Organ Donation

[WisdomBeing]

I think the issue raised about the relevancy of this topic was because there is a Dorje Shugden board and the General Buddhism board, the latter of which I believe this topic would have been more appropriate.

However, as others have said, this topic is interesting. I had heard about someone who was comatose and the family had decided to switch off the life support system and donate the organs. Isn’t that counted as murder? If one was to switch off the life support? Or is it okay because the life support is an intervention and left to its own devices, this person would have naturally expired.

[Benny]

I agree with Dondrup , a potential organ donor should understand the implications of organ donation. Not everyone can be sure that they are totally unattached to their body upon death. So if one were to seriously consider this compassionate act of benefitting others even in death, one such person must really prepare for such an act.

As some has stated, even highly attained monks need days in death meditation before they leave their bodies and in that time their bodies are left untouched so as to not disturb their meditation.

Imagine the amount of practice and training one has to undergo before they can be unaffected by the operating procedure. It is thought that even the subtlest of touch can be the most painful experience one can endure when one 's consciousness has not left the body as yet. It is also believed that the deceased should not be touch neck down as it will attract the deceased persons consciousness to leave via the lower parts ! So imagine the lay person who donated his kidneys when alive , little did he know that when they remove his kidneys, his consciousness might just tag along to where the kidney went ! He he , this reminds me of the horror flick " The Eye" !

I dont mean to discourage people from donating but just do it with wisdom.   

[Ensapa]

Upon death, we abandon our body which is of no use to us.  It is then cremated or buried.  However, the organs in our body could be used to benefit others.

During the death process, the dying person experiences the dissolution of the gross mind.  At this critical moment, it is advisable that the body should remain intact and not subject to any movement or removal of organs.  As organs need to be removed immediately upon death, it affects the dissolution process of the mind and the next rebirth.  Hence, the organ donors must be absolutely sure, willing and understood the implication of organ removal. The donors must not be attached to their bodies.  This does not mean donors who are ready and understood the implications cannot donate their organs.  They have to realize the risk involved which will determine their next rebirth. 

During the death process, the gross mind will be confused by the appearances that manifest.  Unless the donors had trained and prepared their minds prior to death, they may not be able to cope with the impact of organ removal from their bodies.  How many can be 100% sure when the organs are removed during the death process, their mind will not be affected by it?

That is what my question is too as the organs need to be have to be harvested immediately after death. During that time it is possible that the dissolution of the gross mind into the subtle mind has not been completed yet and they are still within the body. When that happens, it would definitely propel the mind into a very chaotic state as it would be wondering what is going on and what is happening to the body. Our minds by default see the body as the me and are very attached to it. Many lifetimes of habituations have told the mind that the body is it and it is the body and they are not separate, and that it is the only real possession that it has as it is the only thing that truly belongs to it and that it can control, and so due to this, the mind may experience a lot of agony when it sees people cutting up the body and taking out the organs and this agony experienced right before the mind dissolves can potentially throw the mind into a hell state as the experiences ripens the negative karma to be born there. So there is this danger there.

I have also read up on the practice of chod, where the practitioner actually visualizes his mind and body as separate, and the mind takes the form of a dakini with a corpse knife and then, slice the 'body' with the knife into chunks of flesh that is to be fed to the demons and ghosts to appease them. Perhaps, a very experienced chod practitioner can donate their organs without the fear and terror of losing their body. Perhaps also, we can prepare for organ donation if we actually do death meditation and include the bit where the doctors remove our organs from our body so that we wont be so shocked when it actually happens. The whole purpose of death meditation is so that we can get used to the idea of dying and to familiarize ourselves with it so that we do not fear death and we can still gain control of ourselves during that chaotic period. This is just my 2 cents on how to donate organs while getting over the fear of being cut up when we're not fully dead yet.

[michaela]

First of, thank you everyone who had contributed to this discussion, I apologize if the topic in hand is 'not relevant' to Dorje Shugden, but I take this from as a place for constructive discussion and learning. I have seen a simple / innocent question led to interesting and mind blowing discussion, so why not? Do we need to limit our discussion to Dorje Shugden?

