Heavily Promoting their Domo Geshe Rinpoche (the other candidate)

[LosangKhyentse]

As everyone knows Domo Geshe Rinpoche has revered His Holiness Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche in his previous incarnations as his root guru. His previous incarnation was recognized by Trijang Rinpoche. The current incarnation was also recognized by the current Trijang Rinpoche. But the Tibetan Govt is not happy with this situation as the current recognized Domo Geshe Rinpoche has joined Shar Gaden Monastery. In order to counter Trijang Rinpoche's recognition and Shar Gaden, Dalai Lama has recognized another Domo Geshe Rinpoche!

See this facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/domogeshe#!/domogeshe

Ordination
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=27327&id=134552456609401

Seal of Dalai Lama:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=1968&id=100002006375179

They make sure the seal of the Dalai Lama is seen clear and prominent on the facebook and websites. What Tulku/Rinpoche's facebook/website advertises their recognition seal for you to see? It is unnecessary. Unless you are out to prove your point and quash an opponent? In this case to disqualify the Domo Geshe Rinpoche recognized by Trijang Rinpoche perhaps. Very petty and very sad indeed. Why would they wish to undermine Trijang Rinpoche except because he practices Dorje Shugden and is affiliated with Shar Gaden Monastery.

Domo Geshe's website:
http://domo-gesherinpoche.org/

It is very sad that this recognition is seen as petty and unnecessary. If Trijang Rinpoche has recognized a Domo Geshe Rinpoche, why would you go out and recognize a second one? Is that not reminiscent of Sharmapa recognizing a Karmapa then Dalai Lama/Tibetan Govt recognizes another one? Does that not undermine Sharmapa Rinpoche? Is it intended to purposely undermine Sharmapa? If so what is the purpose? The Dalai Lama has no history, precedence or authority to actually recognize a Karmapa according to time honored traditions. By recognizing one, it seem to create so much confusion. Same situation now with Domo Geshe Rinpoche.

Only time will tell, which Domo Geshe Rinpoche will fulfill the heavy responsibilities placed upon his young shoulders.

TK

[Zach]

Very bad news. 

[Big Uncle]

I can't believe this is also happening to the incarnation of the Domo Geshe Rinpoche! The recognition is indeed very familiar and similar to the two contending Karmapa situation. The recognition and the way they present the incarnation recognized by the Dalai Lama is definitely to undermine the other incarnation recognized by the Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche.

I wonder how are things going to unravel and I am pretty sure they are both emanations of Domo Geshe Rinpoche but only one must be the mind emanation or the direct incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche. I am not psychic but I am pretty sure that the incarnation recognized by Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche is the mind emanation. Like what Tk said, I am sure the incarnations will manifest their identity through their activities...

[WisdomBeing]

I was just reading under the News from Shar Gaden thread (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=688.msg13650#msg13650) that one of Zemey Rinpoche's students wanted to recognise another tulku to counter the reincarnation of Zemey Rinpoche who is in Tibet currently.

On that thread, Tenzin Sungrab says that "Many of the prior Zemey Rinpoche's students are now senior monks here at Shar Gaden, and it was these students, as well as a few Rinpoches here, that helped locate the present tulku.

I was told that Thupten Jimpa, the Dalai Lama's English translator and student of the late Zemey Rinpoche, tried to interfere with the process and promote his own choice as the true tulku. In the end, he backed down when he realized that the people from Zemey Rinpoche's home monastery in Tibet, as well as all almost all of Zemey Rinpoche's prior students, would only accept the choice of our lineage Lamas here at Shar Gaden."

Together with the Panchen Lama, Domo Geshe Rinpoche, the Karmapa, is each high Lama going to manifest as two people from now on? This can really become divisive! As if we do not have enough problems to deal with.

[thaimonk]

I was just reading under the News from Shar Gaden thread (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=688.msg13650#msg13650) that one of Zemey Rinpoche's students wanted to recognise another tulku to counter the reincarnation of Zemey Rinpoche who is in Tibet currently.

On that thread, Tenzin Sungrab says that "Many of the prior Zemey Rinpoche's students are now senior monks here at Shar Gaden, and it was these students, as well as a few Rinpoches here, that helped locate the present tulku.

