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Voice of Tibet
Narthang Building
Gangchen Kyishong
Dharamsala, 176215 H.P.
IndiaTelephone: (+91) 1892 228179 or 222384
Fax: (+91) 1892 224913
Email: [email protected] [email protected]

 

Wednesday 01/09 – 2010

 

 

(Translation of Tibetan transcript of the Dalai Lama’s speech in Sera-May Monastery, which was broadcasted in Voice of Tibet Radio, a mouthpiece of Tibetan government in exile.)

 

Reporter: The Dalai Lama said that it was more harmful than beneficial if anyone who worship Dholgyal (Shugden) came to receive his initiation. He also made a statement with respect to Shugden.

 

The Dalai Lama:  As for Kyabje Pabongkha, he is really like the real Heruka. He is the lord of Chakarasambhava’s father and mother; he is lord of Lamrim and Mind Training. That is really amazing. It is wrong that some criticize him. The previous Dalai Lama was imposing strict ban on Shugden. When the predecessor passed away, he has made great efforts with respect to Shugden. That is wrong.  Therefore, knowing all things, I imposed ban on [Shugden]. It is wrong that some says this is order of the Dalai Lama. I am aware of the significant and reasons, as well as what the previous lamas have done.  Then I imposed a ban [on Shugden]. These days, they are being supported by Communist China. Shugden devotees in Tibet are given especial help. They encourage people to worship Shugden. Some monasteries are asked to worship [Shugden]. These are the reasons. Most of you have already known. Today once again… over there they are making loud noises (laugh). They are debating. The debating is good. When they are making noise, it is not right if I say nothing (laugh). Sera-May monastery faced serious difficulties. Basically it is Pomra Khamtsen. Shugden devotees, being headstrong, …to beat and to kill.

 

…became real Chinese spirit. Therefore [they] do not know.  I have nothing to say if they voluntarily and knowingly [worship Shugden]. It is religious freedom. It is up to you whatever deity you want to worship. But I should explain its source and background. This is my responsibility.

[Mohani]

Tibet Times

[WisdomBeing]

I was looking for the full text of HH Dalai Lama's speech. The Tibet Times article only gives excerpts. I only found these references.

http://www.tibetcustom.com/article.php/20100902230523839

This article is quite interesting in that it seems very 'soft' in approach - "people should not blindly follow my advice as a kind of order to shun the propitiation of Dholgyal (Shugden), rather they must fully understand and have a holistic view of the significance, reason, history, implications of restricting the practice of this fierce spirit. His Holiness recounted the incidents of violent activities like murder and beating of Tibetans by proponents of Dholgyal and their allegiance to the Chinese government.

His Holiness said I have nothing to say to those who practice the spirit despite knowing the harmful effects associated with it. There is freedom to follow any religion or propitiate any deity. But it is my duty is make clear about the practice of Dholgyal."

But on http://www.tibet.net/, there's no reference to Dorje Shugden.

Anyway, i just wanted to comment that for HH Dalai Lama to say that Pabongkha Rinpoche IS Heruka, how can he be mistaken and that his worship of Shugden is wrong?

"he is really like the real Heruka. He is the lord of Chakarasambhava’s father and mother; he is lord of Lamrim and Mind Training. That is really amazing. It is wrong that some criticize him."

This very blatant contradiction is again another proof that something is amiss. If anything, the Dalai Lama is not stupid and would not say these things lightly without knowing the effects.

Interesting. it's been quite quiet on the newsfront about Shugden, then the Dalai Lama brings it up.

[Lineageholder]

Interesting. it's been quite quiet on the newsfront about Shugden, then the Dalai Lama brings it up.

That's because the Dalai Lama wants to destroy reliance on Dorje Shugden, as well as and the lineage of his Gurus and so he will not rest until he has removed all Dorje Shugden practitioners from the international Buddhist Community,  For example, he says that Dorje Shugden is a Chinese spirit and that Shugden practitioners are supported by Communist China and that they 'beat and kill'.  If the Dalai Lama was going to say something to incite hatred against Shugden practitioners from most Tibetans, this would be it.  He also says that although he has imposed a ban, people have religious freedom and that it's not an order from the Dalai Lama - IT IS AN ORDER because if people do not obey, they are persecuted. 

