Lama Zopa says Dorje Shugden is an Arya at first.

[mountains]

May 16, 1997

Advice given by Lama Zopa to his students: Therefore, it becomes very important to support His Holiness and to fulfill His Holiness’ wishes. For that reason, Kopan Monastery stopped doing this practice. This was done for His Holiness. This does not mean that Pabongka Dechen Nyingpo, His Holiness Trijang Rinpoche, and His Holiness Song Rinpoche have made mistakes. It does not mean they are wrong. Nor does one have to look at the protector as evil. For us ordinary people it is difficult to judge, because we cannot see these lamas’ minds. Another side of the teaching is that it is mentioned that the protector is an Arya Bodhisattva, a manifestation of Manjushri. So, then, there is also the risk of our creating very heavy karma in that context.

(extracted from www.shugdensociety.info)

[whitelion]

This is very interesting, Lama Zapo or FPMT is one of the first few school that stop Dorje Shugden practice when the ban first started. We all know Lama Zopa is one of the most renounce Lama in Gelug school, if DS Shugden is an evil spirit why don't Lama Zopa tell us straight up ?

In above advice from Lama Zopa to his students stated very clear that he stop propitiate Dorje Shugden it's because Dalai Lama, not DS lineage or practice is bad or harmful to us. We have to understand that Lama Zopa's root teacher, Lama Yeshe is one of the main DS practitioner, if Lama Yeshe knows this practice is bad, he will not passed down to Lama Zopa and harm his own student. Obviously all the great lama knows that's nothing wrong about this 350 years practice but due to the pressure from CTA, they have no choice but to give up. I'm strongly believe great lama such as Lama Zopa still practicing DS in the dark, as he show so much faith in Lama Osel who is the reincarnation of Lama Yeshe. If Lama Yeshe was wrong, why Lama Zopa still recognise him in this reincarnation ??

A lot of students in FPMT created a lot of problem towards DS practitioners but it doesn't mean Lama Zopa agreed on all this act from the students. So far, Lama Zopa have not said a word against DS or DS lama, why ? Because there's nothing wrong about it, and Lama Zopa need to stop practicing DS due to respect to HH Dalai Lama.

Remember Lama Zopa hinting in his advice to his students that there is also risk of creating very heavy karma by banning DS practice, even a high lama like Lama Zopa show so much faith and believe to DS, why should anyone from FPMT show against towards DS? Unless they are openly against Lama Zopa's advice. If the student openly against the advice from the teacher which created a lot of bad karma that the teacher need to absorb, which also make sense why Lama Zopa suffered from stroke last year.

I'm felt very sad when i first heard Lama Zopa was suffered from the sickness, but now I understand why. FPMT, do you realised it now ?

[dondrup]

Lama Zopa’s advice can be summarised as:
1)   Follow our root guru’s advice on whether to practise or abandon Dorje Shugden.   Lama Zopa followed HHDL’s advice by stopping Kopan Monastery from doing Dorje Shugden practice
2)   Pabongka Dechen Nyingpo, Trijang Rinpoche, Song Rinpoche had not made mistakes in practising Dorje Shugden
3)   Dorje Shugden is not evil.  Dorje Shugden is Arya or Bodhisattva Manjushri
4)   We should not judge Pabongka Dechen Nyingpo, Trijang Rinpoche or Song Rinpoche.  Nor should we judge Dorje Shugden. In both cases, there is the risk of heavy karma

[Ensapa]

It is pretty clear that Lama Zopa is still a DS Lama although outwardly he cannot say that he is because he cannot go against the Dalai Lama or it would mean confusing a large number of people who are also the Dalai Lama's students who go to his centers around the world. I can see it from that perspective. But the actions of his zealous students against Dorje Shugden and their practitioners are uncalled for in any way, shape or form. Thus Lama Zopa manifested stroke. Lama Zopa went to visit Trijang Rinpoche's stupa as a message to us all that he is still a DS practitioner. Else why would he go there all of a sudden? There is even news of Kopan requesting DS pujas from a DS temple in Nepal. When the ban is lifted, I wonder if Lama Zopa would openly promote Dorje Shugden and Lama Osel would come back? only time will tell.