I was told that Thupten Jimpa, the Dalai Lama's English translator and student of the late Zemey Rinpoche, tried to interfere with the process and promote his own choice as the true tulku. In the end, he backed down when he realized that the people from Zemey Rinpoche's home monastery in Tibet, as well as all almost all of Zemey Rinpoche's prior students, would only accept the choice of our lineage Lamas here at Shar Gaden."

Together with the Panchen Lama, Domo Geshe Rinpoche, the Karmapa, is each high Lama going to manifest as two people from now on? This can really become divisive! As if we do not have enough problems to deal with.

I am very disappointed to hear Thupten Jinpa tried to find his own candidate. It seems from this Thupten Jinpa is playing politics. Thupten Jinpa has no qualifications to find the new incarnation of Zemey Rinpoche. When Zemey Rinpoche was put down and ostracized by the Tibetan Govt, Thupten Jinpa still worked for the Tibetan govt. Thupten Jinpa from all appearances did nothing to protect or help Zemey Rinpoche.

[Helena]

Everything seems to be coming in twos.

Two different Karmapas, two different Domo Geshes, two different Panchen Lama, and etc

A division is definitely clear.

Time will tell which one falls like a house of cards and which one remains.

In any case, Enlightened Beings have their own ways of making things known and for bringing Dharma to places where it is needed most for the long run.

Let those play politics be dealt by their own karma of politicking.

Let them waste their time and energy on those.

We shall concentrate on our practice and promoting our great Protector.

[WisdomBeing]

For the authentic lineage to continue, the reincarnated high lamas MUST be recognised and guided to continue their previous lives' great works.. so unfortunately, whether we like it or not, we have to be aware of what is going on as it is the future of our lineage.

It is ironic that it will probably be the reincarnations of the Dalai Lama who will have multiple recognitions and much dispute. Personally, I trust the new Trijang Rinpoche - I hope he will be able to reveal his potential and continue and develop the Shugden lineage.

[WoselTenzin]

I was just reading under the News from Shar Gaden thread (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=688.msg13650#msg13650) that one of Zemey Rinpoche's students wanted to recognise another tulku to counter the reincarnation of Zemey Rinpoche who is in Tibet currently.

On that thread, Tenzin Sungrab says that "Many of the prior Zemey Rinpoche's students are now senior monks here at Shar Gaden, and it was these students, as well as a few Rinpoches here, that helped locate the present tulku.

I was told that Thupten Jimpa, the Dalai Lama's English translator and student of the late Zemey Rinpoche, tried to interfere with the process and promote his own choice as the true tulku. In the end, he backed down when he realized that the people from Zemey Rinpoche's home monastery in Tibet, as well as all almost all of Zemey Rinpoche's prior students, would only accept the choice of our lineage Lamas here at Shar Gaden."

Together with the Panchen Lama, Domo Geshe Rinpoche, the Karmapa, is each high Lama going to manifest as two people from now on? This can really become divisive! As if we do not have enough problems to deal with.

I am very disappointed to hear Thupten Jinpa tried to find his own candidate. It seems from this Thupten Jinpa is playing politics. Thupten Jinpa has no qualifications to find the new incarnation of Zemey Rinpoche. When Zemey Rinpoche was put down and ostracized by the Tibetan Govt, Thupten Jinpa still worked for the Tibetan govt. Thupten Jinpa from all appearances did nothing to protect or help Zemey Rinpoche.

I am shocked to know that Thupten Jinpa actually worked for the Tibetan Govt when his own Guru, Zemey Rinpoche was put down and ostracized by the Tibetan Govt. How can one betray anyone whom one has receive so much kindness from let alone one's Guru who teaches us the Dharma?  And now he wants to find his own candidate of the reincarnation of his Guru defying the choice of  senior monk students of his Guru and other Rinpoches? Power struggle and hypocrisy seem to be prevalent everywhere in samsara whether in lay or monastic community

[Vajraprotector]

I wonder how are things going to unravel and I am pretty sure they are both emanations of Domo Geshe Rinpoche but only one must be the mind emanation or the direct incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche. I am not psychic but I am pretty sure that the incarnation recognized by Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche is the mind emanation. Like what Tk said, I am sure the incarnations will manifest their identity through their activities...

