See monks being forced to swear in!

[beggar]

I do thank you Mana for sharing this video. would you also happen to know if this video has been uploaded to YouTube? I know there are many people who watch videos through that, and this should be shared with as many people as possible, so more know what these monks really had to go through. Thank you!

[Dolce Vita]

This is so sad to see monks being forced to swear in. However, isn't Guru Devotion taught in the very beginning of Lamrim? Lay people might not have read or understood what Guru Devotion is but monks who is studying Lamrim in the monastery should know. Isn't a sign of degeneration also? I also wonder why these monks adhere to the ridiculous demand from CTA? If CTA's existence is to fight for the independence of Tibet, just concentrate on dealing with the Chinese Government and leave the monks alone.

If CTA really believe in spirituality then they should perhaps:
1) do more pujas to clear their obstacles in getting their independence
2) understand what guru devotion is
3) stop instructing monks what they can or cannot do
4) practice the core values of Buddhism, ie non-violence, compassion, altruistic, do not create doubts between a guru and his students.

If CTA do not believe in spirituality then they shouldn't even bother what people are practising as long as these people are not creating disharmony in the society.

[LosangKhyentse]

CTA should invite a Dorje Shugden oracle officially, request Shugden to take trance in the oracle, then  in the central Cathedral in Dharamsala (headquarters of Dalai Lama) make offerings of body, speech and mind and sincerely apologize to Shugden. Then do purification pujas and Shugden grand puja with tsok as a offering.

Then request Shugden for directions, help and assistance. They should repair all the damages they caused toward Shugden practitioners as the karma is very heavy. How can bringing harm and pain equal to good results? CTA should examine carefully all the fanatical damage they have done and repair the rift.

All harm comes to fruition no matter how far you attempt to escape.
karma is closer to us than a shadow to a body.
Harmful actions must bear fruit, so what freedom can the CTA hope to secure?
Regret now and minimize the karma. Harm is harm. Pain is pain. And it all arises from ignorance.
Shugden has great compassion, all will be forgiven halting the wheel of Sharp weapons to return in full swing.
TK

[Ensapa]

CTA should invite a Dorje Shugden oracle officially, request Shugden to take trance in the oracle, then  in the central Cathedral in Dharamsala (headquarters of Dalai Lama) make offerings of body, speech and mind and sincerely apologize to Shugden. Then do purification pujas and Shugden grand puja with tsok as a offering.

Then request Shugden for directions, help and assistance. They should repair all the damages they caused toward Shugden practitioners as the karma is very heavy. How can bringing harm and pain equal to good results? CTA should examine carefully all the fanatical damage they have done and repair the rift.

All harm comes to fruition no matter how far you attempt to escape.
karma is closer to us than a shadow to a body.
Harmful actions must bear fruit, so what freedom can the CTA hope to secure?
Regret now and minimize the karma. Harm is harm. Pain is pain. And it all arises from ignorance.
Shugden has great compassion, all will be forgiven halting the wheel of Sharp weapons to return in full swing.
TK

Interesting angle there, TK. I guess with the current state of affairs with CTA, that will never happen and nothing can really sway their mind. I dont believe HHDL asked them to start an inquisition against temples, they acted upon them themselves. It would be interesting to see what sort of karma will they reap and the results of it, but the sad part is nobody can do anything about it. We can only watch from a distance as they bring misfortune upon themselves.

[dsiluvu]

This is so sad to see monks being forced to swear in. However, isn't Guru Devotion taught in the very beginning of Lamrim? Lay people might not have read or understood what Guru Devotion is but monks who is studying Lamrim in the monastery should know. Isn't a sign of degeneration also? I also wonder why these monks adhere to the ridiculous demand from CTA? If CTA's existence is to fight for the independence of Tibet, just concentrate on dealing with the Chinese Government and leave the monks alone.

If CTA really believe in spirituality then they should perhaps:
1) do more pujas to clear their obstacles in getting their independence
2) understand what guru devotion is
3) stop instructing monks what they can or cannot do
4) practice the core values of Buddhism, ie non-violence, compassion, altruistic, do not create doubts between a guru and his students.

If CTA do not believe in spirituality then they shouldn't even bother what people are practising as long as these people are not creating disharmony in the society.