Hi Tammy, I thought we have general Buddhism section to discuss this type of issue

[Ensapa]

Organ donations can save a few lives, but what about a form of donation that can save countless lives? By providing essential knowledge to people who will save lives: the doctors. I'm talking about people who donate their remains to medical science so that doctors can learn. Tsu Zhi has his program, and they actually treat the cadavers with respect and address them as "silent mentors". Is this a more interesting dimension to donating organs? as this is donating not just an organ but the whole body so that doctors can learn and use that knowledge to save lives.

Silent Mentors – Heroes of Life
Friday, 24 September 2010 16:36    Johan Alwall   


This year is the 15th anniversary of the Silent Mentor program at Tzu Chi Universality. Professor Wang Yue-ren, head of the Silent mentor program, and the 4th year medical students are very grateful for the contribution of silent mentors and their families. (Photo by Hsu Yuan-chi; date: 09/22/2010; location: Jing Si Hall, Hualien)

Dharma Master Cheng Yen once said: “The greatest suffering in life is illness. If doctors can save more lives by learning from our donated bodies, that would be of great worth.”

I have heard about the Silent Mentor program many times before, and also visited the simulation surgery room at the Tzu Chi university, but sitting there at the Gratitude Concert for the Silent Mentors, in the presence of the families of the Silent Mentors, the students who have been taught by them and their professors, doctors of the Tzu Chi International Medical Association from many countries, Tzu Chi volunteers and Dharma Masters from the Jing Si Abode, was a very different experience.

When the Tzu Chi Medical University was first established, they, like most other Medical Universities, were lacking bodies for teaching Gross anatomy. When the principal asked Master Cheng Yen for advice, she asked if he could ensure that donated bodies could be stored in a bright, comfortable and dignified manner. When he answered that this could be done, the Master made a public statement encouraging her disciples to donate their bodies after their death: “While we live, our body is of use to us. After we have passed away, it can be of even greater use, by teaching doctors to save lives”.


The first simulation surgery training classes for specialists from different countries; doctors are grateful for silent mentors’ selfless contribution. (Photo by Hsu Rung-hui; date: 08/30/2010; location: Tzu Chi University)

Since the first body donor, Mrs. Lin, more than 27000 people have signed the agreement to become, as Tzu Chi calls it, “silent mentors”. They are called this because, while they have forever lost their ability to teach by speaking, they can still teach the most important lessons to young doctors; more than anatomy or surgery skills, they also teach the young doctors respect, gratitude and compassion. The doctors get to know their silent mentor, their life history, meet the family of the donor, and treat the silent mentor with gratitude and respect. During the concert, we heard several young doctors talk about how they kept coming back to their silent mentor in their thoughts, about how much they had learned from them, and about the gratitude they felt towards them.

Some of the most touching moments during the concerts was the statements from body donors. Thanks to the knowledge that their body will become of the highest use after their death, they could depart in peace. “The moment the scalpel of a doctor student cuts through my body, that is the moment when my dream comes true.” One donor told his wife on the night before his death: “Don't worry about me – I will go back to Hualien, to my spiritual home.” “What about me”, she asked. “You should hurry back home, and continue our recycling work in our community. Now I get to do a final recycling, that of my own body, to help doctors learn to save lives.”

Towards the end of the program, Master Cheng Yen mentioned the serene, almost joyful, look on the faces of some of her disciples, who had asked that the ambulance would make a stop at the Jing Si abode to pay a last farewell to Master before going to the Tzu Chi University.

No less moving is the support of the families in respecting the wish and of the deceased. We heard several stories about family members rushing the silent mentor to reach Hualien within the necessary time limit of 8 hours after death, despite raging typhoon winds and rain.

As the number of donated bodies grew, they were soon more than needed for anatomy teaching. A professor at the University realized that the bodies can be used for simulation surgery, to allow doctors to practice surgical procedures without endangering the safety of patients.