To add to the confusion, there is also ANOTHER Western (female) incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche (http://www.white-conch.org/Domo-Geshe-Rinpoche.html), which was not recognised by any high lama. I think we get the picture of why many people are very confused and hence have decided to not believe in the "Tulku system".  I am very glad that we still have institutions and great lamas around to guide us and for us to make sound judgement.

To the public out there, there are only 2 differing factors:
a) Tulkus recognised by the Dalai Lama
b) Tulkus who are NOT recognised by the Dalai Lama

So when the Dalai Lama is no longer with us, I wonder who will be the "authority" that the public will listen to?

Anyway, this is the website of Domo Chocktrul Rinpoche (Losang Jigme Nyak-gi Wangchuk) recognised by HH Trijang Chocktrul Rinpoche: http://www.domogesherinpoche.org/

[Losang_Tenpa]

I wonder how are things going to unravel and I am pretty sure they are both emanations of Domo Geshe Rinpoche but only one must be the mind emanation or the direct incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche. I am not psychic but I am pretty sure that the incarnation recognized by Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche is the mind emanation. Like what Tk said, I am sure the incarnations will manifest their identity through their activities...

To add to the confusion, there is also ANOTHER Western (female) incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche (http://www.white-conch.org/Domo-Geshe-Rinpoche.html), which was not recognised by any high lama. I think we get the picture of why many people are very confused and hence have decided to not believe in the "Tulku system".  I am very glad that we still have institutions and great lamas around to guide us and for us to make sound judgement.

To the public out there, there are only 2 differing factors:
a) Tulkus recognised by the Dalai Lama
b) Tulkus who are NOT recognised by the Dalai Lama

So when the Dalai Lama is no longer with us, I wonder who will be the "authority" that the public will listen to?

Anyway, this is the website of Domo Chocktrul Rinpoche (Losang Jigme Nyak-gi Wangchuk) recognised by HH Trijang Chocktrul Rinpoche: http://www.domogesherinpoche.org/

 I don't think many Gelugpa take this woman seriously. She has a strong facebook following though. Students of the prior Domo Geshe Rinpoche in America are seeking legal action against her due to her refusal to stop using the name Domo Rinpoche. It is basically identity theft if a person profits from using another's name. Identity theft is a very serious matter in America.

 

[jessicajameson]

I heard that both the Panchen Lama recognized by HHDL and the Chinese government are both equally, genuinely the Panchen Lama.

Can this not be applied to Domo Geshe Rinpoche?

Thanks

[Big Uncle]

I wonder how are things going to unravel and I am pretty sure they are both emanations of Domo Geshe Rinpoche but only one must be the mind emanation or the direct incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche. I am not psychic but I am pretty sure that the incarnation recognized by Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche is the mind emanation. Like what Tk said, I am sure the incarnations will manifest their identity through their activities...

To add to the confusion, there is also ANOTHER Western (female) incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche (http://www.white-conch.org/Domo-Geshe-Rinpoche.html), which was not recognised by any high lama. I think we get the picture of why many people are very confused and hence have decided to not believe in the "Tulku system".  I am very glad that we still have institutions and great lamas around to guide us and for us to make sound judgement.

To the public out there, there are only 2 differing factors:
a) Tulkus recognised by the Dalai Lama
b) Tulkus who are NOT recognised by the Dalai Lama

So when the Dalai Lama is no longer with us, I wonder who will be the "authority" that the public will listen to?

Anyway, this is the website of Domo Chocktrul Rinpoche (Losang Jigme Nyak-gi Wangchuk) recognised by HH Trijang Chocktrul Rinpoche: http://www.domogesherinpoche.org/

 I don't think many Gelugpa take this woman seriously. She has a strong facebook following though. Students of the prior Domo Geshe Rinpoche in America are seeking legal action against her due to her refusal to stop using the name Domo Rinpoche. It is basically identity theft if a person profits from using another's name. Identity theft is a very serious matter in America.
 

