Surprising speech by Samdhong Rinpoche

[LosangKhyentse]

It is very encouraging to hear what Samdhong Rinpoche is openly declaring now that his term as Kalong Tripa is finished. He is like Gaden Trisur joining Shar Gaden after his term as Gaden Tripa completed. No one can do anything to Samdhong Rinpoche because his term is over.

Samdhong Rinpoche in his erudite scholarly knowledge and steadfast guru devotion, would definitely comprehend fully his root guru Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche is not wrong in recognizing Shugden as Manjushri. I feel Samdhong Rinpoche is playing his part in the Bigger Picture theory. What else could it be? 

The Dalai Lama's power is handed over to a secular 'head'. Dalai Lama is aging very much. The manifestation of Tibet's pleas for independence or autonomy is as real as a horned rabbit clearly signifying the failure of Tibetan Govt in exile. The Tibetans in exile themselves are taking every opportunity to immigrate to Europe and North America while they can. They have great fear for the time after the Dalai Lama is gone. Lobsang Sangay may be young, educated and eloquent, but what can he do? What can any Tibetans in exile do that they have not done already. The Tibetans living abroad within 2-3 generations will lose their culture, language and connections. All immigrants eventually do. The semblences of the 'old country' fades as they adopt the customs of the new country. It wouldn't be any different for the Tibetans. The Tibetans in Tibet are starting to embrace the China recognized Panchen Rinpoche. Looks like the red star over Tibet remains while the snow lion of Tibet is nowhere to be seen.

Dalai Lama is a man and men die. Men's dreams, hopes, wishes, likes all fade with time. Shugden is a 'god'...he will last much longer.

I am sure of the Bigger Picture. I remain steadfast to it.

Mana

I agree. Thank you Mana.
TK

[Big Uncle]

It is very encouraging to hear what Samdhong Rinpoche is openly declaring now that his term as Kalong Tripa is finished. He is like Gaden Trisur joining Shar Gaden after his term as Gaden Tripa completed. No one can do anything to Samdhong Rinpoche because his term is over.

Samdhong Rinpoche in his erudite scholarly knowledge and steadfast guru devotion, would definitely comprehend fully his root guru Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche is not wrong in recognizing Shugden as Manjushri. I feel Samdhong Rinpoche is playing his part in the Bigger Picture theory. What else could it be? 

The Dalai Lama's power is handed over to a secular 'head'. Dalai Lama is aging very much. The manifestation of Tibet's pleas for independence or autonomy is as real as a horned rabbit clearly signifying the failure of Tibetan Govt in exile. The Tibetans in exile themselves are taking every opportunity to immigrate to Europe and North America while they can. They have great fear for the time after the Dalai Lama is gone. Lobsang Sangay may be young, educated and eloquent, but what can he do? What can any Tibetans in exile do that they have not done already. The Tibetans living abroad within 2-3 generations will lose their culture, language and connections. All immigrants eventually do. The semblences of the 'old country' fades as they adopt the customs of the new country. It wouldn't be any different for the Tibetans. The Tibetans in Tibet are starting to embrace the China recognized Panchen Rinpoche. Looks like the red star over Tibet remains while the snow lion of Tibet is nowhere to be seen.

Dalai Lama is a man and men die. Men's dreams, hopes, wishes, likes all fade with time. Shugden is a 'god'...he will last much longer.

I am sure of the Bigger Picture. I remain steadfast to it.

Mana

Thank you Mana. This is extremely well said and clear. I like this post very much because it challenges us to think deeper between the lines. A lot of what goes on is merely a play of great enlightened masters. This is mentioned many times in the great scriptures and explained many times over but when the great masters today enact the great deeds as before, very few recognizes it and some even argue and have tremendous doubts.

I sometimes think that the great masters have no choice but to act in such a manner as our collective karma demands it. How else can a great and powerful protector be spread around the world in such a quick manner. Otherwise, it would have taken countless millions of dollars to promote Dorje Shugden to the level that the Dalai Lama has done. This is not to mention the obstacles that would arise and the tremendous pujas that need to be done to avert it.

Anyway, it has become clearer and clearer what the Dalai Lama is doing and the bigger picture seems to be coming closer and closer to completion. We are indeed very fortunate to be the pioneer group of practitioners of Dorje Shugden. I shall never forget the previous Karmapa's prophecy, that all Tibetan Buddhists will practice Dorje Shugden one day.

[LosangKhyentse]

Thank you Mana. This is extremely well said and clear. I like this post very much because it challenges us to think deeper between the lines. A lot of what goes on is merely a play of great enlightened masters. This is mentioned many times in the great scriptures and explained many times over but when the great masters today enact the great deeds as before, very few recognizes it and some even argue and have tremendous doubts.

