The Yellow Book

[Ensapa]

Hey guys,

I've revisited the Yellow Book again (http://www.holybooks.com/wp-content/uploads/The-Yellow-Book.pdf) and i do realize that although the translation is somewhat impartial, but it does stress the point to not practice other traditions when we are Gelugs, but it seems that it is translated in a way that it makes it sound like Dorje Shugden punish the 'offenders' when in reality it is the result of their own negative karma. That part was not explained at all as if to create misunderstandings on purpose. The book also refers to Dorje Shugden by his derogatory name, gyalchen. All these clues point to the translator not being neutral and being against Dorje Shugden from the start.

But what is interesting is, Zemey Rinpoche and Trijang Rinpoche never intended to ever publish this information out but somehow it was. What is the main reason to do that if not to incite something?

Also, interesting to note is that Dorje Shugden has warned the Panchen Lama to not practice Nyigma Termas, and our current HHDL is doing the same (if I am not mistaken) could it be that this caused HHDL to 'dislike' Dorje Shugden? or maybe HHDL is doing this to protect Gelugs who are not stable in their tradition and mix and match teachings from other traditions from corrupting Gelugpa and themselves? Thus  the ban to separate these two categories of people?

[DharmaSpace]

If a person never has the karma to be harmed can even Dorje Shugden harm this person?

It is said external enemies can harm our bodies, but the three poisons in our minds can send us to hell in an instant. What is more important to overcome the three poisons or a seemingly external evil?

[Ensapa]

If a person never has the karma to be harmed can even Dorje Shugden harm this person?

It is said external enemies can harm our bodies, but the three poisons in our minds can send us to hell in an instant. What is more important to overcome the three poisons or a seemingly external evil?

actually, that is not the real issue with this book. the real issue is that it was translated on purpose to make it sound like Dorje Shugden is a very overzealous Dharma protector who punishes people swiftly who does not tow in line. It was also contorted in such a way that it makes Dorje Shugden seem that he is against the Nyigmas, almost all of the lamas he "punished" practiced termas to "incur his wrath". HHDL was so angry and upset when this book was published that he refused to attend his long life prayers.

it is very clear that whoever who wrote/translate this book had the intention to split the sangha for his or her own agendas. If we as Dorje Shugden supporters can refute this book, i am sure the  ban can be lifted sooner because the ban came directly from this book. However, the stories itself came from Trijang Rinpoche, told to Zemey Rinpoche...so we cannot say they are false, but to me it was obviously distorted as all the bad things that happened to those people were caused not by karma but by the "miraculous power of Dorje Shugden"....i dont think a high lama would even use that phrase. It was obviously added to implicate something...

as Dorje Shugden practitioners and supporters, what do you feel after reading it?

[Lawrence L]

I've read it. It's very hard for me to believe those stories were from Zemey Rinpoche, and Zemey Rinpoche got those stories from Trijang Rinpoche! I mean, there is possibility that people changed the original stories that told by Trijang Rinpoche to Zemey Rinpoche? I guess...  As Trijang Rinpoche is a famous Dorje Shugden's practitioner.

There are few points i wondered.
1. If the consequences of practicing Dorje Shugden was that bad, how could the stories written in such a short length, without explaining more, give more evident and prove to the world the background stories?

2. Some of people in the stories even get killed or went crazy because of the "miraculous power of Dorje Shugden", but they never tell us more about that. A Dharma Protector is even powerful than the nature/law of karma, that everything bad happened to those people in the stories were all because Dorje Shugden!Even the great attained lama Pabongka Rinpoche was harmed by the Dorje Shugden. How could a great attained lama been harmed by the protector(or the evil spirit) so easily?

The stories just sounds funny to me. Maybe all the stories need more evidence and explaination.

[Zach]

Geshe kelsang has said of it that the stories where just stories a collection of folk tales that where retold finding actual evidence to support the claims it makes is another matter.

[Ensapa]

I've read it. It's very hard for me to believe those stories were from Zemey Rinpoche, and Zemey Rinpoche got those stories from Trijang Rinpoche! I mean, there is possibility that people changed the original stories that told by Trijang Rinpoche to Zemey Rinpoche? I guess...  As Trijang Rinpoche is a famous Dorje Shugden's practitioner.

There are few points i wondered.
1. If the consequences of practicing Dorje Shugden was that bad, how could the stories written in such a short length, without explaining more, give more evident and prove to the world the background stories?

2. Some of people in the stories even get killed or went crazy because of the "miraculous power of Dorje Shugden", but they never tell us more about that. A Dharma Protector is even powerful than the nature/law of karma, that everything bad happened to those people in the stories were all because Dorje Shugden!Even the great attained lama Pabongka Rinpoche was harmed by the Dorje Shugden. How could a great attained lama been harmed by the protector(or the evil spirit) so easily?

The stories just sounds funny to me. Maybe all the stories need more evidence and explaination.

It was not hard to believe at all. Zemey Rinpoche stopped teaching immediately after this book was published and entered clear light immediately after as it was published by one of his students. It is horrible to see a student betray his own Lama in this way after all the years of care, love and guidance because of personal vendettas. I am pretty sure the stories were meant to make Gelugpas not indulge in non Gelug teachings, but the way it was written and translated was distorted in a way that it makes it look odd. I am sure there is a commentary to it but it is omitted on purpose for obvious reasons.

Although these stories have no backing, but it seems that they were derived from the unpublished excerpts of Music Delighting the Ocean of Protectors and perhaps was  told orally from Trijang Rinpoche to Zemey Rinpoche. This is sadly a well known fact so we cannot write it off as folk tales, but we can read and look past the meaning and distorted translation to get the real message instead of fear that was twisted it to be. If we can refute the book and clarify it, I am sure the ban can be lifted as the basis of the ban has been destroyed.