“Whenever I have questions during an operation, I will keep them in mind, and I will then use the opportunity when I can do a simulation surgery to learn the answers. When I was in the US, I learned a new type of surgical procedure. Before I used it on patients here in Taiwan, I could try it on a silent mentor, allowing me to perfect the procedure before trying it on living patients,” said one doctor.

“I am extremely grateful to the silent mentors. When I do tough surgeries, I always think about the silent mentors, and the courage, compassion and love that I learned from them.”


At the Gratitude Concert for the Silent Mentors, medical students perform the song wrote by students.

The dedication, sincerity and compassion of the students was also very moving. Professor Wang, the professor in charge of the Silent mentor program, told us:
– The first time I took the students to clean the cremation site, I was nervous because they are all the “precious babies” of their families. Then I saw one of the students actually use his own toothbrush to carefully clean a toilet bowl at the crematorium. This is the sense of compassionate dedication that we need to help the students keep throughout their education, and help them nurture as practicing doctors.

This is something truly unique in the world – not only is the idea of progressive surgery simulations using real bodies, in an environment and temperature which exactly replicates that of a regular surgery room, but even more the respect and gratitude for the silent mentors, and the emphasis on respect and compassion for future patients that this fosters in the doctor students. And this amazing concert, with performances by the students, the doctors who have learned from the silent mentors through simulation surgery, doctors at the Tzu Chi hospitals and professors at the Tzu Chi university, and many sharings by doctors and families to the silent mentors, is a very worthy farewell to these “heroes of life”.

[brian]

This is indeed an interesting topic brought up by Tammy and the information given here by everyone is very enlightening, especially the one explained by Big Uncle in his/her last posting about how the minds of ordinary people differ from High Lamas or advanced practitioners at death.
My question is that taking into account the explanations given about differing levels of death, ordinary people can be organ donors but for High Lamas, it may not be ideal for them to do so?
And lastly like michaela, I am also wondering how is this topic, though interesting as it might be, relevent to the DS subject?

I think if someone gets the benefit from organs donated by High Lamas, this person must be very lucky and highly blessed indeed. Although I have never heard of High Lamas organs (after their demise)  been donated to save lives. Anyone would care to share? I have no doubt whether High Lamas have any attachments to their body, it is just that is it appropriate to have a High Lamas (most were regarded as emanation of enlightened beings) organs be donated out to save lives instead of being cremated together with the holy body...

[Ensapa]

After death, if we have a Lama and we wish to donate our organs, we can request the Lama to do phowa for us to ensure that we are really 'dead' before the dissecting begins. But anyways, nowadays, if we are unlucky enough, we'll get a round of post mortem right after we are being sent to the hospital anyway. So its not gonna be fun to see people cutting our bodies and manhandling our organs, will it? Thats why phowa practice that we do alive is important in case we have no Lama.

The patient is declared clinically dead, but in the Buddhist view, the subtle consciousness may still remain in the body for about three days. Therefore, the body is not to be touched or moved since this might disturb how the consciousness leaves the body and thus affect rebirth. In this way, one would think that Tibetans are very against organ transplant as it would appear to violate the consciousness still within the person’s body. However, according to Sogyal Rinpoche who posed this question to some high level masters, organ transplant, if done by the will of the donor, actually brings great merit to the consciousness, even if the operation disturbs it, because it is done with the mind of compassion for others. In general, though, one should wait for a monk to arrive to help with this transference of consciousness, so this becomes very difficult in people who die in the hospital. It is especially difficult for a priest to meditate and do anything in the hospital. Further, the effect of the medicine on the dying person has a strong effect on the consciousness and its ability to leave the body.

It is believed that the dead have wisdom and sensitivity nine times that of a regular person, so the thoughts and effects of the living have a huge effect on the dead soul. Therefore, showing strong remorse as the person dies and afterward is not good because it may engender attachment by the dying not to leave this life and disturb them from concentrating on the Buddha. Showing such remorse may still occur in Ladakh, but we are trying to change this and teach people to do their best to support the dying person’s journey onward.