I sometimes think that the great masters have no choice but to act in such a manner as our collective karma demands it. How else can a great and powerful protector be spread around the world in such a quick manner. Otherwise, it would have taken countless millions of dollars to promote Dorje Shugden to the level that the Dalai Lama has done. This is not to mention the obstacles that would arise and the tremendous pujas that need to be done to avert it.

Anyway, it has become clearer and clearer what the Dalai Lama is doing and the bigger picture seems to be coming closer and closer to completion. We are indeed very fortunate to be the pioneer group of practitioners of Dorje Shugden. I shall never forget the previous Karmapa's prophecy, that all Tibetan Buddhists will practice Dorje Shugden one day.

Very well said. I like it and agree.
TK

[Zach]

Question: The previous karmapas words on Dorje shugden, does anyone know how reliable the accuracy of this is who did he speak this to and in what context ?

[Heartspoon]

Question: The previous karmapas words on Dorje shugden, does anyone know how reliable the accuracy of this is who did he speak this to and in what context ?

Zach,

Look here: http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=885.0
According to Beggar and Vajraprotector, Dagom Rinpoche has written about it-

[Heartspoon]

Thank you Mana. This is extremely well said and clear. I like this post very much because it challenges us to think deeper between the lines. A lot of what goes on is merely a play of great enlightened masters. This is mentioned many times in the great scriptures and explained many times over but when the great masters today enact the great deeds as before, very few recognizes it and some even argue and have tremendous doubts.

I sometimes think that the great masters have no choice but to act in such a manner as our collective karma demands it. How else can a great and powerful protector be spread around the world in such a quick manner. Otherwise, it would have taken countless millions of dollars to promote Dorje Shugden to the level that the Dalai Lama has done. This is not to mention the obstacles that would arise and the tremendous pujas that need to be done to avert it.

Anyway, it has become clearer and clearer what the Dalai Lama is doing and the bigger picture seems to be coming closer and closer to completion. We are indeed very fortunate to be the pioneer group of practitioners of Dorje Shugden. I shall never forget the previous Karmapa's prophecy, that all Tibetan Buddhists will practice Dorje Shugden one day.

Very well said. I like it and agree.
TK

For your sake always speak the truth.
Even should it cause your death
Or ruin your governance,
Do not speak in any other way.

Just as by themselves the true words
Of kings generate firm trust,
So their false words are the best means
To create distrust.

What is not deceitful is the truth;
It is not an intentional fabrication.
What is solely helpful to others is the truth.
The opposite is falsehood since it does not help.

Nagarjuna's Precious Garland
Compassion and Wisdom in Public Policy

[Helena]

Mana, I am with you.

I am remain firmly with the Bigger Picture.

Now, I can finally understand why "our minds are unfit vessels" for all the precious teachings.

We all know so little and can only see the tiny tip of the ice berg. We do not possess absolute and complete knowledge of the present - let alone, past and future. Yet we like to think that we have 'wholesome' understanding of every situation or individual. And then we commit the gravest of mistake by making such a strong and rigid judgement or conclusion on the little that we see and know - believing it to be the truth.

With every new piece of information, there is more to see and learn. As if the light is cast into the shadows, enlarging the picture and clarifying the scenario further.

These are indeed exciting times and I truly look forward to the "Changing of the Guardians".

[WoselTenzin]

Thank you Mana. This is extremely well said and clear. I like this post very much because it challenges us to think deeper between the lines. A lot of what goes on is merely a play of great enlightened masters. This is mentioned many times in the great scriptures and explained many times over but when the great masters today enact the great deeds as before, very few recognizes it and some even argue and have tremendous doubts.

I sometimes think that the great masters have no choice but to act in such a manner as our collective karma demands it. How else can a great and powerful protector be spread around the world in such a quick manner. Otherwise, it would have taken countless millions of dollars to promote Dorje Shugden to the level that the Dalai Lama has done. This is not to mention the obstacles that would arise and the tremendous pujas that need to be done to avert it.

Anyway, it has become clearer and clearer what the Dalai Lama is doing and the bigger picture seems to be coming closer and closer to completion. We are indeed very fortunate to be the pioneer group of practitioners of Dorje Shugden. I shall never forget the previous Karmapa's prophecy, that all Tibetan Buddhists will practice Dorje Shugden one day.

Very well said. I like it and agree.
TK

I can't wait for the day to come. No more pro and anti DS faction. No more unfair discrimination against DS practitioners. No more reason for people to use DS issue for their own political interest. Innocent sincere DS practitioners do not need to be ostracised and suffer. 