[Losang_Tenpa]

It was not hard to believe at all. Zemey Rinpoche stopped teaching immediately after this book was published and entered clear light immediately after as it was published by one of his students. It is horrible to see a student betray his own Lama in this way after all the years of care, love and guidance because of personal vendettas. I am pretty sure the stories were meant to make Gelugpas not indulge in non Gelug teachings, but the way it was written and translated was distorted in a way that it makes it look odd. I am sure there is a commentary to it but it is omitted on purpose for obvious reasons.

Do you have the sourse for this information?

[Losang_Tenpa]

It was not hard to believe at all. Zemey Rinpoche stopped teaching immediately after this book was published and entered clear light immediately after as it was published by one of his students. It is horrible to see a student betray his own Lama in this way after all the years of care, love and guidance because of personal vendettas. I am pretty sure the stories were meant to make Gelugpas not indulge in non Gelug teachings, but the way it was written and translated was distorted in a way that it makes it look odd. I am sure there is a commentary to it but it is omitted on purpose for obvious reasons.

Do you have the sourse for this information?

The Yellow Book was written in 1970 and published in 1973. According to the text 'Selected Writings of Kyebje Zemey Rinpoche', Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche taught extensivley from 1970 until 1984 at Gaden and at various other places in India and Nepal. He then retired from public life due to a stroke he had in 1984.

Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche himself chose what to include in his collected works, which were published in 1994.
The Yellow Book can be found in volume 2 (Kha).
I am sure that it was never intended for general readership however; like many Tantric texts it must be understood in context.
Much like Shakyamuni when he declared "Kill your mother, kill your father", if we take that at face value we are in trouble. It is the underlining meaning of the words that must be tapped into. If all of the Tantras were picked apart and taken as literally as the Yellow Book has, there would be no end to the misunderstanding and confusion.

  As for the student who helped Rinpoche publish his texts, Geshe Thubten Jinpa has never 'betrayed' his Guru that I am aware of. My Teacher here at Zemey Labrang speaks very highly of him.

[DharmaSpace]

It was not hard to believe at all. Zemey Rinpoche stopped teaching immediately after this book was published and entered clear light immediately after as it was published by one of his students.

The book was published in 1973  and Zemey Rinpoche presided over Zong Rinpoche's parinirvana in 1984 so the above statement makes no sense. Please get your facts correct.

[DharmaSpace]

Also how many people are of Lama Tsonghapa's calibre in this day and age? To be able to combine the teachings form the various lineages and even come out with a new lineage for the the future. Especially if we have not gotten the permission from our lamas to do other types of practises?

I mean does the Gelug not have the practises that can bring us to enlightenment ? If the Gelug tradition has and that is a fact why does one need to look for this or that outside of the traditions. Looking for practises outside of the tradition without a valid real purpose sounds like the Gelug system of study is incomplete and does not provide the avenue for someone to become enlightened.

[Ensapa]

It was not hard to believe at all. Zemey Rinpoche stopped teaching immediately after this book was published and entered clear light immediately after as it was published by one of his students. It is horrible to see a student betray his own Lama in this way after all the years of care, love and guidance because of personal vendettas. I am pretty sure the stories were meant to make Gelugpas not indulge in non Gelug teachings, but the way it was written and translated was distorted in a way that it makes it look odd. I am sure there is a commentary to it but it is omitted on purpose for obvious reasons.

Do you have the sourse for this information?

It was an article that I read on this issue many years ago. I cant seem to find it again. The text says (from memory) "After the publication, Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche refused to speak until he passed away". Hmm. maybe the article wasnt accurate. Oh well.

[Losang_Tenpa]

It was not hard to believe at all. Zemey Rinpoche stopped teaching immediately after this book was published and entered clear light immediately after as it was published by one of his students. It is horrible to see a student betray his own Lama in this way after all the years of care, love and guidance because of personal vendettas. I am pretty sure the stories were meant to make Gelugpas not indulge in non Gelug teachings, but the way it was written and translated was distorted in a way that it makes it look odd. I am sure there is a commentary to it but it is omitted on purpose for obvious reasons.

Do you have the sourse for this information?

It was an article that I read on this issue many years ago. I cant seem to find it again. The text says (from memory) "After the publication, Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche refused to speak until he passed away". Hmm. maybe the article wasnt accurate. Oh well.

Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche was unable to speak after his 1984 stroke. Maybe the article got the facts wrong.

[WisdomBeing]

Gosh. Thanks Losang Tenpa and DharmaSpace for clarifying that Zemey Rinpoche hadn't gone into clear light after the publication of the Yellow book. It's quite scary that misinformation can be so easily spread. It's always good to have sources of whatever we say to refer to for further reading etc.

Anyway, going back to the Yellow Book, as HH Trijang Rinpoche was involved in the stories, i have no doubt at all about HH Trijang Rinpoche's qualities and I am sure that there was no intention to divide the Sangha but perhaps just to emphasise that each Gelugpa student should follow his or her own lineage. The Gelugpa lineage was after all a distillation of the other Tibetan schools by Lama Tsongkhapa, so it cannot be that the other schools are looked down upon or criticised. I would think that if anything, the advice would be more about focusing on our own tradition so that we can be focused and thus achieve the intended results.

[Losang_Tenpa]

I have a copy of the original Yellow Book and yes, the translator seems to have went out of his/her way to overemphasize/distort certain passages. Very unfortunate.

[Losang_Tenpa]

I have a copy of the original Yellow Book and yes, the translator seems to have went out of his/her way to overemphasize/distort certain passages. Very unfortunate.

I would also speculate, based on many English grammar errors, that whoever translated the Yellow Book was not a native English speaker.