Logical points the CTA should seriously consider since Tibetans are only famous for one thing - Buddhism. Their actions have clearly shown the world how very barbaric/primitive their minds still are. The very essence of Buddha's teachings - respecting sangha and compassion is not being practised. This action also swipes away all the good image, publicity and reputation of Tibetans and Buddhism that was tirelessly promoted by the Dalai Lama since he escaped in to exile. 

It terms of the political perspective... it clearly shows how backward the CTA govt is. Never have we heard of any govt in this 21st century implementing such forceful rule towards sangha/monks/nuns/priests/pastors. Never have any govt dip their hands in to any religious affair and definitely not to such an extend of forcefully asking them to give up a practice. This is very shameful and certainly would not garner confidence in world leaders to see them on their same level. No govt is so silly to break up their own people.   

Some advices given on this topic e.g from TK below... should be seriously considered by the CTA if they really care about their people...

[beggar]

Ironically, I don't really think the CTA are very interested or sincere about religion or spiritual practice. If they were, they wouldn't be acting in this way. No true Buddhist would put down, attack or ostracise their own people in this way!

The irony is that the very thing that is bringing them so much disrepute, and which they use to justify their bad behaviour... IS RELIGIOUS!

They are trying to be secular, as a government, but so much of the policies they make inevitably implicate religion.  so they act out of and because of religious "issues" but never with a religious motivation. This is where it has all gone horribly wrong.

[diamond girl]

How can they do this to these monks? How dare the stupid CTA officials come and tell the monastics that had been holding their vows all their lives, what to do. This really makes me angry that the monks are abused like that, especially the older monks. 

Who is going to fight for them? Who is going to defend and protect the old monks who are frail and unable to take being ostracized from their own community. If I were a member of the monastic, I would just walk out and into the doors of Shar Gaden. Well, I think they didn't have Shar Gaden back when they did this swearing in. If I could, I would go up to the officials and give each of them a tight slap for doing this. Well, that will only happen in my imagination. Maybe they should get the oracle to take trance of Setrap and see what he does. Sorry, evil thoughts again.

Big Uncle, sorry to say but I share your same evil thoughts and more! I know that the oracle when taking trance can be very wrathful. I can imagine if the CTA dared to ask oracle to take trance of DS they would be whipped and slapped so hard they will fly across the room and stick to the wall like a fly. Then again, DS is compassionate and forgiving so my vision may not happen.

This swearing in a an outright violation of human rights? Does CTA think the monks are not human and have no rights? It is abhorring that they can do this and in this time and age, such moral barbarism. It is co clear that the young monks do not even know what they are swearing in about, in some of the cases the adult monk has to read for the young ones who just repeat after them. It is so sad. I feel so sad to see this, and I am thinking really what choice do they have? Some are so old and frail and some too young to fend for themselves, how could they survive the ostracism? At least when they swear in (on the outside) they can still survive and practice secretly. And I am very sure many did this.

Who ever said spiritual practice is a free publicity show? This whole swearing in fiasco is a CTA propaganda and publicity to show how "powerful" they are. Such rubbish, it only shows what bullies they are and how inhuman and immoral they are.

CTA, you better watch it. Karma makes no exceptions.

[shugdenprotect]

I agree with dsiluvu and tk. What has passed is past and cannot be changed. However, CTA can take action now to correct the wrong they have done. The wrong is not just because they do not believe in Dorje Shugden. The wrong is in the direct damage to others the CTA caused with their actions.

In reflecting that HH is elderly and, sorry to say, may pass away soon, it is really an urgent period for the CTA to purify the negative karma they collected. One of the best ways to correct this wrong and purify the karma is to enable people to once again embrace Dorje Shugden. This is because one of the most meritorious actions we can engage in is to spread the Dharma and benefit others.

Additionally, I believe that the ban of Dorje Shugden will naturally lift after the passing of HH as one of the major causes for the ban is no longer valid. Consequently, taking corrective action then may be “too late”.

I pray that some sense will go into the minds of the CTA leaders and members so that, even if they have no interest to benefit others, they can at least have some hope of salvation from the great suffering they have caused.