[diablo1974]

Although this message from Lama Zopa Rinpoche was from more than ten years ago, but i believe it hasnt change much from what he has said even if he is being interviewed again. He has made a few very important and practical points to one should not judge Dorje shudgen as evil and the lineage masters whom had practised it did not make any mistakes.  I think the next public speech (related to DS) if there is any given by Lama Zopa would be declaring openly in supporting the lifting of the ban of DS practice.

[WisdomBeing]

From what I have read of Lama Zopa, he is a wonderful master. However, he must be placed in a hugely difficult position as he felt he had to support the Dalai Lama on his stance on Dorje Shugden.

Lama Zopa’s message here tells me that he does not believe there is anything wrong with Dorje Shugden practice but that the is only following the Dalai Lama’s instructions. I don’t think any of us have any right to judge whether Lama Zopa did the right thing or not – I have heard some Dorje Shugden practitioners say that he should not have given up his practice just because the Dalai Lama says so. Who are we to judge since we are not in Lama Zopa’s shoes. I believe Lama Zopa is attained and will know best what to do under the circumstances he is in.

After all who identified Lama Zopa as a Rinpoche? Dorje Shugden of course. (see “Who made Lama Zopa a Rinpoche http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=49.0)

Personally, I believe that Lama Zopa would not have given up his practice as it came from his root guru HH Trijang Rinpoche. Lama Zopa visiting Trijang Rinpoche’s stupa is for the same reason – that he has tremendous devotion to Trijang Rinpoche.

I am sure Lama Zopa is pained that he cannot visit HH Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche, the incarnation of his beloved Guru, but once the ban is lifted, he will be able to. Let us all pray that the ban is lifted very soon, so that students and teachers and the divided sangha in the various monasteries can be reunited again.

[dsiluvu]

May 16, 1997

Advice given by Lama Zopa to his students: Therefore, it becomes very important to support His Holiness and to fulfill His Holiness’ wishes. For that reason, Kopan Monastery stopped doing this practice. This was done for His Holiness. This does not mean that Pabongka Dechen Nyingpo, His Holiness Trijang Rinpoche, and His Holiness Song Rinpoche have made mistakes. It does not mean they are wrong. Nor does one have to look at the protector as evil. For us ordinary people it is difficult to judge, because we cannot see these lamas’ minds. Another side of the teaching is that it is mentioned that the protector is an Arya Bodhisattva, a manifestation of Manjushri. So, then, there is also the risk of our creating very heavy karma in that context.

From reading this paragraph it is very clear why Lama Zopa ordered FPMT to stop practicing Dorje Shugden and it is for the only reason... His Holiness the Dalai Lama. So any new excuse and words that will arise and said there is a choice given and people can make up their own minds whether or not to practice... we;; it's quite clear here that it was not so much a non-biased choice or request but more of a wish. And to some who were there in the monasteries experiencing it first hand, it was a pretty enforced wish. Otherwise why would you make monks swear in and pick yellow or red sticks???

From this para it is also very clear that Lama Zopa has not "given up" on Dorje Shugden or thinks He is evil. And definitely does think His Guru, HH Trijang Rinpoche and also our lineage father, HH Pabongka Rinpoche is wrong at all. In fact Lama Zopa on top of that warns us not to judge and risk creating heavy negative karma for if Dorje Shugden is a Arya Bodhisattva Manjushri, then what?

So it looks like Lama Zopa if following the advice of His Guru Trijang Rinpoche which has been prophesied in Music Delighting what we are experiencing today. So perhaps Lama Zopa is in fact following His Guru's advice? Just like how Samdhong Rinpoche serve HHDL as PM and then later when he retired He confessed it was simply because He was instructed by Guru - HH Trijang Rinpoche. 

