Is Shugden practice just a minor practice by a few Tibetans?

[WisdomBeing]

I just saw this inspirational photo of Shar Gaden monks on their facebook, with this accompanying text:

This is called a virtual evidence:
people who struggle hard to demoralize our fellows and our sympathizers around the world stating that "the certain practitioners are now very few left in India - the remaining won't last that long-soon they will give up easily too"
I don't think these are count as if VERY FEW !!

I certainly don't think these are just a few practitioners and a fading practice...

Shar Gaden and Serpom Monasteries are growing in leaps and bounds... they are continuously building to accommodate their expanding Sangha.

NKT is also one of the fastest growing Buddhist centres in the western hemisphere...

And this is a forbidden practice. The sole reason for Shar Gaden and Serpom's existence is their loyalty to Dorje Shugden. Can you imagine if there was no ban, how many more would be able to freely and openly practice....

[dsiluvu]

  Yes I think everyone's going to be extremely surprised when the ban fizzles out... and out comes the "freaks" so they call us...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qcJa8vKWS4&feature=player_embedded
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I am so thankful for this website as all Dorje Shugden practitioners can be connected and united here. Some read and go, some share, some gain strength, faith, and wisdom. 

Here we can gather in harmony, with the same aspirations and vision we share our experiences, thoughts and practice. We can continue to do our practice peacefully, we continue our devotion to our Gurus and Dorje Shugden, preserving the teaching for the our future. Shar Gaden and Serpom Monastery don't look like they will stop growing, not counting the many monasteries in Tibet who is practising ever so strongly now because they can.... http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=1155.0

[DharmaSpace]

When Pabongka Rinpoche and Trijang Rinpoche , all kinds of people , lay, ordained, ministers, practitioners from different sects also attended their talks in the thousands.

And when I read the Trijang Bio, it made a lot of sense that Dorje Shugden is the protector of the coming age of dharma, as so many come to listen to lamas who practiced Dorje shugden 1)00%. Dorje Shugden is really suitable for these times which is why the teachings of the great Gelug lamas attracted so many to listen to them.

And I really liked what the previous Karmapa had to say about tDorje Shugden one day in the future we will all be propitiating to Dorje Shugden. The Holy Karmapa is prophesised to manifest his Buddhahood within the 1000 Buddhas of this fortunate aeon. 

[DharmaDefender]

Not particularly. If you think about it, like DharmaSpace said, how many people were students of Pabongka Rinpoche and Trijang Rinpoche, and of Zong Rinpoche? So logically, how many people got the practice?

Anyway, when it comes to lamas with such attainments like them, it's illogical to say that the practice is minor, and done by only a few Tibetans...why would lamas of such high reputation make Dorje Shugden their main protector practice, if not to say that he was big and going to become big later?

In his bio, why would Trijang Rinpoche demonstrate that Dorje Shugden play such a big role in his life? AND if Dorje Shugden were a minor practice or deity, then why did His Holiness the Dalai Lama follow Dorje Shugden's advice when he was fleeing Tibet?

[thor]

Here is an interesting thought... The biggest most populous country in the world has gotta be China. Imagine if Dorje Shugden practice made it big in China, and spread like wildfire amongst the billions of people who, as a matter of fact, really need his help. We won't be talking about any minor practice, but possibly what will come to be one of the most popular practices the world over.

Whatever Dalai Lama wants to accomplish with his ban, China's eyes are on him. Whatever he promotes is frowned upon... so logically speaking, whatever he is against, would have a good chance at gaining acceptance with the Chinese folks...  If that happens, I hope I am around to see it!

[hope rainbow]

Here is an interesting thought... The biggest most populous country in the world has gotta be China. Imagine if Dorje Shugden practice made it big in China, and spread like wildfire amongst the billions of people who, as a matter of fact, really need his help. We won't be talking about any minor practice, but possibly what will come to be one of the most popular practices the world over.

Whatever Dalai Lama wants to accomplish with his ban, China's eyes are on him. Whatever he promotes is frowned upon... so logically speaking, whatever he is against, would have a good chance at gaining acceptance with the Chinese folks...  If that happens, I hope I am around to see it!

I think this is propaganda. The "only a few" is what it may look like for some and from some place where the ban is in full swing.
And even there, it does not count for those that do not make public their faith.
One needs to look further to see that the practice is growing, especially in China.
There is a good chance that most of us will see the practice of Dorje Shugden fully come into the light, and I hope to be around to witness it and be part of it.

[WisdomBeing]

i just think it's contradictory that some people claim it's a minor practice done by only a few practitioners. If it is really like that, then why bother imposing a ban? It isn't logical.

There is no point imposing a ban in China because China does not recognise the Dalai Lama anyway - so I was wondering if there is any records of how many DS practitioners there are in China alone...

Who are the main DS Lamas in China (not counting Tibet)?

[DharmaSpace]

@wisdombeing
thats right if the practice is done by a minority why have the ban in the first place? And by stirring the 'hornet's nest' it made the practice even more well known and accessble by many beings out there.

I thought Ganghen Rinpoche operates in china which is why TGIE have a bounty on his head, Daknak Rinppoche is another one.

[beggar]

Simple mathematics my friends!

More than 90% of Gelugpa practitioners relied on Dorje Shugden and did his practice strongly. This is certainly true in Gaden itself, which is among the most prominent monasteries throughout Tibet.

