Geshe Kelsang recognizes his mother's reincarnation

[Tenzin Gyatso]

I was thinking this should be another thread already.

Obviously Geshe Kelsang accepts reincarnation. In his book 'Intro to Buddhism' Geshe Kelsang goes on a few pages talking about dreams, etc about the correct identification of his mother's reincarnation. Is that wisdom or mystical?? If Westerners can accept Geshe Kelsang recognizing the incarnation of his mother from his dreams and signs, why not other incarnations or oracles??? Oracles are super mystical and I am not into them, but all the Tibetan lamas pretty much are. My monk friend asked me how come I accept the teachings of the Geshes but not the oracle part?? I couldn't answer. It just my Western wrong upbringing and maybe some arrogance?  oops... Do Geshe Kelsang's Western students accept this incarnation?

I mean Geshe Kelsang said very clearly he found the incarnation of his mother among his students. I know he didn't enthrone her or whatever, but it's pretty mystical right? I personally think it's cool-finding incarnations and all. Geshe Kelsang does believe or 'promote' some sort of reincarnation 'tulku' thing in the case of his mother. It's all over his book.

And this young girl (incarnation of Geshe Kelsang's mom and I think the name is Amaravajra) at a young age can speak Tibetan words like 'kyi' (dog). That is pretty mystical. Geshe Kelsang can have mystical dreams about finding his mother, but the oracle taking trance is not acceptable?

Shugden does not make sense.

Selective mysticism? Just thinking out loud ok? No offense to anyone.

[Zach]

We simply just dont do it in the NKT theres no mandate to recognise incarnations or use oracles.

[Lineageholder]

Hi Tenzin,

As Zach says, in our tradition, we don't recognise oracles or Tulkus - that's just how it is.

We're different to the Tibetan Gelugpa tradition.

[Zhalmed Pawo]

Yaa yaa yaa, I shall write about this, Wait for two days.

[triesa]

as Geshe Kelsang Gyatso is starting  a whole new traditions for the West, so in his traditions, he does not recognise tulkus or oracles, so no big deal. Some folks like the mystical tulkus and oracles, then they will join another traditions. Different strokes for different folks, different mind sets, I have no problem with that at all either. But it does not mean that the Tulkus system is not good or not valid. It is valid indeed!

The core esscense as I have mentioned in another thread is that Tsongkapa lineage and teachings are being spread in the many NKT centers, and they have a huge group of followers learning and practising the dharma. This is far more important that concentrating on how come Geshe Kelsang Gyatso chose to recongnise his mother using his dreams rather than the oracle system.

[Positive Change]

It is sad that everything has to be in this vein of a "great divide"! What happened to each his own? Why does it have to be always of two or more camps? Are we not of ONE camp? The camp of Samsara and any means to get out of here is fine so long as we live according to our Buddhist precepts? Buddha did teach 84,000 ways after all!

Perhaps it is a very innocent and child like way of seeing things but should it not be as simple as this? Why the constant battle of wits, the flurry of insults, the many put downs and the accumulation of more negative karma? Whatever happened to respect, human decency and politeness?

[Big Uncle]

as Geshe Kelsang Gyatso is starting  a whole new traditions for the West, so in his traditions, he does not recognise tulkus or oracles, so no big deal. Some folks like the mystical tulkus and oracles, then they will join another traditions. Different strokes for different folks, different mind sets, I have no problem with that at all either. But it does not mean that the Tulkus system is not good or not valid. It is valid indeed!

The core esscense as I have mentioned in another thread is that Tsongkapa lineage and teachings are being spread in the many NKT centers, and they have a huge group of followers learning and practising the dharma. This is far more important that concentrating on how come Geshe Kelsang Gyatso chose to recongnise his mother using his dreams rather than the oracle system.

I like this answer the most out of all the response that came through regarding this thread. Personally, I don't find anything wrong with what Geshe Kelsang Gyatso did. Perhaps, he felt that Tulku system wouldn't work for his organisation as it is largely based in the West.

That does not necessary reflect his own personal beliefs. The same goes with his views on oracles and the recognition of their oracular abilities. The split between his uncle and himself probably influenced his decision but I think he was thinking more for thousands of his students throughout the West. He, as a great Geshe was probably thinking that he would rather his students study the Dharma and apply its principles rather than relying on mystical oracles.

[dondrup]

Many of Geshe Kelsang Gyatso’s works are for the interest and benefit of the Western students.  Due to the difficulty of implementing the Gelugpa System of study in the Western World and also in using the Tibetan language, Geshe-la had compassionately requested permission from his root guru HH Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche to revamp and introduce a new system of study.   Geshe-la has come out with more than 18 books written in simple and clear English language minus all the unnecessary Tibetan cultural and historical stuffs.  Geshe-la had introduced the three new study programs designed for the Western World.  Geshe-la had also compiled and composed all the sadhanas in English instead of in Tibetan language.  The 9-line Mitgsema Mantra was once chanted in Tibetan at NKT.  However, Geshe-la had subsequently allowed his students to recite in English only.  There is no necessity to follow exactly how the Tibetans study in the Gelugpa system.  In short, Geshe-la is very skillful and compassionate when benefitting others.

NKT students will not lose out even if NKT does not adopt the Tulku or Oracular system.  Why?  Geshe-la has already taught the essence of Lama Tsongkhapa Teachings which include Lamrim, Lojong and Mahamudra.  NKT is also blessed with the transmission of Buddha Heruka/Vajrayogini lineage by Geshe-la.   All these teachings are more than sufficient for any NKT student to accomplish liberation and full enlightenment!

A highly attained master like Geshe Kelsang Gyatso knows what is best and relevant for all of his students.  Hence of the 84000 teachings of Lord Buddha, he had chosen not to adopt the Tulku and Oracular system in NKT.

 

[kurava]

I guess that since NKT had severed all ties with any Tibetan monastories, Geshe Kelsang is aware of the danger of  following the Tulku system in his organisation because it does not have the tested system of recognition as preserved by high monks in the monasteries.

He had remarked that the tulku system, if not well administered, will be abused for individuals' benefits and personal power.

How he runs his own organization is really no one else's business. His organization has one of the world's most wide spread network of dharma centres, his books are written for the benefit of modern day people,  clear and easily understood. I rejoice in his good work benefiting thousands of people beyond race and language barrier.

[Losang_Tenpa]

I guess that since NKT had severed all ties with any Tibetan monastories(sic)..

Are you sure about that?