Why the ban should be lifted!! Is the bigger picture argument justified?

[michaela]

Dear positive change

Look at my response below:

Dear Michaela... you did not touch once on why you think the ban is in place and that it does indeed have some very tangible positive affects but keep on insisting the ban needs to be removed because it is causing so much suffering, which by the way, is insinuating that HHDL is causing the suffering. Please be careful of wrong views towards a living Buddha! Have you ever wondered why it is hard to find fault (not that one should when it comes to HHDL) with HHDL except for with the ban? Ever thought it is because he wants it to be so?

Yes.  HHDL has some share in causing the split of major monasteries, discrimination and sufferings due to his implementation of the ban.  This is not wrong view.  This is fact.  He may have done it intentionally or unintentionally or even for bigger picture.  But the discriminations and the confusion that occurred due to the ban are facts.

Wrong views mean interpreting Buddha’s teaching the wrong way.  As HHDL stated himself, we need to continuously investigate the teachings.  So when a premise, in this case the arguments basing the ban, can no longer stand in the fair argument or debate, it has to go. 

I believe, the inactivity and acceptance using the premise that HHDL has his own reason, is worse.  It does not even serve the purpose of the ban or what HHDL always promote in his teaching, thorough investigation of the matter at hand.  HHDL once said during the forum with several scientists, if science can proof that certain aspect of Buddha’s teaching is wrong, than the teaching should change.  I am just advocating what he said here.  You can see that I have so much trust and faith in HHDL, but I use it in a different way with logic and thinking not only in pure acceptance.


Of course the ban does not make sense... it is not meant to. It is meant to spur us on... meant to give us the drive amidst adversity and come out "victorious". It is as you say it too, meant to make us contemplate and look deeper and realise why it is in place and NOT stop at why it does not make sense!

There are two ways to face adversity, to find reason that could calm your mind toward acceptance or to actually fight for what you believe is right.  We need to continue to think why it does not make sense so we can stop justifying the ban.  That is the investigation and learning that are emphasized in Buddhist teachings.  Without this investigation and learning, it is no better than blind faith although you are very much tempted to call it otherwise.

I now know why you are so passionate about lifting the ban as you are on the suffering camp and I empathise, but so am I but that does not mean we cannot see beyond our suffering and look at the silver lining in the clouds. It does not mean we should sit back on our laurels and pretend there is nothing wrong. It should push us beyond our comfort zones and spread Dorje Shugden in spite of it all. Find ways to spread that does not harm anyone... take for example the creator/creators of this website, the ban spurred and is still spurring them into making the effort in researching, compiling, designing, updating, maintaining, etc. I really do not think this website would come to be born without the ban and look at how many people are and will benefit from this website alone!!!

And questioning the ban and arguing why it should be lifted are not harming anyone so to say.  This website can still stand without the ban and continue to dissiminate information to those who needs it.


That is what I mean by looking beyond the ban and stop focusing on removing the ban. When you focus on spreading the truth, the ban will eventually fall to the wayside... you do not need HHDL to do that. That is just the easy way out... and no disrespect, the selfish way out!

You need to focus on two levels:
•   The removal of the ban that can be achieved by arguing and stop accepting without questioning what are you accepting
•   Spreading the truth about DS.

Only focusing on what would happen beyond the ban is like living the future and not in the presence.  We need HHDL to remove the ban because:
-  He advocating it
-  When all arguments fall, he is the only thing that stand in our way of lifting the ban.  Because he is a very respected Lama.  When he undo what he said, it will give a lot of credibility to our DS cause.

I do not see how this is selfish at all.

I know you mean well and I take what you say to heart naturally... of course there is suffering, of course we need to remove the ban but it is how we remove the ban that is in question here. Because that will show our true motivation towards Dorje Shugden!

I do not quite understand your statement here.  You propose to remove the ban based on the premise that it is ok for HHDL to implement the ban because he is an enlightened being and he is doing it for a bigger picture?

[Ensapa]

Woah, that's some pretty intense debate there, micheala and positive change.