Whatever DS practitioners throughout the world are going through now looks like a massive purification process for the DS practice to emerge as mainstream protector practice in the world of Tibetan Buddhists.  This process is sometimes beyond the understanding of our ordinary minds.

The only saving grace is that in general Tibetan Buddhists still have Guru devotion, have faith and are loyal to their gurus and the practices given to them.  Because of this faith, DS practioners especially those in India are still able to continue this practice despite massive threats, having to endure extreme sufferings and pressure to abandon the practice to be politically correct.

May the Karmapa's prediction come true!

 

[beggar]

Wisdombeing,

And now if you meet Samdhong Rinpoche and he tells you:

“Now, without fear and hesitation,you,Wisdombeing, must fight and destroy Shugden followers”

Do you think you will have to exert some critical thinking ?

Or do you merely think: "If I presume to judge another attained being when I am nott attained myself, 
it will merely reflect on the size of my ego. So I have to follow his advice without any form of critical thinking.

There is a difference between thinking logically / acting according to what you feel is most logical and correct and having wrong, negative views of other lamas and then acting out of that.

We may not necessarily have to agree with what Samdhong Rinpoche is telling us to do (i.e. give up Shugden) because we have the advice of our own Lamas which is priority. But understanding where he is coming from, or when we at least maintain some kind of neutrality, we will at least refrain from speaking or acting in negative ways towards him, which does create negative karma (speaking badly of anyone incurs negative karma, least of all a high lama).

This is a good practice to have, whether it applies specifically to this situation or to other more general situations - to train ourselves to look at something for what it is, neutrally, or at least not to habituate ourselves to instantly thinking negatively of something. We never quite know who the real object of our anger might be. If in fact Samdhong Rinpoche is an incarnation of Dorje Shugden himself, as many Dorje Shugden Lamas have proclaimed, then bashing him and inciting others to hate him incurs a very heavy karma.

Beggar,

Applying your own advice, you should not "instantly think negatively" of what I wrote.
What on earth makes you think that I am speaking or acting in negative ways towards him ?
Please think again and read very carefully what I wrote, from the first to the last message in this discussion.

I do apologise! I did not mean it to come across as an attack on you. Rather, more like a warning for all of us that "critical thinking" doesn't become something that is negative, as being critical can often tip the scale more towards being negative and there is a fine line between being analytical or putting forward constructive criticism, and just being critical.

And from that kind of thinking, we can tend to get carried away to also talk and act negatively.

My posting is not something specific to you, it is a tendency that all of us have, and about all of us having awareness for how we do or do not talk about other Lamas and practitioners.

[Rihanna]

I look forward to more pleasant surprises from other Lamas after they retire from office!


The changing of the guard... Is coming true now.

First the Gaden Tripa retires then jumps camp to Shar Gaden. Then this.

I must admit I was one of the first to become judge jury and executioner of HHDL's henchman, now turned golden child. Very embarassing and I also believe some negative Karma to think this way of a Rinpoche.

For those who find it difficult to read between the lines and who require it spelt out, Samdong Rinpoche served HHDL, TGIE, The Tibetan people, NOT for ANY other reason than to SERVE his Guru, H.H. Trijang Rinpoche.

He can't come out and say openly that he doesn't support what HHDL / TGIE is doing, he alludes to it heavily.

Why now? What will the ramifications of this announcement mean for the current environment for Shugdenites vs The Rest?

I agree with you @Helena, we shall see the outcome in our very lifetime for sure!

[vajrastorm]

I am glad that (with  the bold and stunning revelations in Samdhong Rinpoche's speech) the  bigger picture -  of the Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden working together to spread the Dharma in this degenerate age - is now definitely and clearly emerging.

Samdhong Rinpoche's revelations show that he has truly actualized Guru Devotion at an incredible level. I came across these lines from the "Nine Attitudes of Guru Devotion", which Samdhong Rinpoche's Guru Devotion clearly mirrors:

"With the attitude like an iron mountain,
Unmoving, no matter what suffering occurs.

With an attitude like a servant: who accomplishes everything
Without hesitation, even if it means taking on all of the worst jobs.

With an attitude like a sweeper: Abandoning pride and feelings
Of superiority, and holding oneself lower than the Guru.

With an attitude like a vehicle: That carries out
Even the most difficult and heaviest work of the Guru joyfully."

I thought how apt it was to apply these lines especially to Samdhong Rinpoche in his devotion to his Root Guru Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche..

This speech has made me so much more aware of the power and greatness of the compassion, wisdom and skillful means of Kyabje  Trijang Rinpoche. It is as though he had seen what was to come and orchestrated the whole act, including the controversy and ban.And all this was done so that the pure Dharma of Je Tsongkapa could be preserved and spread everywhere for the benefit of all beings in these degenerate times. The times are indeed degenerate and minds of beings extremely deluded: one man in peaceful Norway could go on a senseless killing spree and kill over eighty mainly young people!