For a typical person, the monk will perform a ritual called the Transference of Consciousness or phowa.

In the Gelug context, the actual phowa practice is in reality the 5 powers that we cultivate throughout our life before we actually die.

The five powers are instructions on how to live and how to die. Actually, there's no difference. The same advice applies to both, because if you know how to do one you'll know how to do the other.

The power of positive seed

The first of the five powers is the power of positive or white seed. When you realize you are shortly to die, you can begin by making provisions for your family in order to provide for their material needs, make offering to the Three Jewels and your teachers, and donating the rest to others such as the needy, charitable organizations, and so forth. Specifically, you must give up in your mind any object which at the moment of your death you may develop longing for. This could even be a trifling, seemingly worthless thing.

For example, there is a story of an old dying monk who had a great liking for Tibetan butter tea. He associated his tea with a simple, old wooden bowl from which he drank it. The old monk was having a rough time of it. He simply couldn't let go and move on. His teacher came to see him and understanding his problem asked if he could have his bowl, but quickly added, "You know. Where you're going they have even better butter tea than they do here." The monk let go, and peacefully died.

Essentially, the power of positive seed is emphasizing the accumulation of merit through offering and the process of letting go - letting go of your clinging whether to people, things or your own body. You're saying your good-byes, putting your affairs in proper order, giving possessions away, getting ready to set out on a journey. It's being mindful of the fact that all that is born is bound to decay including your own body, accepting and getting on with the impermanence of life. This is something that should be an important part of your practice throughout your life. You are going to have to give everything up sooner or later. This power reminds you of that fact and the necessity to begin the process now.

As the signs of actual death approach you should sincerely dedicate again and again all your possessions, merit and even your own body - anything and everything towards which you may still harbour some lingering attachment, to the benefit of all sentient beings. Let go of everything, clear yourself out and mentally give it all away until there is nothing left but you, your mind and your practice to go forward together.

The power of aspiring prayer

The second power is the power of aspiring prayer. As death approaches you must try to cut through the possible fears and confusion surrounding your death to what is of undying ultimate value to you - the awakening of your heart and mind. Again and again make heartfelt prayers of aspirations to the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha and to your teachers that you will never be separated from your spiritual practice and spiritual teachers and again and again dedicate your merit to this end.

Now, and at all times, throughout my death,
The intermediate stage, the next
And all subsequent rebirths,
Bless me never to be apart from this spiritual practice.
May I always be guided by authentic spiritual teachers
Who repeatedly lead me to generate

The Awakened Heart.[1]

The power of repudiation

The third power is the power of repudiation. This involves making clear for yourself what most basically you don't want - suffering, and what are its real sources - self-centeredness and self-grasping. It involves developing and maintaining a deeply felt aversion towards your afflictive emotions - hatred, attachment, ignorance, pride, jealousy and so forth - and towards cyclic existence in general - the controllably recurring dissatisfactory patterns of life. You simply do not want anything to do with any of them any longer, like a bad dream that you just don't want to go through again. At the time of death it is vital that you do not allow strong afflictive emotions to arise since they will activate a negative projecting karmic seed giving rise to a corresponding negative rebirth. A strong feeling of aversion towards them will help in this.

There are three particular supportive conditions that come together at the time of death to nourish and activate the previously implanted projecting karma seeds - the type of karma that directs your eventual rebirth state.

The first two of these conditions are two forms of attachment which act as moisture that nourishes the karmic seed. In the context of the twelve links of dependent origination, these are craving and grasping. Craving is a general attachment for cyclic existence, the desire for pleasure to continue and for discomfort to cease. When craving intensifies into the urge to reach out and grasp the means of satisfying this desire, that is the second form of attachment, grasping.

The third condition is like the warmth that is necessary for a seed to germinate. It is a secondary mental karma, the virtuous and nonvirtuous thoughts arising during the death process that are similar in type to the main projecting karma directing your next rebirth state. Virtuous thoughts activate the seed of a corresponding positive projecting karma, while nonvirtuous thoughts activate the seed of a corresponding negative projecting karma.