Allow me to say a few words here regarding the ban. There are basis for both sides of the argument, that there is a bigger picture to the ban and that the ban was just a political move that is not really justified in any way. Let me first explain the basis to the bigger picture view that is the main view advocated by this forum and possibly, by many other high lamas as well. This is the reason why many of the DS lamas, with only the exception of Kundeling Rinpoche and Geshe Keslang Gyatso do not publicly challenge and criticize the Dalai Lama for the ban. Many of them just keep quiet, grow and nurture their Dharma centers and become big and powerful, or medium sized but still powerful and command a huge gathering of students while they are at it. The reason for this is because it has been predicted in Trijang Rinpoche's Music Delighting the Ocean of Protectors:

There is something I must mention at this point.   As stated above, the Great Fifth
Dalai Lama and Omniscient Panchen Rinpoche were like Lords of the Teachings. In
actuality they are, respectively, Arya Avalokiteswara and Buddha Amitabha
emanating in the human form of special holy beings. Yet this Lord of Dharma
Protectors exhibited an ability to harm or destroy them, and such events as the
Great Fifth, having been able to summon this Dharmapala to be burned with
intense samadhi but not accomplish it, also shows that the enlightening activities
of these great masters and those of this Dharmapala are each as mutually
universal and pervasive as the other. But some who are narrow minded, not
understanding this point, consider this Dharmapala to be like an ordinary worldly
being and, with supposed faith in the Dalai Lama and the Panchen Lama,
disparage him; or else they indeed admire this great Dharmapala but criticize the
Dalai Lama or Panchen Lama. Using either one as a reason not to admire the other
and speaking badly about either in any way is the conduct of an ordinary being
who, under the influence of attachment and hatred, just tries to help friends and
hurt enemies; it obscures the increase of these great holy Aryas' deeds and
creates the karmic cause to experience unbearable suffering in the future. Why is
this true? Because it is utterly impossible that such great beings, who are special
emanations of Arya Avalokiteswara and Buddha Amitabha, could lack the power
to overcome the harmful force of any sort of magical spell, harmful demon, or
spirit. This is because they are both powerful Lords who have overcome external
and internal maras without exception.   
Again, some who like to speak illogically say that there is resentment
between this lord of Dharma Guardians and the Great Dharmaraja Nechung and
that it is therefore unsuitable for the Tibetan Government and its workers to rely
upon this Protector.   
This is a projection of ordinary faults upon those of high realization, special
Dharmapalas, out of habituation to their own common bad behavior of
competitiveness, prejudice, and harboring of grudges. It simply reveals complete
ignorance of the nature of these Dharmpalas, the extent of their realizations, and
knowledge of what they protect and do not protect. If such Dharmapalas were
motivated by competitiveness, attachment, hatred, and jealousy, how could it be
suitable for those who seek liberation to rely upon and make offerings to them?  
This is because not relying upon or associating with vicious worldly gods and
ghosts is one of the precepts of having gone for refuge.   

So it is clear that, the ban has been indirectly predicted by Trijang Rinpoche and that he has also mentioned very clearly on the misunderstandings that will surface, including the claim that Nechung does not support Dorje Shugden. If he does not, he should not be relied upon as it shows he has jealousy and thus, not a suitable object of refuge or to get advice from.  Trijang Rinpoche also pointed out that criticizing either the Dalai Lama or Dorje Shugden brings about a lot of negative karma and advised against doing so. This is the reason why positive change is siding for the Dalai Lama.

On micheala's side, it is not possible to deny the damage that the ban has done to Dorje Shugden practitioners. We have witnessed people getting their homes and properties destroyed, all their possessions are decimated and their family members are threatened and being treated like pariahs in their own community, the irony being, that Dorje Shugden practitioners end up being exiled in their own exiled community, just because they practice Dorje Shugden they are accused of going against the Dalai Lama and shortening his life when all they are doing are just holding on to the practices that their teachers have given them and keeping their samaya clean. We have also witnessed old, helpless lamas being kicked out of the monastery, where a majority of the lamas in the monastery were personally trained by him. They mercilessly threw him out into the streets with nothing at all despite all of the contributions that he has done for the monastery. Then around the world, people get divided over this issue and many people end up criticizing Dorje Shugden even though they do not know much about him. It has also caused much schism between Dharma centers where the ones that want to look "clean" accuse the practitioners as being dirty and there is in short, lots of politics going around due to the ban. In so many ways, it is horrendous and in more ways than one, one cannot help to wonder why would the Dalai Lama keep silent on all of this horrible acts.

