How does Protectors such as Dorje Shugden clear obstacles?

[DSFriend]

Dharma protectors are said to clear obstacles for practitioners. I've had quite a number of people asked the question of how does this actually happen. Even Buddha can't make us enlightened but helps us by showing us the path. We have to do it ourselves. So how is it possible that a protector can clear our obstacles. Does it mean that he actually clears it as it takes it away? Then doesn't this negate the law of karma?

[beggar]

There are two ways that protectors help to clear our obstacles

1) no, a protector cannot just take away our karma and cancel out our karma. What protectors can do however, is to hold back a particular karma from manifesting at a particular time. This "buys us time" to practice and purify our karma so that it doesn't not ripen or, even if it does, the obstacle is not as disastrous or difficult as it would have been.

2) by doing protector practices - such as Dorje Shugden's, for example, who is one with Manjushri - we are also making offerings and prayers directly to an enlightened being. The merit we gain is incredible. At the same time, we open inherent imprints of Dharma. Together, this makes it easier for us to understand the Dharma teachings when we receive them. It also becomes easier for us to put these teachings into practice because we have the merit to support the practice. At the same time, before obstacles are removed (or lessened), there is more opportunity for us to practice. When we receive the teachings, practice, gain realisations then ultimately, we are able to gain the wisdom and means to remove our own obstacles.

Ultimately, this is what we aim for. What is wonderful about Dharma protector practice is that they don't just remove our problems with a magic wand. They "arm" us with the ability and merit and eventually, the wisdom to be able to remove them ourselves.

[DharmaDefender]

There are two ways that protectors help to clear our obstacles

1) no, a protector cannot just take away our karma and cancel out our karma. What protectors can do however, is to hold back a particular karma from manifesting at a particular time. This "buys us time" to practice and purify our karma so that it doesn't not ripen or, even if it does, the obstacle is not as disastrous or difficult as it would have been.

2) by doing protector practices - such as Dorje Shugden's, for example, who is one with Manjushri - we are also making offerings and prayers directly to an enlightened being. The merit we gain is incredible. At the same time, we open inherent imprints of Dharma. Together, this makes it easier for us to understand the Dharma teachings when we receive them. It also becomes easier for us to put these teachings into practice because we have the merit to support the practice. At the same time, before obstacles are removed (or lessened), there is more opportunity for us to practice. When we receive the teachings, practice, gain realisations then ultimately, we are able to gain the wisdom and means to remove our own obstacles.

Ultimately, this is what we aim for. What is wonderful about Dharma protector practice is that they don't just remove our problems with a magic wand. They "arm" us with the ability and merit and eventually, the wisdom to be able to remove them ourselves.

Guess it's really a case of "give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach him to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime"? The Dharma Protector practice teaches you responsibility for your own actions and karma. Once you have learned that responsibility, and all of the subsequent methods, you don't need anyone or anything else external for help because you are in control of your own karma.

Sorry but the control freak in me prefers that over my fate being left at the mercy of an external deity!

[jessicajameson]

If we do daily prayers to a protector, but during our dedication we request to our protector: "May I absorb/take on my mother's, father's, brother's, sister's etc negative karma" - do we really "get" their negative karma which then hopefully helps reduce their obstacles?

Or is it my karma is my karma, and their karma is their karma?

[DSFriend]

If we do daily prayers to a protector, but during our dedication we request to our protector: "May I absorb/take on my mother's, father's, brother's, sister's etc negative karma" - do we really "get" their negative karma which then hopefully helps reduce their obstacles?

Or is it my karma is my karma, and their karma is their karma?

From what I understand, that thinking and prayer with the wish to take on others' sufferings/karma helps to develop a mind of compassion - Bodhicitta. As unenlightened beings, we cannot actually absorb others' karma.

This is possible with a beings who have gained Bodhicitta and have realized the true nature of things - emptiness.

I look forward to more sharing and welcome any correction if what I have said is unclear or inaccurate.

[jessicajameson]

you're referring to unenlightened beings which excludes high-attained lamas right? because highly-attained lamas can absorb the suffering of others. isn't that why they get terrible illnesses (amongst other things), through absorbing the negative karma of their students and other people?

i find it aggravating when people have negative views towards buddhism, asking why do lamas get TB, diabetes etc. the mentality that: if they are so highly-attained why don't they just pray and get better? The ignorance of not understanding and not wanting to learn on this small scale is the same with the DS ban.

it's just as aggravating to hear people talk negatively towards HHDL, asking why does he act this way, why does he do this to these people etc, if he's so highly-attained why does he do what he does. It's the ignorance and unwillingness to understand and see things on a bigger scale.