Our state of mind at death is all-important. If you die in a positive frame of mind, you can improve your next birth, despite your negative karma. And if you are upset and distressed, it may have a detrimental effect, even though you may have used your lives well. This means that the last thought and emotion that you have before you die has an extremely powerful determining effect on your immediate future. Just as the mind of a mad person is usually entirely occupied by one obsession, which returns again and again, so at the moment of death your mind are totally vulnerable and exposed to whatever thought then preoccupy you. That last thought or emotion you have can be magnified out of all proportion and flood your whole perception.[2]

Since the thoughts arising while dying act as an essential condition, it is important to try to guide the mind to a virtuous object as you approach death. This will assist in the arising of virtuous thoughts and, thus, ensure that a positive projecting karmic seed will be activated at the moment of your death.

Also, in this regard, again and again purify past negative karma by applying the "four powers" which have the ability to weaken and destroy the negative karmic seeds implanted in your mind by past unskilful actions: the power of repudiation, the power of reliance, the power of restraint and the power of thorough application of the antidote.

The power of determination

The fourth power is the power of determination. When the time of your death is near, you must set an exceptionally strong intention to maintain a positive state of mind throughout the transition of death, the intermediate state and into the future.

Most especially you should deeply resolve that you will generate and not be separated from the compassion of the Awakened Heart and the wisdom of the Awakened Mind throughout the entirety of the death process and that you will take rebirth where you can be of benefit to others and carry on your practice of these two. Hold tight to this thought.

The power of familiarity

The fifth power is the power of familiarity. In general acquaint yourself with what it is that you will do at the moment of your death so as to avoid any panic as the time approaches. And most especially, familiarize yourself with the Awakened Heart and the Awakened Mind so that you will be ready with them at the time of your death.

For example, if able, physically you should lie on your right side, your head towards the north (if only imagined), with your cheek supported by your right palm and ring finger closing the right nostril,[3] place your left arm along the left side of your body,[4] mentally generate an Awakened Heart and while there is still breath, practice Taking and Giving - imaginatively taking on yourself the sufferings of others and giving away your happiness to them.[5] Then, by the power of your Awakened Mind, not clinging to anything, rest in the understanding that all that is about to appear to you does not truly exist out there from its own side, but in reality depends upon on your own mind.

To die in such a positive way is to die skilfully and there can be no doubt that you have created the conditions necessary to activate a positive projecting karmic seed in your mind that will bring about the type of rebirth where you will be able to uninterruptedly continue your spiritual practice in the future. This is the finest way for an ordinary individual to transfer their consciousness at the time of death.

Practicing the 5 powers is more important than having a lama come around as death can happen anytime and looking at people doing post mortem at your body cant be fun.

[brian]

There are many myths and taboo in donating the body organs, especially in our chinese belief.  The chinese believed when we die we must die as a whole with organs intact or else we can never find back our soul. In terms of buddhism, i was told before that the human conscious must leave the dead body before we can touch and do the neccessary after death.....this includes changing of clothes and cleansing of the body.  If this is the case, prior to the consciousness leaving the dead, and if we need to operate on the body...what are the consequences?  Will the consciousness be disturbed and hinder from a good rebirth?

I am not sure and familiar with Chinese customs but i do believe in one thing, we do this out of compassion and the mind to help others even after we died. And even that, the person who died and had wished his organs be donated, will he still mind his organs being cut off? He must have expected it anyways and will he still be able to feel his body being cut apart and his organs being cut out piece by piece? I am not too sure about the level of consciousness left in a dead body, but i do believe that when we die, we live in a very subtle consciousness and would not even understand what is happening to our body. My two cents worth of comment.

[pgdharma]

There are no rules in Buddhism for or against organ donation; the decision for or against organ donation relies very much on an individual's decision. People may decide for or against it, without one choice being seen as right or wrong as it is viewed as an act of charity and the last act of giving.