But despite this, for me, I think we should not ignore the negatives that the ban has brought upon, but at the same time, we should not criticize the Dalai Lama, as advised by Trijang Rinpoche. After all, he is our lineage lama and it is best that we follow his advice.

[Lineageholder]

There is no telling if the ban was actually Trijang Rinpoche's direct instruction to the Dalai Lama for purposes that we do not know and that HHDL was actually following his Guru's instructions all along.

The 'big picture' requires speculation trying to justify the Dalai Lama's divisive speech and actions and this speculation is becoming wilder and wilder.  PLEASE - it's clear that the Dalai Lama is acting against H.H. Trijang Rinpoche's intention, even threatening the incarnation of his Teacher in order to get him to give up his practice of Dorje Shugden, saying of Trijang Rinpoche "the old man had a green brain" and clearly saying in the Swiss documentary that his Guru was wrong.

Now we're speculating that this madness might be a direct instruction from Trijang Rinpoche!

Perhaps Langdarma destroyed the Buddhadharma in Tibet because he wanted to make it grow bigger and 'sort the wheat from the chaff'?  Where does such speculation stop? 

Soon we will be using a 'big picture' to prove that black is white!

[Positive Change]

Dear positive change

Look at my response below:

Dear Michaela... you did not touch once on why you think the ban is in place and that it does indeed have some very tangible positive affects but keep on insisting the ban needs to be removed because it is causing so much suffering, which by the way, is insinuating that HHDL is causing the suffering. Please be careful of wrong views towards a living Buddha! Have you ever wondered why it is hard to find fault (not that one should when it comes to HHDL) with HHDL except for with the ban? Ever thought it is because he wants it to be so?

Yes.  HHDL has some share in causing the split of major monasteries, discrimination and sufferings due to his implementation of the ban.  This is not wrong view.  This is fact.  He may have done it intentionally or unintentionally or even for bigger picture.  But the discriminations and the confusion that occurred due to the ban are facts.

Wrong views mean interpreting Buddha’s teaching the wrong way.  As HHDL stated himself, we need to continuously investigate the teachings.  So when a premise, in this case the arguments basing the ban, can no longer stand in the fair argument or debate, it has to go. 

I believe, the inactivity and acceptance using the premise that HHDL has his own reason, is worse.  It does not even serve the purpose of the ban or what HHDL always promote in his teaching, thorough investigation of the matter at hand.  HHDL once said during the forum with several scientists, if science can proof that certain aspect of Buddha’s teaching is wrong, than the teaching should change.  I am just advocating what he said here.  You can see that I have so much trust and faith in HHDL, but I use it in a different way with logic and thinking not only in pure acceptance.


Of course the ban does not make sense... it is not meant to. It is meant to spur us on... meant to give us the drive amidst adversity and come out "victorious". It is as you say it too, meant to make us contemplate and look deeper and realise why it is in place and NOT stop at why it does not make sense!

There are two ways to face adversity, to find reason that could calm your mind toward acceptance or to actually fight for what you believe is right.  We need to continue to think why it does not make sense so we can stop justifying the ban.  That is the investigation and learning that are emphasized in Buddhist teachings.  Without this investigation and learning, it is no better than blind faith although you are very much tempted to call it otherwise.

I now know why you are so passionate about lifting the ban as you are on the suffering camp and I empathise, but so am I but that does not mean we cannot see beyond our suffering and look at the silver lining in the clouds. It does not mean we should sit back on our laurels and pretend there is nothing wrong. It should push us beyond our comfort zones and spread Dorje Shugden in spite of it all. Find ways to spread that does not harm anyone... take for example the creator/creators of this website, the ban spurred and is still spurring them into making the effort in researching, compiling, designing, updating, maintaining, etc. I really do not think this website would come to be born without the ban and look at how many people are and will benefit from this website alone!!!