Yes it is best for us not to judge or condemn what these great highly attained masters are doing, I am sure they have thought it through the best way from all angles and I am sure it is always for the long term. Yes I do agree with WB, after the ban is lifted, it will be very easy for Lama Zopa/FPMT to revive the practice to Dorje Shugden again.

[Ensapa]

From reading this paragraph it is very clear why Lama Zopa ordered FPMT to stop practicing Dorje Shugden and it is for the only reason... His Holiness the Dalai Lama. So any new excuse and words that will arise and said there is a choice given and people can make up their own minds whether or not to practice... we;; it's quite clear here that it was not so much a non-biased choice or request but more of a wish. And to some who were there in the monasteries experiencing it first hand, it was a pretty enforced wish. Otherwise why would you make monks swear in and pick yellow or red sticks???

From this para it is also very clear that Lama Zopa has not "given up" on Dorje Shugden or thinks He is evil. And definitely does think His Guru, HH Trijang Rinpoche and also our lineage father, HH Pabongka Rinpoche is wrong at all. In fact Lama Zopa on top of that warns us not to judge and risk creating heavy negative karma for if Dorje Shugden is a Arya Bodhisattva Manjushri, then what?

So it looks like Lama Zopa if following the advice of His Guru Trijang Rinpoche which has been prophesied in Music Delighting what we are experiencing today. So perhaps Lama Zopa is in fact following His Guru's advice? Just like how Samdhong Rinpoche serve HHDL as PM and then later when he retired He confessed it was simply because He was instructed by Guru - HH Trijang Rinpoche. 

Yes it is best for us not to judge or condemn what these great highly attained masters are doing, I am sure they have thought it through the best way from all angles and I am sure it is always for the long term. Yes I do agree with WB, after the ban is lifted, it will be very easy for Lama Zopa/FPMT to revive the practice to Dorje Shugden again.

Sadly as of now, most of his students would not want to look further than the reasons they want to believe, that Dorje Shugden is a Buddha, and that Lama Zopa is just following the Dalai Lama's edict out of respect and there is nothing evil about Dorje Shugden. I wonder would it behoove his students that Lama Zopa never said that Dorje Shugden is evil, but to just avoid him due to the Dalai Lama's edict about him, and they should not be so gung ho and start witchhunts everywhere and just keep quiet and run their own activities without disrupting others? I have heard of so many tales of people talking about how FPMT centers waging wars against NKT and New Khadampa (Serkong Tritul's center) and gaining political control over the Buddhists of that country. Call all these stop please? and lets all focus on the Dharma.

[WisdomBeing]

I actually believe that all the Dorje Shugden critics do not understand the issues and nuances behind the Dalai Lama's ban. If they did, they would know that it is illogical. Members of FPMT probably have NOT read Lama Zopa's actual advice on this issue and have simply jumped on the bandwagon of it's an evil practice and let's hate all DS practitioners. How could that fit into any kind of Buddhist behavior and practice???

If only people would read more and understand - especially for the Gelugpa practitioners to read what HH Trijang Rinpoche had said regarding this issue in 1967, way before the ban on Dorje Shugden! This is the exact stance of dorjeshugden.com and yet so many on either side of the fence (pro-Dalai Lama AND pro-Dorje Shugden) prefer to criticise than to listen to our lineage master. Please do share this with everyone so they KNOW - and i hope that knowledge will heal the rifts of schism as we move towards the lifting of the ban on Dorje Shugden:

Page 125 of Music Delighting The Ocean of Protectors (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/articles/musicdelighting.pdf):
But some who are narrow minded, not understanding this point, consider this Dharmapala to be like an ordinary worldly being and, with supposed faith in the Dalai Lama and the Panchen Lama, disparage him; or else they indeed admire this great Dharmapala but criticize the Dalai Lama or Panchen Lama. Using either one as a reason not to admire the other and speaking badly about either in any way is the conduct of an ordinary being who, under the influence of attachment and hatred, just tries to help friends and hurt enemies; it obscures the increase of these great holy Aryas' deeds and creates the karmic cause to experience unbearable suffering in the future.