Many of the Gelugpa lamas (Trijang Rinpoche, Pabongka Rinpoche) were among the most influential in Tibet (and the world), and Gelug was the fastest and widest spread lineage in the country (that's before they left Tibet - imagine how much faster and more widespread in the world now). So it is quite logical to see that it certainly is NOT a minor practice if some of the country's most respected lamas with the widest followings did the practice!

[vajrastorm]

Thanks to this website for giving us so much evidence that Dorje Shugden practice is flourishing and spreading not only in Asia but elsewhere in the world too. We see monasteries specially set up by monks who would defy the ban, like Shar Gaden and Serpom and how fast they are growing. We see other Dorje Shugden centers and monasteries being set up elsewhere in Taiwan, in Europe and in New Zealand and in the US, to name a few countries. We also see Dorje Shugden practice spreading and growing in China, the world's most populous country as well as potentially the greatest powerhouse in the world.
Behind all this hard evidence lies the supreme effort of many great Masters and the legacy of influence of great Masters like Pabongka Rinpoche and Trijang Rinpoche.

So how can anyone believe unfounded statements that declare that the Shugden practice is a minor practice by only a few Tibetans  whose numbers are dwindling?     

[dsiluvu]

Simple mathematics my friends!

More than 90% of Gelugpa practitioners relied on Dorje Shugden and did his practice strongly. This is certainly true in Gaden itself, which is among the most prominent monasteries throughout Tibet.

Many of the Gelugpa lamas (Trijang Rinpoche, Pabongka Rinpoche) were among the most influential in Tibet (and the world), and Gelug was the fastest and widest spread lineage in the country (that's before they left Tibet - imagine how much faster and more widespread in the world now). So it is quite logical to see that it certainly is NOT a minor practice if some of the country's most respected lamas with the widest followings did the practice!

And can we imagine what will happened when DS practice takes on root in China?! It will just spread like wild fire then. Already as we speak, monasteries practising DS continues in Tibet, and new one mushrooming. What about the China named Panchen Lama? He has nothing stopping him from practising and spreading DS.

Even if DS is spread to just China alone...how many billion is that... 1,331,460,000 (2009's statistics) So imagine!

[DharmaDefender]

I thought Ganghen Rinpoche operates in china which is why TGIE have a bounty on his head, Daknak Rinppoche is another one.

Pah! The TGIE will slap that label on anyone if it serves their purpose! So what if Gangchen Rinpoche operates in China? The Chinese are sentient beings too!

Many of the Gelugpa lamas (Trijang Rinpoche, Pabongka Rinpoche) were among the most influential in Tibet (and the world), and Gelug was the fastest and widest spread lineage in the country (that's before they left Tibet - imagine how much faster and more widespread in the world now). So it is quite logical to see that it certainly is NOT a minor practice if some of the country's most respected lamas with the widest followings did the practice!

For me its more than just influential. The DS-practising lamas have some of the most troubling life stories Ive ever heard. Just an immense amount of pain and suffering they go through more so than what any other ordinary being would be able to withstanding. Thinking about it, if the Panchen Lama can suffer 30-odd years of Chinese torture, why cant he spread DS if he ever made it his intention? The ban only serves to highlight the resolve of DS practitioners to serve their lama, yidam and protector, no matter what the obstacles.

[tsangpakarpo]

I find this old topic quite funny. After reading through this website and forum, I can be sure Dorje Shugden is not only practiced by merely A FEW Tibetans.

People from all over the world now knows about Dorje Shugden. The number of practitioners are increasing rapidly as well. If Dorje Shugden is a spirit and not effective, why are there more and more people practicing? I'm sure we all have 'gained' something out of our practice. For me, it is a peace of mind knowing that my protector will always be there to protect me from obstacles to my dharma learning.

Also, a few weeks back my friends who attended Serpom Monastery's new prayer hall told me they saw many many foreigners were present to witness the opening. All of them are Dorje Shugden practitioners from AROUND THE WORLD!

[Carpenter]

A very interesting conversation here. I do notice that people who practice Dorje Shugden are not only increasing in number, also, the sufferings and difficulties that the practitioner went through, they do not develop hatred or becoming self centered, in fact, they have developed a stronger and wider heart to accept everything.

They have faith in their practice, they trust and going all the way to whenever they can to benefit people. From their transformation, from their influential, today, more and more people are coming to accept and even start practicing Dorje Shugden.

In Tibet? Maybe the people who practice Dorje Shugden are consider minor, but for worldwide, it is definitely not.

[Galen]

Evidence that Shugden practice is not by just a few Tibetans:

1. The opening of Serpom Monastery. The monastery is huge and is similar size to Sera Mey. And during the opening ceremony, the whole prayer hall is full and even spill out to the courtyard. There were also a lot of foreigners from the East and West who attended.

2. Shar Gaden is building new monk hostels. This means that more monks are coming into the monastery and need to cater for their needs. More monks = more practitioners.

3. New DS chapels in Thailand which the practice is uncommon in that part of the world. Even a place with little Tibetans are practicing DS and flourishing.

4. More and more DS materials (books, comics, brochures, pendants etc) are being circulated, means more people will be practicing.

5. More and more members in this forum is also evidence that DS is growing.

That's all for now.