Well, I am amazed at how she dare assume his name like that and start becoming a Lama based on a story like that. I am sure Lamas are capable of mind transference (she claimed to have Domo Geshe Rinpoche assumed her body upon his death) but nobody of spiritual authority is recognizing her at all. Where is the basis of her teachings and what is her lineage? It is scary to see so many people receive teachings from her and I hope she is leading and teaching them well irregardless of whether she is Domo Geshe Rinpoche or not. I think there is something quite wrong as the great monasteries and Lamas are recognizing the incarnation(s) of Domo Geshe Rinpoche but she goes on her merry little way ignoring everyone else....

[Ensapa]

I now see the reason why CTA/Dalai Lama wants a second Kamarpa: They want to eradicate and replace lamas that are pro Dorje Shugden. They do not care if they destroy a lineage, they just want political correctness. And in the process, there will be a lot of casualties, both on the cultural side and most importantly, the huge damage that has been done towards Tibetan Buddhism.

Dalai Lama's recognition is important, but so is the authenticity of the reincarnations. If the reincarnations are chosen based only on the political position such as which Dharma protector they practice, this will destroy and pulverize the entire tulku system because its like saying that anyone can be a tulku as long as that person follows our political side, we will build that person up as a tulku.

This pretty much makes the actual incarnation irrelevant…so what is the point of the tulku system then? Since when it was conceived to be a political maneuver? I am sure Dusun Kyempha did not return for this to happen, neither did he start this system only for it to become nothing but a political tool. However, the actual incarnations do not need titles to do their Dharma works, they're beyond that so this just invalidates the tulku system…and there will be impact but it won't stop the incarnations from performing great deeds.

It is funny that they chose their on Domo Geshe Rinpoche because the real one will always outshine the fake one, always. And it is more or less too late for them to choose a 2nd incarnation haha. However, they did forget one candidate of Domo Geshe Rinpoche that does not practice Dorje Shugden tho:

[dondrup]

Two Panchen Lamas, two Karmapas, one (almost two!) Zemey Rinpoches, two (should be three?) Domo Geshe Rinpoches, these actual incarnations or ‘fake’ incarnations are creating a lot of confusions for those not familiar with the Tulku system in Tibetan Buddhism.  Perhaps this is the reason why NKT chose not to adopt the Tulku system as part of their organizational policies.  Tulku system is not bad and it is still relevant today but it is subject to abuse by so many people or parties who may have ulterior motives! These people will sooner or later destroy the Tulku system!  The Western female incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche and Thupten Jinpa are clear examples.

I am curious to know HH Dalai Lama’s intention.  HH Dalai Lama is Chenrezig a fully enlightened Buddha who is omniscient and all knowing. Surely all that HH Dalai Lama had done to-date e.g. the ban and recognition of “other” Tulku has deeper meanings?

Samsara is already bad enough.  But with all these “doubles” or “triples” manifesting, soon every Tom, Dick and Harry will start to claim they are Rinpoches or some kind of high Tulkus! China will definitely take advantage of this.  They have already had their own Panchen Lama!  Will China start to appoint a new Gaden Tripa?   The sign of degeneration is dawning!

I fully agree with Ensapa on this
“ the actual incarnations do not need titles to do their Dharma works, they're beyond that so this just invalidates the tulku system…and there will be impact but it won't stop the incarnations from performing great deeds. “

The truth will prevail.  Only the results from the work done by these multiple Tulkus will prove who ultimately the genuine ones are!

I did not mean to sound disrespectful to HH Dalai Lama and all the incarnations mentioned above.  This is just my observation of the dilemma the Tulku system is having now.

[Lineageholder]

Two Panchen Lamas, two Karmapas, one (almost two!) Zemey Rinpoches, two (should be three?) Domo Geshe Rinpoches, these actual incarnations or ‘fake’ incarnations are creating a lot of confusions for those not familiar with the Tulku system in Tibetan Buddhism.  Perhaps this is the reason why NKT chose not to adopt the Tulku system as part of their organizational policies.  Tulku system is not bad and it is still relevant today but it is subject to abuse by so many people or parties who may have ulterior motives! These people will sooner or later destroy the Tulku system!  The Western female incarnation of Domo Geshe Rinpoche and Thupten Jinpa are clear examples.

There is a worse scenario:  the Tulku system destroying Buddhism.