[Ensapa]

I actually believe that all the Dorje Shugden critics do not understand the issues and nuances behind the Dalai Lama's ban. If they did, they would know that it is illogical. Members of FPMT probably have NOT read Lama Zopa's actual advice on this issue and have simply jumped on the bandwagon of it's an evil practice and let's hate all DS practitioners. How could that fit into any kind of Buddhist behavior and practice???

If only people would read more and understand - especially for the Gelugpa practitioners to read what HH Trijang Rinpoche had said regarding this issue in 1967, way before the ban on Dorje Shugden! This is the exact stance of dorjeshugden.com and yet so many on either side of the fence (pro-Dalai Lama AND pro-Dorje Shugden) prefer to criticise than to listen to our lineage master. Please do share this with everyone so they KNOW - and i hope that knowledge will heal the rifts of schism as we move towards the lifting of the ban on Dorje Shugden:

Page 125 of Music Delighting The Ocean of Protectors (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/articles/musicdelighting.pdf):
But some who are narrow minded, not understanding this point, consider this Dharmapala to be like an ordinary worldly being and, with supposed faith in the Dalai Lama and the Panchen Lama, disparage him; or else they indeed admire this great Dharmapala but criticize the Dalai Lama or Panchen Lama. Using either one as a reason not to admire the other and speaking badly about either in any way is the conduct of an ordinary being who, under the influence of attachment and hatred, just tries to help friends and hurt enemies; it obscures the increase of these great holy Aryas' deeds and creates the karmic cause to experience unbearable suffering in the future.

I believe that your observation of the situation is correct. His students did not even read Lama Zopa's advice at all regarding Dorje Shugden and they only did it out of blind faith to the Dalai Lama. I mean, everyone wants to be on the side of the most famous Buddhist monk on the planet....that actual Dharma practice is not important as long as they are following the Dalai Lama. because they are not able to answer so many things about Dorje Shugden. I do find it funny on how can you hate something that you dont even know about? Shouldnt you know your enemy before deciding that it is evil?

[WisdomBeing]

Dear Ensapa,

The thing is - why should they hate?? That is one of the issues i simply cannot grapple with. Why such venom?? Where is the compassion and wisdom?? And most of the vituperation comes from Buddhists.

"If you prick us, do we not bleed? If
you tickle us, do we not laugh? If you poison us, do we not die?
And if you wrong us, do we not revenge? If we are like you in the
rest, we will resemble you in that." - Shakespeare

Thank goodness the Dorje Shugden practitioners who i know do not return the hate with hate but with compassion and are simply seeking respect for a difference of opinion. It makes me think who are the Dharma practitioners here.

[vajratruth]

Lama Zopa’s message here tells me that he does not believe there is anything wrong with Dorje Shugden practice but that the is only following the Dalai Lama’s instructions. I don’t think any of us have any right to judge whether Lama Zopa did the right thing or not – I have heard some Dorje Shugden practitioners say that he should not have given up his practice just because the Dalai Lama says so. Who are we to judge since we are not in Lama Zopa’s shoes. I believe Lama Zopa is attained and will know best what to do under the circumstances he is in.

After all who identified Lama Zopa as a Rinpoche? Dorje Shugden of course. (see “Who made Lama Zopa a Rinpoche http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=49.0)

Personally, I believe that Lama Zopa would not have given up his practice as it came from his root guru HH Trijang Rinpoche. Lama Zopa visiting Trijang Rinpoche’s stupa is for the same reason – that he has tremendous devotion to Trijang Rinpoche.

