Arvind Singh, Advocate Supreme Court of India

[WisdomBeing]

Ironic isn't it, that all this debate on religious freedom, Indian government's investigation on the Karmapa, all this discussion about Buddhism and Dharma is happening right in the heart of Buddha Shakyamuni's own land. I wonder what he would think of all of this! Surely he didn't teach the Dharma 2500 years ago for it to travel out to Tibet, go all over the world and then "return" to India full of politics!

just an observation, is all.

Hi Beggar

I've often wondered why Buddhist teachings degenerated in India...

It IS ironic... eg even Christianity is no longer strong in the Middle East...

Impermanence...

[Helena]

Because this is the nature of Samsara.

As long as we are in Samsara, we are subjected to its "laws and natural ways of things".

Having said that, we must not forget that we do add to it all. Be it by our own ignorance, ego, hatred, anger and etc. We do play a role in every repeated birth and demise of life and everything else.

There will come a time when all of Buddha's Teachings will disappear from  the face of the earth, not just India - so it was predicted by the Buddha himself.

 

[DSFriend]

Ironic isn't it, that all this debate on religious freedom, Indian government's investigation on the Karmapa, all this discussion about Buddhism and Dharma is happening right in the heart of Buddha Shakyamuni's own land. I wonder what he would think of all of this! Surely he didn't teach the Dharma 2500 years ago for it to travel out to Tibet, go all over the world and then "return" to India full of politics!

just an observation, is all.

Hi Beggar

I've often wondered why Buddhist teachings degenerated in India...

It IS ironic... eg even Christianity is no longer strong in the Middle East...

Impermanence...

From the 2001 census, there's only 0.8% Buddhists in India, which is 8million people!

If we were to look at history, at which point did we ever not have the influence of Politics in the form of manipulation,  threats and warfare.

From the limited knowledge I have, Buddhism was under threat even before it started to take roots in India. Hinduism was well assimilated and integrated into the culture before and also after Buddhism came into India. The demolition of temples and stupas by Muslims in the 12th century did not contribute towards. However, it wasn't just Buddhist shrines which was destroyed...Hindu temples and teachings were also subjected to the same fate, yet, hinduism is still prevalent in India.

Is it because of politics which contributed towards the degeneration of Buddhism in India? I don't think so...
I don't know why or how..perhaps karma?

What got me thinking was why did Buddha Shakyamuni chose to be reborn and achieve enlightenment in this land. 
Why India?

[WisdomBeing]

Good question, DSFriend. Why would Buddha choose to be born in India... although technically he was born in Lumbini and today would be considered a Nepalese rather than an Indian. Another example of the impermanence of national borders and geography!

Perhaps we can look at where Buddha gained Enlightenment. Why did he choose Bodhgaya?

It is said apparently that the next Buddha - Maitreya - will also gain Enlightenment in the same place. I've heard before that it is because certain areas in our world is a convergence of energy - like Machu Piccu or Stonehenge - which are like portals to a different world and are conducive to spirituality. Perhaps Bodhgaya is such a spot.

[Big Uncle]

From the 2001 census, there's only 0.8% Buddhists in India, which is 8million people!

If we were to look at history, at which point did we ever not have the influence of Politics in the form of manipulation,  threats and warfare.

From the limited knowledge I have, Buddhism was under threat even before it started to take roots in India. Hinduism was well assimilated and integrated into the culture before and also after Buddhism came into India. The demolition of temples and stupas by Muslims in the 12th century did not contribute towards. However, it wasn't just Buddhist shrines which was destroyed...Hindu temples and teachings were also subjected to the same fate, yet, hinduism is still prevalent in India.

Is it because of politics which contributed towards the degeneration of Buddhism in India? I don't think so...
I don't know why or how..perhaps karma?

What got me thinking was why did Buddha Shakyamuni chose to be reborn and achieve enlightenment in this land. 
Why India?

Just to add... I think Buddhism didn't survive after the Muslim invasion was due to many factors. One of the factors was the fact that the great Buddhist institutions of learning like Nalanda, Odivisha and the others were destroyed. I cite that because Buddhism is actually a rather profound religion and its spread and flourishing has much to do with these great institutions that became the backbone of the Sangha. These institutions were stronghold of learning and creating great masters, hence  when they were sacked and destroyed, many of the surviving members left India and when to Tibet, Kashmir, China etc... Lama Tsongkhapa and Duldzin Drakpa Gyeltsen knew this and so they strove to develop Gaden Monastery in memory of Nalanda and also to revive the monastic tradition of Nalanda in Tibet. It is only through such great institutions that Buddhism can survive and flourish....

[Big Uncle]

Sorry, I press post too soon....

Therefore, Buddhism had a intellectual connotation to this religion while Hinduism was easily accepted by the masses and they still predominate over the rest of India. Buddhism only thrive over the northern regions of India and centered mainly around the great institutions. The rest of the populace during those times were uneducated and couldn't even begin to fathom the difference between Hinduism and Buddhism. Those were all factors that led to its eventual downfall.

Politics does play a role in Buddhism's downfall in India. The great institutions like Nalanda was degenerating because of its rigidity of its bureaucracy which left little room for real spiritual development. Ironically, that is also when Tantric Buddhism was becoming more prevalent...especially in eastern India. Many Mahasiddhas we know were initially either abbots, scholars, or great monks within these monasteries before they left to become wandering yogins.

Last of all, the Buddha did say that Bodhgaya was special as it will be the spot where he and other Buddhas will achieve enlightenment. Apparently, they will all use the same language as well. That is one of the basis for Buddhist pilgrimage - we connect with these future Buddhas so we have the karma to be their students in the future if we don't achieve enlightenment sooner.

[DSFriend]

Politics does play a role in Buddhism's downfall in India. The great institutions like Nalanda was degenerating because of its rigidity of its bureaucracy which left little room for real spiritual development. Ironically, that is also when Tantric Buddhism was becoming more prevalent...especially in eastern India. Many Mahasiddhas we know were initially either abbots, scholars, or great monks within these monasteries before they left to become wandering yogins.

Yes, I've also read that the scholars became quite into themselves and their monasteries, causing intake of new aspirants into monk-hood to decline. Something for us to take heed of if we have a Dharma Centre... How outward reaching are we or are we only practicing for oneself.