[kurava]

i find it aggravating when people have negative views towards buddhism, asking why do lamas get TB, diabetes etc. the mentality that: if they are so highly-attained why don't they just pray and get better? The ignorance of not understanding and not wanting to learn on this small scale is the same with the DS ban.

From our ordinary perception, we see the Lama falls sick, experiences suffering and helpless just like us but there are many reasons why a Lama manifests sickness :

1) when we willingly do something , no matter how hard, we will not experience suffering or resistance;
    example : when a mother delivers a baby and she knows the pains she needs to go through before the baby can be
    born thus she "looks forward" to the labour pains because without the contraction pains the baby cannot be delivered.

2) as one of the Lama's skillful means to push the students to a higher level, the Lama willingly ( therefore no suffering is
    experienced) absorbs our negative karmas and manifests illness. Hopefully ,this will motivate the students to transform.

3) Our Lama's wish to help us develop compassion or bodhichitta.
     We may find it difficult to be genuinely kind to others. However, towards someone from whom we receive love and
     care eg. our parents or Guru, this virtuous quality may develop more readily. Therefore the Lama will "sacrifice" his
     body for the sake of the students.

4) When a Lama passes away, it can mean either the Lama has accomplished what he wishes to do in this life time or it is
    due to the lack of transformation from the students and thus created the cause for them to lose their Lama.

High Lamas can control their deaths and rebirths, controlling their own health is definitely not an issue. We need to look beyond the ordinary appearance to see the intentions of these high Lamas.

[WoselTenzin]

There are two ways that protectors help to clear our obstacles

1) no, a protector cannot just take away our karma and cancel out our karma. What protectors can do however, is to hold back a particular karma from manifesting at a particular time. This "buys us time" to practice and purify our karma so that it doesn't not ripen or, even if it does, the obstacle is not as disastrous or difficult as it would have been.

I have also heard that is how a  protector works but the exact mechanics of it is still a mystery.  However, since this is what has been taught by the highest Lamas I would believe it until such a time I can see the intricacies of how this "buying time" for us works.

[quote author=beggar link=topic=1067.msg13202#msg13202 date=1297270947

2) by doing protector practices - such as Dorje Shugden's, for example, who is one with Manjushri - we are also making offerings and prayers directly to an enlightened being. The merit we gain is incredible. At the same time, we open inherent imprints of Dharma. Together, this makes it easier for us to understand the Dharma teachings when we receive them. It also becomes easier for us to put these teachings into practice because we have the merit to support the practice. At the same time, before obstacles are removed (or lessened), there is more opportunity for us to practice. When we receive the teachings, practice, gain realisations then ultimately, we are able to gain the wisdom and means to remove our own obstacles.

Ultimately, this is what we aim for. What is wonderful about Dharma protector practice is that they don't just remove our problems with a magic wand. They "arm" us with the ability and merit and eventually, the wisdom to be able to remove them ourselves.
[/quote]

So there is no easy way out. We still have to work to accumulate merits so that we can internalise the wisdom teachings we acquire to clear our own obstacles.

[DSFriend]

you're referring to unenlightened beings which excludes high-attained lamas right? because highly-attained lamas can absorb the suffering of others. isn't that why they get terrible illnesses (amongst other things), through absorbing the negative karma of their students and other people?

i find it aggravating when people have negative views towards buddhism, asking why do lamas get TB, diabetes etc. the mentality that: if they are so highly-attained why don't they just pray and get better? The ignorance of not understanding and not wanting to learn on this small scale is the same with the DS ban.

it's just as aggravating to hear people talk negatively towards HHDL, asking why does he act this way, why does he do this to these people etc, if he's so highly-attained why does he do what he does. It's the ignorance and unwillingness to understand and see things on a bigger scale.

There must be a cause for such a wrong view towards  buddhism, the dharma, and holy beings. Well, talking about how people asks why the dalai lama act this way and that... the irony is that a huge number of people who knows dalai lama don't even know about the ban or not care about! They see him as an interfaith, peace promoter, religious leader.

[triesa]

There are two ways that protectors help to clear our obstacles

1) no, a protector cannot just take away our karma and cancel out our karma. What protectors can do however, is to hold back a particular karma from manifesting at a particular time. This "buys us time" to practice and purify our karma so that it doesn't not ripen or, even if it does, the obstacle is not as disastrous or difficult as it would have been.