[kurava]

I'm sorry Samdhong Rinpoche, I was one of those who hated you for taking such 'heartless' stand against all the DS practitioners !

I can imagine all the accusations you took in putting your Guru Devotion to practice 100%; all the heartaches you endure seeing the pains and sufferings of DS practitioners and yet you had no choice but continue with the 'persecution' because you were told to 'give up everything'.

I know now what  real Guru Devotion is , what is meant by pure and sincere practice without the 8 worldly concerns and the saying that appearances are deceptive. I must say yours is one of the greatest deceptions in line with the bigger- picture scheme of things.

[diamond girl]

Wow! Dorje Shugden compassionately emanates as a Lama who would be placed to assist the Dalai Lama to ban himself! I am not clairvoyant to see if he is or not but Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche and Gangchen Rinpoche definitely are clairvoyant to see this. However, his powerful and honest Guru devotion amidst his own obvious faith in Dorje Shugden is painfully obvious.

He toiled in silence as so many people have hurled nasty remarks about him and he still does everything so convincingly. His devotional qualities can only be of how Dorje Shugden would have been in the form of a Lama. His pure Guru devotion would mean that the ban he had worked so hard will be a blessing. It will have the effect that will spread Dorje Shugden practice farther and wider because it was born out of pure Guru devotion regardless of how it may have appeared in the past. Alas, we have discovered another disguised hero of Dorje Shugden, a hero we mistook for a villain. How degenerate our times are!

Thank you Big Uncle, what you have written are my thoughts exactly. Of course Thank You Beggar for posting this up.

It is truly Guru Devotion to have gone through all of this in his lifetime. Like Beggar said, in fulfilling his Guru Devotion he banned himself. I cannot even begin to imagine the "pain" in doing all this against oneself. Imagine, us lay people who get all upset and angry when we do not get to be righteous, we would have probably exploded if we had to endure what Samdhong Rinpoche has gone through.

What a selfless Master! May the practice of Dorje Shugden grow faster and wide!

[hope rainbow]

I sometimes think that the great masters have no choice but to act in such a manner as our collective karma demands it.
How else can a great and powerful protector be spread around the world in such a quick manner.
Otherwise, it would have taken countless millions of dollars to promote Dorje Shugden to the level that the Dalai Lama has done.
This is not to mention the obstacles that would arise and the tremendous pujas that need to be done to avert it.

Anyway, it has become clearer and clearer what the Dalai Lama is doing and the bigger picture seems to be coming closer and closer to completion.
We are indeed very fortunate to be the pioneer group of practitioners of Dorje Shugden.
I shall never forget the previous Karmapa's prophecy, that all Tibetan Buddhists will practice Dorje Shugden one day.

What I am writing here is strictly my own reflection and not based on any information I have about this, but I have this question in my mind ever since I heard Samdhong Rinpoche talk about his motivation behind his support to The Dalai Lama and consecutively the ban on Dorje Shugden. It is a question I feel I should share...

a) I cannot get myself to think for one moment that His Holiness the Dalai Lama would do anything contradicting his guru -Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche, nor anything damaging to the teachings of Lama Tsongkhapa, or even (hear me) to the spread of Dorje Shugden's practice.

b) Thus, in logic, I wonder if the ban was not an instruction from Trijang Rinpoche to His Holiness. I just wonder...

c) This would be logical with the instruction Trijang Rinpoche also gave to Samdhong Rinpoche.

d) It would also give light in the warning that Trijang Rinpoche gave to practitioners to be careful of not speaking ill or think ill of the actions of The Dalai Lama.

Maybe I am thinking too much, maybe I could be wrong...
But if the above is correct, I imagine (again) if The Dalai Lama was to speak in a similar way as Samdhong Rinpoche did, and let the world know that the ban on Dorje Shugden was actually instructed by Trijang Rinpoche himself. This would perhaps convince the few that remains skeptical about "the grand scheme" of things. Ohoooo!

[WisdomBeing]

Dear Hope Rainbow,

What an interesting perspective you have shared here. I hadn't thought about this angle at all.. hmmm what food for thought. It is of course hypothetical but the possibility is exciting!

Especially recently the Dalai Lama has confessed that he has been a hypocrite regarding his combining the secular and spiritual in his role as the head of Tibet. If he is saying he was wrong, what else can he be wrong about?

In the meantime, i''m still waiting for Samdhong Rinpoche to kick his closet door open and declare himself a DS practitioner!