In Buddhism, the death process of an individual is viewed as very important, and the body should be treated with respect.It should only be disturbed for appropriate reasons and with special care. However, there are no beliefs that the body should be preserved in its entirety, so removing organs is not an issue from this point of view.

It is also important to consider the consciousness of the dead person and whether this might be adversely affected by organ donation, as the surgery takes place immediately after the donor takes their last breath as the consciousness may stay in the body for sometime after breathing has stopped. Until the consciousness leaves the body it is important the body remains undisturbed, so it may have some concerns that an operation so soon after death may damage their consciousness and cause harm to their future lives. As an organ donor myself,  I guess it is up to individual's decision. However, it is advisable for potential donors to inform their immediate family of their wish to donate.

[Ensapa]

I am not sure and familiar with Chinese customs but i do believe in one thing, we do this out of compassion and the mind to help others even after we died. And even that, the person who died and had wished his organs be donated, will he still mind his organs being cut off? He must have expected it anyways and will he still be able to feel his body being cut apart and his organs being cut out piece by piece? I am not too sure about the level of consciousness left in a dead body, but i do believe that when we die, we live in a very subtle consciousness and would not even understand what is happening to our body. My two cents worth of comment.

Yeah but at the end, we will always be attached to our bodies simply because it is the only possession that is always around that our minds are bonded to. We are habituated from the day that we are born that our bodies are us. Whatever we do we do for our body. We take very good care of it and we are willing to spend any amount of money to make "us" look good, when its just decorating a pile of flesh and organs. But even now, when we eat or we use beauty products, what goes through our mind? and if we hold that thought at death, and people start cutting up our bodies, what happens?

If we cannot bear as so much to a stranger touching our bodies when we are alive now, how can we bear the thought of strangers cutting up our bodies and removing the organs, unless of course we train our mind now to let go of the body, especially if we are really going to donate our organs after death. It is something logical. We get very angry and feel very violated when people so much touch our bodies while we're alive, imagine standing at the side and watching the surgeons cut up our naked body...how will our mind react during that time? And what if it triggers some very bad karma to go with that?

We have met the Dharma and we know how the mind works, so i was just explaining a very probable scenario on organ donation and if we are determined on benefitting others, and since death can happen anytime, should we not be preparing our mind to think that this body is not ours? That way we can easily donate our organs without the fears that we are not dead yet. These days, they consider people who are brain dead as being dead and they will remove the life support and proceed with organ harvesting when the mind is still actually in the body. It would be very scary, i'd imagine to see that happening.

[kris]

The "silent mentor" has taken a storm lately! Many people are starting to accept this concept and gaining popularity. Even my mum said she wanted to donate her body after her death, and I jokingly said that it will probably save some money on funeral.

Both organ donation and "silent mentor" make a lot of sense to me, because, our body is an "rented" space that is own by our mind in this life, and someday, we need to "return" it. Whether we will die in a condition where we can donate the organ, we can't say for sure, but the motivation to serve others even after death is a good training to our mind, where we are already starting to let go.

If we can combine the two, would it be better? Meaning, we donate our "usable" organs, then after that, they can take my body for medical students. May the the organ donation group should have have a talk with "silent mentor" group...

[Barzin]

Time has changed.  I don't think people are as resistant as the time before.  Just like what I heard on the radio today, people are changing the rules and customs which have been set for the longest.. For example, is it okay for the bride not to wear white on her wedding day?  White is suppose to represent purity but people these days choose different colours, themes to represent their personalities and even changing the songs etc..  Does it mean we don't respect the customs?  It is just that time has changed...

More and more people are donating their organs even they are alive, not to mention that when they are dead.  I think it is just a practice that is not known to many but slowly people will be doing it, afterall what can we do with dead body even body is intact?  It is better to put the remains into good use.  Just like the example of the wedding dress, sometimes we can change the rules for something which we feel is good but it doesn't mean we don't trust the older rules.