And questioning the ban and arguing why it should be lifted are not harming anyone so to say.  This website can still stand without the ban and continue to dissiminate information to those who needs it.


That is what I mean by looking beyond the ban and stop focusing on removing the ban. When you focus on spreading the truth, the ban will eventually fall to the wayside... you do not need HHDL to do that. That is just the easy way out... and no disrespect, the selfish way out!

You need to focus on two levels:
•   The removal of the ban that can be achieved by arguing and stop accepting without questioning what are you accepting
•   Spreading the truth about DS.

Only focusing on what would happen beyond the ban is like living the future and not in the presence.  We need HHDL to remove the ban because:
-  He advocating it
-  When all arguments fall, he is the only thing that stand in our way of lifting the ban.  Because he is a very respected Lama.  When he undo what he said, it will give a lot of credibility to our DS cause.

I do not see how this is selfish at all.

I know you mean well and I take what you say to heart naturally... of course there is suffering, of course we need to remove the ban but it is how we remove the ban that is in question here. Because that will show our true motivation towards Dorje Shugden!

I do not quite understand your statement here.  You propose to remove the ban based on the premise that it is ok for HHDL to implement the ban because he is an enlightened being and he is doing it for a bigger picture?

Dear Michaela... it seems like we are splitting hairs here... lol! For some reason, you still have not address my following points:

1. Do you think for a moment that perhaps in light of the "negativity and suffering" you say is caused by the ban, there is perhaps also a silver lining? In that the practice of Dorje Shugden which we BOTH obviously hold dear has actually spread and is spreading much further than it would ever because of the ban? Is this not a matter to rejoice in? I am not saying forget the suffering, I am merely saying there is a very positive result that is emerging from the ban TOO.

You keep trying to defend you point on the fact that HHDL is causing the suffering and that the ban needs to be removed. Point taken! I never disagreed with you on that. I merely tried to point out that there is another reason for it. It could be a two pronged approached used in many advertisement campaigns to leverage on exposure. I mean no disrespect at all when I liken Dorje Shugden to a mere ad campaign... but i am merely using "extremes" to illustrate a point which could have some truth to it. As a matter of fact it does have concrete proof that the practice is indeed spreading especially compared to before the ban came into play. And we need to acknowledge this fact and not be so focussed on the negativity.

Once again, I am not dismissing the suffering the ban has and is creating... and I am not saying HHDL has no "wrong". What I am saying is, please do not view HHDL in such negative light because his actions and motivations are perhaps beyond our comprehension at this moment and could be for the betterment of sentient beings on a whole. Is HHDL not an emanation of Chenrezig? If one doubts that, then one doubts the very teachings of Buddha. Is it up to us spiraling in samsara to judge someone like HHDL? I think not.

We can hypothesis, contemplate and assume but always bear in mind the pure motivations of a being like HHDL. That is what I meant by wrong view! Not that the "obvious" contradictions HHDL is manifesting isn't true... it is... but one has to look beyond that and grasp why such methods are being used.

So Michaela... we are actually on the same page... it is just a very subtle mindset that sets us apart. I am not saying I am right, I dare not assume that but I know HHDL IS and has PURE motivation because my trust in the Buddhas is beyond my own human perception and logic.

I wish you a blessed day and week to come! I really enjoy our discourse and debate!

[dsiluvu]

As you have read Trijang Rinpoche’s ‘Music Delighting the Ocean of Protectors’, you would have seen what Trijang Rinpoche said. If we admire Trijang Rinpoche so much and hold him so dear, we cannot be selective over which advice we follow and which we don’t. If HH Trijang Rinpoche told us to not lose faith in both these iconic beings, there MUST be a reason. As I am way too stupid to see anything from where I am standing, I will just humbly defer to this Buddha, HH Trijang Rinpoche.

Honestly I think I'd like to go with what His Holiness Trijang Rinpoche said in Music Delighting. Not to lose "faith" on both sides HHDL and DS. I think this a healthier perspective and just do what is necessary to spread Dorje Shugden. The thought of those who suffered is definitely there and I too dislike the idea of HIDING to spread Dorje Shugden just because of this silly BAN and I'm not even any where near India!