[beggar]

There are very many contradictions just in this short excerpt. From a logical point of view, none of it seems to be making sense. Like what Wisdom Being has already pointed out about his statements about Pabongka Rinpoche. It is common knowledge that the dalai lama praises his own root gurus and the highest Gelugpa lamas and then in the same breath he says that they have made some mistakes, which was to practice dorje shugden - so do you believe the lamas are heruka (enlightened) or not (and make mundane mistakes?)

This is interesting also: "rather they must fully understand and have a holistic view of the significance, reason, history, implications of restricting the practice of this fierce spirit"

Well, the Dalai lama cannot be so stupid. Anyone who does any sort of research and tries to understand more about Dorje Shugden will learn very quickly that he is not a "spirit" and that he is a fully enlightened being with many benefits to his practice. It is very interesting (and encouraging!) that the Dalai Lama is asking people to check for themselves and insisting that people must "fully understand". a hint, maybe? a small clue to lead us in the right direction (i.e. not the one he's been leading us down).

[Ensapa]

 

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DL Speech 01/09/10
« on: September 02, 2010, 09:09:28 AM »
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Voice of Tibet
Narthang Building
Gangchen Kyishong
Dharamsala, 176215 H.P.
IndiaTelephone: (+91) 1892 228179 or 222384
Fax: (+91) 1892 224913
Email: [email protected] [email protected]

 

Wednesday 01/09 – 2010

 

 

(Translation of Tibetan transcript of the Dalai Lama’s speech in Sera-May Monastery, which was broadcasted in Voice of Tibet Radio, a mouthpiece of Tibetan government in exile.)

 

Reporter: The Dalai Lama said that it was more harmful than beneficial if anyone who worship Dholgyal (Shugden) came to receive his initiation. He also made a statement with respect to Shugden.

 

The Dalai Lama:  As for Kyabje Pabongkha, he is really like the real Heruka. He is the lord of Chakarasambhava’s father and mother; he is lord of Lamrim and Mind Training. That is really amazing. It is wrong that some criticize him. The previous Dalai Lama was imposing strict ban on Shugden. Really? Then why did he consult Dungkar monastery's oracle who is a Dorje Shugden oracle? There is proof that the 13th Dalai Lama did...why cover? When the predecessor passed away, he has made great efforts with respect to Shugden. That is wrong.  Therefore, knowing all things, I imposed ban on [Shugden]. It is wrong that some says this is order of the Dalai Lama. But it is! Unless of course your holiness is trying to tell us that someone else is forcing you to impose the ban, against what you would have wanted it to be. I am aware of the significant and reasons, as well as what the previous lamas have done.  Then I imposed a ban [on Shugden]. These days, they are being supported by Communist China. Shugden devotees in Tibet are given especial help. They encourage people to worship Shugden. Some monasteries are asked to worship [Shugden]. These are the reasons. Most of you have already known. Thats only because you said it would shorten your life. else they wouldnt have given any attention to it. Today once again… over there they are making loud noises (laugh). They are debating. The debating is good. When they are making noise, it is not right if I say nothing (laugh). Sera-May monastery faced serious difficulties. Basically it is Pomra Khamtsen. Shugden devotees, being headstrong, …to beat and to kill.Yeah and why is it that Serpom is doing so well compared to the other Khamtsens?

 

…became real Chinese spirit. Therefore [they] do not know.  I have nothing to say if they voluntarily and knowingly [worship Shugden]. It is religious freedom. It is up to you whatever deity you want to worship. But I should explain its source and background. This is my responsibility. but why is it that your information is inaccurate and biased?

Dont you love how these people twist and misquote the Dalai Lama? Imagine misquoting even your own Guru. The person that you respect the most and you misquote him? interesting display of Guru devotion indeed. So...Dear Dalai Lama, I love and respect you, therefore I shall practice selective reading on your teachings.  That's how i see it.