[dondrup]

Is CTA really so ignorant of what they had done to the Sangha? Do members of the CTA ever practise Tibetan Buddhism? Forcing another person to go against his will is wrong, it is a crime.  How could CTA force the holy Sangha to swear against Dorje Shugden?  What right has the CTA to interfere with spiritual practice of the holy Sangha? 

CTA had totally stepped out of its line and infringed on the basic human right of free religious practice.  What CTA did had caused so much suffering in the Tibetan community including themselves.  Shouldn’t CTA be focusing on rebuilding their lost country than meddling with the religious affairs?  The Tibetans in exile had already experienced much pain after they lost their country and starting anew in foreign countries.  Why would CTA want to add salt to the wounds of their fellow citizens?  A good government should have the wellbeing of its people as the main concern but CTA is not doing that.  CTA had disappointed its people.

[happysun]

Sadness for Tibetan government! For what reason the government always like suppress own people? As a government what they need to do is always protect the people not try to threaten them by used different dirty method. The funny thing this protector practice had exist in Tibetan more than 500 years, now the government want to ban it, cannot make sense at all.

Do you believe some of the monk say all we want is just give freedom to practice, nothing more than that because it is so important for the real DS practitioner. Why? Because this practice come of their own guru, how can they just give up the practice like this??? Very disrespect to all of you.

[Big Uncle]

CTA should invite a Dorje Shugden oracle officially, request Shugden to take trance in the oracle, then  in the central Cathedral in Dharamsala (headquarters of Dalai Lama) make offerings of body, speech and mind and sincerely apologize to Shugden. Then do purification pujas and Shugden grand puja with tsok as a offering.

Then request Shugden for directions, help and assistance. They should repair all the damages they caused toward Shugden practitioners as the karma is very heavy. How can bringing harm and pain equal to good results? CTA should examine carefully all the fanatical damage they have done and repair the rift.

All harm comes to fruition no matter how far you attempt to escape.
karma is closer to us than a shadow to a body.
Harmful actions must bear fruit, so what freedom can the CTA hope to secure?
Regret now and minimize the karma. Harm is harm. Pain is pain. And it all arises from ignorance.
Shugden has great compassion, all will be forgiven halting the wheel of Sharp weapons to return in full swing.
TK

This is an excellent idea but I think the stupid CTA would think this would be going against the Dalai Lama's instructions. Why don't they invoke Setrab, Dorje Shugden's brother and do the exact same thing via Setrab. In that way, they can get away with any notions of violating the Dalai Lama's instructions while achieving the same goal. I hope some of them are actually reading this and getting good ideas about this.

Unfortunately, I have very little hope that they will heed this piece of excellent advice. They think that by implementing this ban and going all out to suppress Dorje Shugden practitioners, it will earn them a ticket to salvation. They are dead wrong. It is just a one-way ticket to hell.

[whitelion]

This is truly sad.

All the monks that spent their life to study, to benefit and to educate the younger generation was forced to swear in to abandon part of their life. Most of the monks have held their commitments to their guru their whole life, but how dare CTA force all the holy monks to let go of their promises.

In the teaching of Buddha mentioned the five deadly sins, whoever performed any of this five sins will be reborn in the hell of uninterrupted pain, Avichi.

Source : Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avici

In Buddhism, Av?ci (Sanskrit and Pali: "without waves"; also transliterated Avichi, Japanese and Chinese language: ?, and ?, ??) is the lowest level of the Naraka or "hell" realm, into which the dead who have committed grave misdeeds may be reborn. It is said to be a cube 20,000 yojanas to a side.[1]

Buddhism teaches that rebirth into Naraka is temporary, while the offending being works off the karma they performed. Similarly, rebirth into Av?ci hell is not eternal. However, suffering in Av?ci is the longest of all the levels of hell, by some accounts over 1018 years long[citation needed]. Some sutras state that rebirth in Av?ci will be for innumerable kalpas (eons). When the offending being passes away after one kalpa, he is again reborn in the same place, undergoing suffering for another kalpa, and on and on until he has exhausted his bad karma.[2] For this reason, Av?ci hell is also known as the "non-stop way" .

