Are the Gelugpas sectarian?

[Ensapa]

To answer the question whether Gelug practitioners are sectarian, I would like to go back to the definition of what is sectarianism.  Sectarianism, according to one definition, is bigotry, discrimination or hatred arising from attaching importance to perceived differences between subdivisions within a group, such as between different denominations of a religion, class, regional or factions of a political movement.

One choose a particular lineage because it suits one's disposition.  In Tibetan Buddhism, one is encouraged to investigate prior to committing to any teachings and practice.  If this pre-requisite is executed properly, then it can safely be said that one choose to enter the lineage because it suits one's disposition.  There is nothing within the gelug teachings that encourage one not to respect and to hate other true religious denomination. 

In that sense I don't think we are secterian

Gelugpa was never sectarian from the start, so how can it be sectarian now? The sectarianism that is perceived of Gelugpas comes from nothing but pure ignorance and jealousy as the Gelugs are after all the fastest growing tradition compared to the other traditions. It is also the tradition with a very complete set of teachings from the rest of the traditions and a very solid and stable system in place to keep the teachings intact.

Now, why would people perceive exclusivity as sectarian? Mainly due to ignorance. Ignorance of  how things work and also what sectarianism really is. There is also the popular belief that is prevalent these days that being non sectarian is to mix everything up together, and it is not sectarian because it shows that you are accepting of other people's tradition and teachings. Or rather, that is what people would like to believe.

So why is that belief a bad one? Because it causes people to not be stable and encourages people to mix things around. If you would not mash up instructions on how to bake a cake with the instructions on how to bake a pie, why would you want to do that with the Buddhist teachings? Every lineage itself has a system within that should not be touched or messed up with. Gelugpa is one of the lineages that are sensitive to being messed up as Tsongkhapa's system is already perfect.

Other traditions may not be exactly be too sensitive in this regard, but what applies to them may not apply to the Gelugs. There is definitely a very good reason why Jamgon Kongtrul did not include Gelug within the Rime movement: because Gelug is Rime by itself.

[RedLantern]

The Dalai Lama has composed a prayer praising various historical figures and lineages of Vajrayana from India and Tibet.Dalai Lama compose this,in short.
May all the teachings off the Buddhas of the land of snow
Flourish long into the future-the ten great pillars
And the chariots of the practice lineage,such as Shilje and the rest
All of them rich with their essential instructions.
May the lives of masters who uphold these teachings be secured and harmonious
May the sangha preserve this teachings from their study meditation and activity
May the world be filled with faithful individual intent on following these teachings
And long may the non sectarian teaching of the Buddha continue to flourish.
Within any tradition of Tibetan Buddhism they are many lineages and it's hard to say each monastery has a lineage.The Gelugpa tradition are not sectarian.

[Ensapa]

Gelug is not sectarian. Choosing to focus on one's own tradition while respecting the other traditions is not sectarian. In fact, those who are really sectarian are those who criticize Gelug an instill fear into people who want to seek out Gelug Lamas because they 'could be a bad one'. i dont see anything wrong with wanting to support my own center and i go sightseeing in other centers, but i dont have to join their puja sessions because i already have my own set to focus on.

[psylotripitaka]

Great posts.

According to various dictionary definitions of the word 'sectarian', it means being part of a sect or strictly adhering to the doctrines of a particular sect.

So interesting: it appears the Gelug school is both sectarian and non-sectarian. By adhering to the doctrines transmitted within the lineage it is sectarian. By being a combination of many lineages it is non-sectarian.

I wonder at what point (and how) the word 'sectarian' started being used to describe a person who criticizes other religions and lineages? I certainly haven't read all the dictionaries in the world..maybe its in one of the sub-definitions somewhere!

[Ensapa]

Great posts.

According to various dictionary definitions of the word 'sectarian', it means being part of a sect or strictly adhering to the doctrines of a particular sect.

So interesting: it appears the Gelug school is both sectarian and non-sectarian. By adhering to the doctrines transmitted within the lineage it is sectarian. By being a combination of many lineages it is non-sectarian.

I wonder at what point (and how) the word 'sectarian' started being used to describe a person who criticizes other religions and lineages? I certainly haven't read all the dictionaries in the world..maybe its in one of the sub-definitions somewhere!

In a non-general term, being sectarian means promoting only your own tradition and putting down the rest. the thing is this: why is it wrong for someone to focus only on a tradition of their choice and not branch out to the rest of the traditions? If I like vanilla flavored ice cream and i stick to my favorite flavor everywhere i go, does it make me sectarian because i dont choose the other flavors? If I am sectarian by doing so then yes. But in society's term of being sectarian it means criticizing other traditions in favor of your own. In that sense, Gelugpa is just Gelugpa. I dont see what it is as being sectarian at all.

[dsiluvu]

Based on my understanding, Lama Tsongkhapa spent his entire lifetime studying, memorizing, meditating, practicing the teachings from all schools of Buddhism present in Tibet. From his practice, He refined the teachings based on the realizations which dawned upon him and passed down these teachings in order to preserve them from deteoriating further.

Based on the above mentioned... hence isn't Gelug the synthesis or essence of every single school/sect what ever you wish to label it. Basically because Lama Tsongkhapa took teaching from all 3 schools... does not already state the obvious Gelug is a combination of all 3 hence what sectarian???

Actually this makes me rejoice even more to know that our lineage teachings are essence of the 3 schools, taking of the best of the best teachings and combining to get the best results... wow Lama Tsongkhapa is super genius and probably knows during this degenerate times we lazy people need it lol I definitely think the concept of Gelug being sectarian is totally off... if anything it is a harmonious creation of the three which gave birth to Gelug - how beautiful indeed!

[Ensapa]

Being sectarian is not practicing your school of Buddhism exclusively. Being sectarian is denegrading other sects and discouraging others from joining.

Tsongkapa's view of Madhyamika may be very quick to gain attainments, perhaps faster than others, but that does not mean other views cannot gain you the attainments of emptiness. It's a matter of applicability according to time, place and presentation of the teachings in accordance with the karmic disposition of the individuals.

Of all the posts, I love this post the most. that really defines what being sectarian is all about and why is it imperative that people realize what being sectarian really is. Being sectarian is praising one's own tradition and degrading the other traditions. Tsongkhapa's teachings are the quickest path for our time because of how he presented the teachings. Tsongkhapa did not degrade the other traditions, he only told his students to focus on his methods, but respect everyone else.

[psylotripitaka]

Yes, that is the type of definition that is commonly used to discuss the topic. I was just pointing out that in all the dictionaries I've come across, the definitions say nothing whatsoever about bigotry or the criticism of other sects or factions. They simply state that it means to be part of a sect or a strict adherent of the doctrines of a particular sect. So, when I heard this new definition and use then looked up the word in the dictionary, it was a little confusing.

[Ensapa]

Yes, that is the type of definition that is commonly used to discuss the topic. I was just pointing out that in all the dictionaries I've come across, the definitions say nothing whatsoever about bigotry or the criticism of other sects or factions. They simply state that it means to be part of a sect or a strict adherent of the doctrines of a particular sect. So, when I heard this new definition and use then looked up the word in the dictionary, it was a little confusing.

Sometimes dictionaries may not be accurate in more ways than one and not every definition would actually follow the dictionary 's definition but what most people think of what it is. Dictionaries are only to look up words and that they are interpreted based on a more robotic or mechanical way of interpreting the words, so it may or may not be something that is true. Dictionaries do not represent what people really think about a certain subject so why not go with the definition that people think?