However, I do not think HHDL is a silly man and does this BAN on the purpose of making others suffer though unfortunately this has happened, is happening. HHDL did cause this havoc and this split between friends, family, sangha and monasteries. But for what reason? For what MOTIVATION? That is the question I ask.

But after much thought and questioning and observating... I have came to conclusion, when in doubt trust the Guru and my Guru says Trust his Guru... HH Trijang Dorje Chang which in a way made me realised that all this way a long time premeditated already otherwise how could Trijang Rinpoche predict this and advice us not to "bias" and have faith. Why did He say that... He must have foreseen this... and why did He not stop it then? Unless it would bring more good then bad.

Yes it is easy to blame HHDL... it is obvious. It is quite straight forward! But I think it is rather more complex then we think. But whatever it is, it sure ain't slowing down Dorje Shugden from growing. Whether the ban is justifiable or now... when Dorje Shugden becomes main stream... just like everything else in this world... the Ban will be forgotten or silenced. I don't think the CTA will last after HHDL passes anyway.

[Ensapa]

The 'big picture' requires speculation trying to justify the Dalai Lama's divisive speech and actions and this speculation is becoming wilder and wilder.  PLEASE - it's clear that the Dalai Lama is acting against H.H. Trijang Rinpoche's intention, even threatening the incarnation of his Teacher in order to get him to give up his practice of Dorje Shugden, saying of Trijang Rinpoche "the old man had a green brain" and clearly saying in the Swiss documentary that his Guru was wrong.

Now we're speculating that this madness might be a direct instruction from Trijang Rinpoche!

Perhaps Langdarma destroyed the Buddhadharma in Tibet because he wanted to make it grow bigger and 'sort the wheat from the chaff'?  Where does such speculation stop? 

Soon we will be using a 'big picture' to prove that black is white!

Sometimes, it is much easier to accept something that appears as it is, to take the information that is on the surface and then act in accordance with that even if it is wrong and even if the results are the opposite of what the Dharma is and the opposite of what the general public perceive as right. It's definitely easier to dismiss information selectively, choosing only the angle that we are comfortable with and sticking to that rather than taking in all information and taking them into account. But the results of this is that, if our angle is wrong and we misinform others or direct our hatred at something that we are not supposed to, we break our vows and samaya to our own teacher as well. Sure, the Dalai Lama may deride Trijang Rinpoche now, but in the text it says clearly that no matter what happens we should still respect the Dalai Lama. Selective reading is not exactly something that I would consider a wise trait to have, neither is it something that I would openly show to people especially in a forum. Conspiracy and speculation or not, the point being is that Trijang Rinpoche did see it coming and did remind us to respect the Dalai Lama and Panchen Lama.

But some who are narrow minded, not
understanding this point, consider this Dharmapala to be like an ordinary worldly
being and, with supposed faith in the Dalai Lama and the Panchen Lama,
disparage him; or else they indeed admire this great Dharmapala but criticize the
Dalai Lama or Panchen Lama. Using either one as a reason not to admire the other
and speaking badly about either in any way is the conduct of an ordinary being
who, under the influence of attachment and hatred, just tries to help friends and
hurt enemies; it obscures the increase of these great holy Aryas' deeds and
creates the karmic cause to experience unbearable suffering in the future. Why is
this true? Because it is utterly impossible that such great beings, who are special
emanations of Arya Avalokiteswara and Buddha Amitabha, could lack the power
to overcome the harmful force of any sort of magical spell, harmful demon, or
spirit. This is because they are both powerful Lords who have overcome external
and internal maras without exception.   

I quote again. This is what Trijang Rinpoche wrote about criticizing the Dalai Lama which is why anything could be possible. I have even bolded that part to bring your attention to it. So, how do you explain this sentence with what you just said about my speculation? This is not speculation but cold, hard proof that Trijang Rinpoche somewhat predicted the ban by talking about its outcome many years before the actual ban started, and what is more amazing is he actually tells what to do in the event of that happening. To deny this and ignore this sentence because its easier to hate HHDL for what he has done to Dorje Shugden practitioners is the same as saying that Trijang Rinpoche is wrong...and thats what HHDL said in one of the videos that you mentioned....so yeah. 2 ends of the spectrum which is why it is more than meaningless to fall into either view, but more meaningful to uphold the position and the view that Trijang Rinpoche has taught. I mean, what else can he be referring to when he said that there will be people who will deride the protector and promote the Dalai Lama or deride the Dalai Lama and promote the protector? The ban of course!!

