Does Dorje Shugden really shorten HH the Dalai Lama's life?

[Matibhadra]

Looks like it is very possible for the Dalai Lama to live up to 90 or 100 years of age. With His longevity of life, it is proven beyond doubts that Dorje Shugden cannot do harm to Him as He has claimed to be so.

Placing the evil dalie where he belongs, the garbage bin of history, would not harm but rather benefit him. But even a supramundane protector such as Dorje Shugden cannot do anything about it, as long as Shugdenpas themselves show servile subservience to the evil monster.

As so many here have commented, enlightened beings like the Dalai Lama cannot be harmed by evil spirits.

Being an evil spirit himself, the evil dalie requires no one to harm him. However, some Shugdenpas are harmed by the evil dalie, because betraying their refuge in the Three Jewels they take refuge in the evil spirit, the monstrous dalie.

So one of the main reasons for Dalai Lama to impose the ban is baseless.

And what is even more baseless is Shugdenpas servilely submitting to the evil dalie's authority, and then complaining about it!

Another view to consider which I do is that Dorje Shugden is not a evil spirit but AN ENLIGHTENED BEING AND AS SUCH IS NOT CAPABLE OF HARMING ANY BEINGS. This is the valid conclusion to debunk the calling of Dorje Shugden as a evil spirit.

You should consider better your own correct view, and therefore abandon subservience to the evil dalie.

I rejoice that the Dalai Lama may live to 90 or 100 years of age, but then do we Shugdenpas also suffer the ban for another period of over 15 years or so.  That I feel is not fair and totally nonsense.

What would you expect, since many Shugdenpas are so subservient to the evil dalie? As long as this situation remains, the ban makes perfect sense.

[dsnowlion]

What a huge big lie this is as we can SEE NOW... what happened to praying to Dorje Shugden shorten's His Holiness's life? All a load of nonsense BS.

Now in this latest news His Holiness said Tibet’s protector deity Palden Lhamo assured him that he will live till 110 years at least, he added, “Although I am 84 now, I am healthy and confident about living upto 111.”

Well, in a way I do hope His Holiness will get his wish to be able to return to Tibet to see his people but I doubt the Umaylam way will be achieved especially if Tibetans keep creating problems like the recent protest they did to show solidarity with HK, and with LS going around saying things that would irk/provoke China further. Now internally they are ones creating the cause to lose Tibet forever. Don't go blaming Dorje Shugden.

Although many are requesting His Holiness to slow down due age... His Holiness is still travelling. He is set to travel to Mangalore after Manali news report.

His Holiness reassures Tibetans of his "excellent health"

DHARAMSHALA, August 20: His Holiness the Dalai Lama reassured board members of the Tibetan Association of Minnesota (TAM), who visited him at Von Ngari Monastery in Manali that he is healthy and will live long.

The 6-member executive board of TAM, in an audience with His Holiness on Monday, urged him to visit Mayo Clinic in the US for a health checkup.

The Tibetan spiritual leader thanked the visitors for their constant concern and told them he had started taking special care of his health and visiting a hospital in New Delhi which is also closer in case of emergency.

His Holiness had visited the famous clinic in Rochester, Minnesota, regularly in the past for annual checkup, discontinued now owing to the difficulty in long-distance travel in old age.

His Holiness mentioned a tumultuous flight to eastern India one time that got him introspecting about his health and the hopes of 6 million Tibetans that rest on him.

“Just as Tibetans never forget about me, I never forget about the 6 million Tibetan people.”

He recounted a dream he had a while ago in which the Tibet’s protector deity Palden Lhamo assured him that he will live till 110 years at least, he added, “Although I am 84 now, I am healthy and confident about living upto 111.”

He was briefly hospitalized in Max Hospital, Delhi in April this year for a chest infection that caused the Tibetans and well-wishers around the world to worry about his wellbeing.

Tibetans all around the world continues to urge for a less hectic schedule for their spiritual leader to leave room for much-needed rest.

His Holiness is going to rest at the monastery till August 28 after which he is set to travel to Mangalore.

Source: http://www.phayul.com/news/article.aspx?id=41689&article=His+Holiness+reassures+Tibetans+of+his+%22excellent+health%22

[Tracy]

What a huge big lie this is as we can SEE NOW... what happened to praying to Dorje Shugden shorten's His Holiness's life? All a load of nonsense BS.

Now in this latest news His Holiness said Tibet’s protector deity Palden Lhamo assured him that he will live till 110 years at least, he added, “Although I am 84 now, I am healthy and confident about living upto 111.”

Well, in a way I do hope His Holiness will get his wish to be able to return to Tibet to see his people but I doubt the Umaylam way will be achieved especially if Tibetans keep creating problems like the recent protest they did to show solidarity with HK, and with LS going around saying things that would irk/provoke China further. Now internally they are ones creating the cause to lose Tibet forever. Don't go blaming Dorje Shugden.

Although many are requesting His Holiness to slow down due age... His Holiness is still travelling. He is set to travel to Mangalore after Manali news report.