Well said WB. If indeed the Dalai Lama has a bigger plan in mind, it would require for his "ban" to have some support otherwise it would lack the controversy it needed for the practice to spread. Lama Zopa has never said anything derogatory about Dorje Shugden and as you correctly pointed out he has shown tremendous devotion to Trijang Rinpoche. There is even a video of him worshipping at his Guru's stupa which shows Lama Zopa to be in a sombre mood. http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/the-controversy/lama-zopa-worships-trijang-rinpoches-stupa/).

I can only wonder how many more high lamas are continuing with the practice in secret. Certainly the ex Gaden Tripa, His Holiness Gaden Trisur Rinpoche Jetsun Lungrik Namgyal was practicing clandestinely until his term as the throne holder of the Gelugpas ended. His case would not be an isolated one and many are just waiting to resurface.

Perhaps now with Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche performing Dorje Shugden pujas openly and having given his first Dorje Shugden sogtae in this reincarnation, it will signal a change for other Shugden lamas to do their practice openly. The DS ban looks like a spent force and despite the tyranny wrought by it, the Protector practice seems to be growing in force.

Wouldn't be great news if Lama Zopa came out soon to declare that he too, never did stop his worship of Dorje Shugden.

[Ensapa]

Dear Ensapa,

The thing is - why should they hate?? That is one of the issues i simply cannot grapple with. Why such venom?? Where is the compassion and wisdom?? And most of the vituperation comes from Buddhists.

"If you prick us, do we not bleed? If
you tickle us, do we not laugh? If you poison us, do we not die?
And if you wrong us, do we not revenge? If we are like you in the
rest, we will resemble you in that." - Shakespeare

Thank goodness the Dorje Shugden practitioners who i know do not return the hate with hate but with compassion and are simply seeking respect for a difference of opinion. It makes me think who are the Dharma practitioners here.

Lets not forget that most of the Buddhists today grew up in Christian families and as such, they were taught dualism - that there must be a good guy and a bad guy, Jesus is good and Satan is bad. So even when they're now Buddhists, they still have not gotten rid of this dualism thing. Many "buddhists" I have met demonizes Mara and Devadatta, and they seem to fill up the role of Satan in Buddhism. In Tibetan Buddhism, Dorje Shugden took this role as a result of the ban and because these "buddhists" need a demon figure to blame and to take the role of Satan, Dorje Shugden kind of filled this role and thus, the unjustified hate against him. Its due to the need of some people to demonize something due to their mental conditioning.

[WisdomBeing]

Dear Ensapa,

I beg to disagree that most Buddhists were brought up with Christian backgrounds. Perhaps in the western world, but not in the east surely. Also Buddhists do have demons to fight against... we have greed, selfishness, laziness, cruelty - we don't need Dorje Shugden to be a demon to fight against nor did he manifest for that purpose. On the contrary, he manifested to protect us.

[Big Uncle]

Hmmm. I wonder what the great Lamas would do once the ban has been lifted by the Dalai Lama. This would be very awkward position and if not handled correctly, it would make the Dalai Lama and the High Lamas of Tibetan Buddhism look fickle and would look bad as authoritative figureheads. I think people around the world, especially those who are practicing Buddhism would start to question why enforce the ban and then lift the ban. What would be the reason and mind you, not many people would be able to understand nor grasp a bigger picture.

This actually leads me to think that the Dalai Lama would gradually lift the ban slowly by first not talking and condemning Dorje Shugden anymore and perhaps, pass the rein to the new generation of Lamas to take over. Perhaps, he might leave the spiritual leadership back on the shoulders of the Gaden Tripas and/or Choktrul Trijang Rinpoche / Ling Rinpoche. Perhaps, he might even tell them that the permission to resume Dorje Shugden practice is in their hands. That's just my very own educated guess and that's how the ban gets lifted with minimal problems. Well, anyway, we need to get to the point where the Dalai Lama actually allow free rein of Dorje Shugden practice. That's most important now.