People reborn in Avichi generally have committed one or more of the Five deadly sins:
1. Intentionally murdering one's father
2. Intentionally murdering one's mother
3. Killing an Arhat (enlightened being)
4. Shedding the blood of a Buddha
5. Creating a schism within the Sangha, the community of Buddhist monks and nuns.

If creating schism within the Sangha community is not a sin, which means Buddha is wrong. If Buddha is wrong, HHDL is wrong, if HHDL is wrong all Tibetan Buddhism schools are wrong too. So who and what is CTA serving now?

If CTA believe in HHDL and the lineage that passed down from Buddha himself, they will helps to maintain the harmonious between all Buddhism sect, not organized the lay and sangha members to stoned Shar Gaden years ago.

Based to the teaching of Karma, whatever they have done will come back to them one day.
If DS really is such an evil demon, for us to fall into his trap, one must collected a lot of bad karma before. Since even Buddha can’t protect us from our bad karma, why CTA think they can??!! Why they think they are able to stop us to “fall deeper?” This is so stupid.

This swearing video is unbearable to watch. The CTA people should feel shame for themselves, you are forcing your own people to do something that against the Buddha teaching, you are forcing you own family to break their Guru Samaya. Soon the ban will be lifted, and you will receive the fruit of your karma.

[Ensapa]

You make some very good observations here, Ensapa.
It is true that no matter what they try to do, the government cannot stop true practitioners from their practice nor from coming back to continue their practice. As we have already been seeing, highly incarnate tulkus and DS Lamas have been taking rebirth further and further outside this little "village" (as yontenjamyang puts it haha!). Domo Geshe Rinpoche, for example, was born in the United States. This will make it more and more difficult for the CTA or any Dalai Lama supporters to do anything to these people. In the rest of the world, actions of the CTA would not be tolerated, after all.

Good point also about lay people just focusing on their practice. Yes, this is very true. Once you get involved in the politics, it will never end and you will always be forced to take sides. If we do want to do something positive for the situation, then we can serve Dorje Shugden best by promoting his good qualities, the benefits of his practice, how he has helped us etc and inspire others to engage in the practice or at the very least, learn the truth of his nature so that the suppression of DS practitioners and practice will be lessened and eventually eliminated over time.

CTA will have to realize that the world is not Tibet, and neither will the world revolve around  them. They cant demand people to do things their way or to tow in line. And they cannot control the world. They dont really have a place in the international community if not for the Dalai Lama's constant promotion and raising awareness. But really, they just dont belong. No track record, no structure, no system. And they want to rule tibet? nightmare.

[Galen]

This is so sad to see monks being forced to swear in. However, isn't Guru Devotion taught in the very beginning of Lamrim? Lay people might not have read or understood what Guru Devotion is but monks who is studying Lamrim in the monastery should know. Isn't a sign of degeneration also? I also wonder why these monks adhere to the ridiculous demand from CTA? If CTA's existence is to fight for the independence of Tibet, just concentrate on dealing with the Chinese Government and leave the monks alone.

If CTA really believe in spirituality then they should perhaps:
1) do more pujas to clear their obstacles in getting their independence
2) understand what guru devotion is
3) stop instructing monks what they can or cannot do
4) practice the core values of Buddhism, ie non-violence, compassion, altruistic, do not create doubts between a guru and his students.

If CTA do not believe in spirituality then they shouldn't even bother what people are practising as long as these people are not creating disharmony in the society.

I totally agree with Dolce Vita that the CTA should concentrate on getting Tibet's Independence. WHat they did to the monks is totally unnecessary. The monks are left with no choice to follow because they have no where else to go. They should not be dragged into this political fiasco.

[shugdenpromoter]

It is disgusting seeing what the monks have to go through. Politics and spirituality cannot be mixed. For goodness sake, some old monks hands were trembling while swearing in.

Anyone would expect a monastery to be a place whereby the monks are left to just concentrate on studies and prayers but NOT with CTA. Tibetans GREATEST assets are the monks including the HIGH LAMAs but the government (CTA) uses politics and their own agenda to put them down as seen in the video.

CTA has to get their act together. They have been downgraded from TGIE to just CTA (an administration), do not wait till when CTA has to be demoted to just an office or representative.