His Holiness reassures Tibetans of his "excellent health"

DHARAMSHALA, August 20: His Holiness the Dalai Lama reassured board members of the Tibetan Association of Minnesota (TAM), who visited him at Von Ngari Monastery in Manali that he is healthy and will live long.

The 6-member executive board of TAM, in an audience with His Holiness on Monday, urged him to visit Mayo Clinic in the US for a health checkup.

The Tibetan spiritual leader thanked the visitors for their constant concern and told them he had started taking special care of his health and visiting a hospital in New Delhi which is also closer in case of emergency.

His Holiness had visited the famous clinic in Rochester, Minnesota, regularly in the past for annual checkup, discontinued now owing to the difficulty in long-distance travel in old age.

His Holiness mentioned a tumultuous flight to eastern India one time that got him introspecting about his health and the hopes of 6 million Tibetans that rest on him.

“Just as Tibetans never forget about me, I never forget about the 6 million Tibetan people.”

He recounted a dream he had a while ago in which the Tibet’s protector deity Palden Lhamo assured him that he will live till 110 years at least, he added, “Although I am 84 now, I am healthy and confident about living upto 111.”

He was briefly hospitalized in Max Hospital, Delhi in April this year for a chest infection that caused the Tibetans and well-wishers around the world to worry about his wellbeing.

Tibetans all around the world continues to urge for a less hectic schedule for their spiritual leader to leave room for much-needed rest.

His Holiness is going to rest at the monastery till August 28 after which he is set to travel to Mangalore.

Source: http://www.phayul.com/news/article.aspx?id=41689&article=His+Holiness+reassures+Tibetans+of+his+%22excellent+health%22

How can Dorje Shugden shorten the Dalai Lama's life? If Dorje Shugden can do that, it means he has the power to override our Karma. This is impossible because the Buddha said everything that happens to us, is due to our action. No one, not even the Buddha can magically create an effect that is without the cause. However, Buddha can guide us how to change our karma or minimise the effect of our karma.

The CTA claim Dorje Shugden practice can shorten the Dalai Lama's life but he is now 84 years old, how to explain that? Did the CTA tell lie again?

Dorje Shugden is an emanation of Manjushri who is an enlightened being. It is absolutely safe for us to take refuge in Dorje Shugden. Modern people needs a protector practice to remove obstacles and Dorje Shugden arose 400 years ago for this purpose.

[Ngawang]

If Dorje Shugden can harm His Holiness the Dalai Lama's life, we are belittling the attainments of His Holiness who is believed to be the emanation of Buddha of Compassion, Chenrezig. There is no way an evil spirit can harm a high lama, let alone a fully enlightened Buddha. If that is the case, why are we even Buddhism?

Anyone with basic Dharma knowledge will be able to know that a fully enlightened Buddha does not have the karma to be harmed. On the other hand, high lamas like His Holiness has very high attainments that can easily exorcise evil spirits or subdue them. There are plenty of examples where high lamas subdued spirits with their compassion such as Guru Rinpoche with Nechung.

Hence, those who believe this nonsense about Dorje Shugden can harm His Holiness's life does not have a lot of Dharma knowledge.

[Tenzin K]

If we believe that His Holiness the Dalai Lama is the emanation of the Buddha of Compassion then how can Dorje Shugden harm him? In fact, His Holiness should be able to subdue Dorje Shugden if he really an evil spirit to prevent many people from being harmed just like any other highly attaint lama who subdue unenlightened being and make them swear to protect the Dharma and etc.

Furthermore, look at His Holiness now, does is life in threatening state? People are still practicing Dorje Shugden but there is nothing happen to His Holiness. Why state the reason for Dorje Shugden practice will shorten His Holiness life? This is totally invalid and proven a lie. Tibetan leadership should clarify their action on imposing ban on Dorje Shugden which created more severe suffering to the Dorje Shugden practitioners which violating religious freedom and human rights. All the lies that Tibetan leadership tells should be questioned now.

[Drolma]

If we believe that His Holiness the Dalai Lama is the emanation of the Buddha of Compassion then how can Dorje Shugden harm him? In fact, His Holiness should be able to subdue Dorje Shugden if he really an evil spirit to prevent many people from being harmed just like any other highly attaint lama who subdue unenlightened being and make them swear to protect the Dharma and etc.

Furthermore, look at His Holiness now, does is life in threatening state? People are still practicing Dorje Shugden but there is nothing happen to His Holiness. Why state the reason for Dorje Shugden practice will shorten His Holiness life? This is totally invalid and proven a lie. Tibetan leadership should clarify their action on imposing ban on Dorje Shugden which created more severe suffering to the Dorje Shugden practitioners which violating religious freedom and human rights. All the lies that Tibetan leadership tells should be questioned now.

Most people believe His Holiness the Dalai Lama is the emanation of Chenrezig. He represents compassion. However, what he has done to Dorje Shugden and Dorje Shugden followers is not compassionate, many people suffer because of the ban.

But on the other hand, since he is a Buddha, he has the clairvoyance to know the karma of all sentient beings and what needs to be done to help all sentient beings. Sometimes, the action of a higher beings seems to be unreasonable but it is to benefit us in long run and we don't have the karma to see it.