2) by doing protector practices - such as Dorje Shugden's, for example, who is one with Manjushri - we are also making offerings and prayers directly to an enlightened being. The merit we gain is incredible. At the same time, we open inherent imprints of Dharma. Together, this makes it easier for us to understand the Dharma teachings when we receive them. It also becomes easier for us to put these teachings into practice because we have the merit to support the practice. At the same time, before obstacles are removed (or lessened), there is more opportunity for us to practice. When we receive the teachings, practice, gain realisations then ultimately, we are able to gain the wisdom and means to remove our own obstacles.

Ultimately, this is what we aim for. What is wonderful about Dharma protector practice is that they don't just remove our problems with a magic wand. They "arm" us with the ability and merit and eventually, the wisdom to be able to remove them ourselves.

Protector practice is very much a "Self Help" manual, when enough merits are accumulated, that will propel us to understand the law of karma and the nature of things, we can then go through our obstacles(when ripened) more easily, not to say it is easy, but at least we will not further create more negativities by wrongly reacting to the adversities and obstacles due to our own ignorance, wrong perception or delusions. Thus reducing further negative karma, so I think that is why we say we can change or control our own karma.

[DSFriend]

There are two ways that protectors help to clear our obstacles

1) no, a protector cannot just take away our karma and cancel out our karma. What protectors can do however, is to hold back a particular karma from manifesting at a particular time. This "buys us time" to practice and purify our karma so that it doesn't not ripen or, even if it does, the obstacle is not as disastrous or difficult as it would have been.

2) by doing protector practices - such as Dorje Shugden's, for example, who is one with Manjushri - we are also making offerings and prayers directly to an enlightened being. The merit we gain is incredible. At the same time, we open inherent imprints of Dharma. Together, this makes it easier for us to understand the Dharma teachings when we receive them. It also becomes easier for us to put these teachings into practice because we have the merit to support the practice. At the same time, before obstacles are removed (or lessened), there is more opportunity for us to practice. When we receive the teachings, practice, gain realisations then ultimately, we are able to gain the wisdom and means to remove our own obstacles.

Ultimately, this is what we aim for. What is wonderful about Dharma protector practice is that they don't just remove our problems with a magic wand. They "arm" us with the ability and merit and eventually, the wisdom to be able to remove them ourselves.

Guess it's really a case of "give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach him to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime"? The Dharma Protector practice teaches you responsibility for your own actions and karma. Once you have learned that responsibility, and all of the subsequent methods, you don't need anyone or anything else external for help because you are in control of your own karma.

Sorry but the control freak in me prefers that over my fate being left at the mercy of an external deity!

Nice analogy.

When we are inflicted with pain, be it physically, emotionally, or mentally we have to go through it on our own. Eventhough we have friends whom we think we can "share" the pain with, in actuality, no one can "take away" any of the negative emotions. It's just that the mind changed, adopt new views and we suffer less for that moment.

The problem with most of us is when certain karma opens and we suffer, we do not actually purify. We actually may be creating even more negativity because of anger which arises.

Just like beggar shared, Dorje Shugden helping us to hold back our karma is so important. It buys us some time to engage in spiritual practices so that we can change the course of our lives at the end of the day...and not just putting some band aid over it.

[Helena]

Well said, Beggar and DS Friend!

What you both wrote is both inspiring and empowering.

Who else can protect us, and at the same time, hold back our Karma so that we can get the remedies we need to become healers of our own and to heal others as well?

Only Dorje Shugden.

With Dorje Shugden, we can change our destiny.

[beggar]

I have also been advised that you can also do Dharma Protector practices to help clear the obstacles for someone else. An example: there are some people that we might wish to bring to Dharma and introduce the teachings to them, but it is very difficult for them to learn or obstacles always arise that literally stop them from even coming to the Dharma centre or being able to participate in any of the activities. So in this case, we can also propitiate the dharma protectors like Dorje Shugden to help remove the obstacles or provide the right conditions for this person to come to Dharma.

I think this is something spectacular to consider - Dorje Shugden doesn't just help us on a simple level, but helps us to help others. And so the love spreads. 

[triesa]

Providing the right conditions can very well be a small mishap that brings the person to Dharma for solution.

[DSFriend]

Yes! How kind, how compassionate, how caring Dorje Shugden is. This means that we receive his protection not only for ourselves alone, but for our parents, for our loved ones, for others.

Besides material contributions, there's not much else I can do to repay my parents kindness. Howelse can I help others as i have not acquired skillful means and wisdom.

Just thinking about how Dorje Shugden helps us to help others puts my mind at rest, knowing that my parents will be well, many others will be helped by engaging in this holy practice.