On that basis, we have to still respect the Dalai Lama if we believe he is and Buddha is one. Like what Trijang Rinpoche had said, we have to have faith in both the Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden. They may appear to have a conflict but they are not. One day, the truth will reveal.

[Tenzin K]

I think this question is not valid anymore because we can see Dalai Lama still standing strong now and he said he's well. Since this is the case can we consider the claimed as a lie? Should Tibetan leadership explain and clarify this matter? It's necessary because the ban had caused so much unnecessary suffering to so many people and if what has been claimed is not true, Tibetan leadership needs to lift the ban and reinstate Shugden practitioner's rights for their basic necessity.

Tibetan leadership cannot simply create havoc and just leave it like that. They have to be responsible for their actions and answer to their people. If Tibetan leadership claimed that they are democratic then pls act like one and have a dialogue with Tibetans and explain the situation. Dialogue is what Dalai Lama wants with China to discuss for their return to Tibet. Then dialogue should be heald between Tibetan leadership with the Tibetans including Shugden practitioners to discuss over the ban that being imposed and Tibetan leadership need to explain what is the outcome from the ban and how this ban has benefitted Dalai Lama and Tibetan as a whole. What Tibetan leadership had achieved from this ban. A dialogue must heald as democratic leaders as claimed by the Dalai Lama.

[Drolma]

I think this question is not valid anymore because we can see Dalai Lama still standing strong now and he said he's well. Since this is the case can we consider the claimed as a lie? Should Tibetan leadership explain and clarify this matter? It's necessary because the ban had caused so much unnecessary suffering to so many people and if what has been claimed is not true, Tibetan leadership needs to lift the ban and reinstate Shugden practitioner's rights for their basic necessity.

Tibetan leadership cannot simply create havoc and just leave it like that. They have to be responsible for their actions and answer to their people. If Tibetan leadership claimed that they are democratic then pls act like one and have a dialogue with Tibetans and explain the situation. Dialogue is what Dalai Lama wants with China to discuss for their return to Tibet. Then dialogue should be heald between Tibetan leadership with the Tibetans including Shugden practitioners to discuss over the ban that being imposed and Tibetan leadership need to explain what is the outcome from the ban and how this ban has benefitted Dalai Lama and Tibetan as a whole. What Tibetan leadership had achieved from this ban. A dialogue must heald as democratic leaders as claimed by the Dalai Lama.

I don't think practising Dorje Shugden will shorten the Dalai Lama's life. The Dalai Lama is the emanation of Chenrezig, he does not have the karma to be harmed. He was diagnosed with cancer but he recovered. He is in fact one of the longest living Dalai Lama. Many previous Dalai Lamas passed away quite young and there was no mention of being harmed by Dorje Shugden.

It is ridiculous to say a deity practice will shorten someone's life. How about people who practise voodoos, whose life will they shorten? If we believe in karma, the cause and effect, then we will know unless we have created the cause, otherwise we will not get the result.

Sometimes higher beings might say something that is not true. This is not to lie to us but to make us examine and make a conclusion ourselves. Buddha Shakyamuni's teaching has never been a blind faith, he asked us to experience it or to examine it before we make a conclusion. We are not asked to believe everything the Buddha say, we are told to examine and conclude.

[dsnowlion]

Well, all we gotta do is look at the Dalai Lama now people. He is all well and very healthy and still teaching isn't he?

If Dorje Shugden really CAN shorten His Holiness's life, wouldn't he be already gone by now? Why is he still around since we have Shar Gaden, Serpom, and soooo many more Dorje Shugden loyal students, centres and let's not forget NKT - biggest DS practising centre in the world and in Tibet all those monasteries still do Dorje Shugden... how it is NOT affecting the Dalai Lama's health/life? Let's get real and be logical please... obviously all that's been said about Dorje Shugden is a big fat LIE. For what reason is the BIG question!

[Drolma]

Well, all we gotta do is look at the Dalai Lama now people. He is all well and very healthy and still teaching isn't he?

If Dorje Shugden really CAN shorten His Holiness's life, wouldn't he be already gone by now? Why is he still around since we have Shar Gaden, Serpom, and soooo many more Dorje Shugden loyal students, centres and let's not forget NKT - biggest DS practising centre in the world and in Tibet all those monasteries still do Dorje Shugden... how it is NOT affecting the Dalai Lama's health/life? Let's get real and be logical please... obviously all that's been said about Dorje Shugden is a big fat LIE. For what reason is the BIG question!

Dorje Shugden practice cannot shorten anyone's life. It is our own karma that decides how long we will live. If we want to have a long life, create the cause for it. The current Dalai Lama is one of the longest living Dalai Lama, I wish His Holiness live long and continue to turn the wheel of Dharma to benefit many. Some people say the Dalai Lama is actually spreading Dorje Shugden practice by going against it strongly. This is quite possible, Dorje Shugden is the most famous protector in the world now. Even non-Buddhists know about Dorje Shugden. Sometimes we need negative news to get noticed.