I am sure that there is already more than enough proof on this thread alone on why the ban was somehow meant to be in an odd way (Trijang Rinpoche predicted it!) So i'll leave everyone to think and ponder on this couplet of Music Delighting the Ocean of Protectors. I would like to see anyone who wants to challenge or re-interpret Trijang Rinpoche's crystal clear instructions.

[michaela]

Positive Change

See my response below!!

Dear Michaela... it seems like we are splitting hairs here... lol! For some reason, you still have not address my following points:

1. Do you think for a moment that perhaps in light of the "negativity and suffering" you say is caused by the ban, there is perhaps also a silver lining? In that the practice of Dorje Shugden which we BOTH obviously hold dear has actually spread and is spreading much further than it would ever because of the ban? Is this not a matter to rejoice in? I am not saying forget the suffering, I am merely saying there is a very positive result that is emerging from the ban TOO.

You keep trying to defend you point on the fact that HHDL is causing the suffering and that the ban needs to be removed. Point taken! I never disagreed with you on that. I merely tried to point out that there is another reason for it. It could be a two pronged approached used in many advertisement campaigns to leverage on exposure. I mean no disrespect at all when I liken Dorje Shugden to a mere ad campaign... but i am merely using "extremes" to illustrate a point which could have some truth to it. As a matter of fact it does have concrete proof that the practice is indeed spreading especially compared to before the ban came into play. And we need to acknowledge this fact and not be so focussed on the negativity.

The result of the ban is mixed in my view.  Yes, there are some people who know DS because of the ban.  But because DS issue has been framed as the issue of spirit worship and not a religious persecution – it does not have the prestige that I thought it deserves.  The ban does get some exposures in major periodicals, but most of these periodicals only mentioned it in passing as some kind of weird looking deity worship.  I think after more than a decade, the ban has outlived its usefulness, and it is time for it to be removed.

I contributed the growth of DS practice today to many Lamas who work underground to spread DS teachings and to educate the general masses that DS is a very powerful protector and not so much to the ban.  Imagine, without the ban, these Lamas can speak openly and gave DS empowerment openly.  There will be less doubt as to whether it is good to practice DS.

Once again, I am not dismissing the suffering the ban has and is creating... and I am not saying HHDL has no "wrong". What I am saying is, please do not view HHDL in such negative light because his actions and motivations are perhaps beyond our comprehension at this moment and could be for the betterment of sentient beings on a whole. Is HHDL not an emanation of Chenrezig? If one doubts that, then one doubts the very teachings of Buddha. Is it up to us spiraling in samsara to judge someone like HHDL? I think not.

We can hypothesis, contemplate and assume but always bear in mind the pure motivations of a being like HHDL. That is what I meant by wrong view! Not that the "obvious" contradictions HHDL is manifesting isn't true... it is... but one has to look beyond that and grasp why such methods are being used.
I think there are some misunderstanding here.  You are riding on assumption that I view HHDL in negative light.  That is a very common but annoying misunderstanding.  Once one does not agree with someone, it is viewed as “negative.”  You really have to separate between an attack on HHDL personality and the attack of the ban.  They are two different topics!

I do not view HHDL in negative light.  I only argue for the removal of the ban, why the ban should be removed, and why HHDL has a very important role in removing the ban.  There is a big difference here.  I am a big fan of HHDL and have read many of his books.  That is how I can argue with you about the investigation of Buddhist teachings.  HHDL is the big advocate of encouraging everyone to thoroughly investigate the Buddhist teachings.  He even once said that if science can proof certain aspect of Buddhist teachings are wrong, the teachings must change.  The same should be implemented for the ban.  When the basis of the ban cannot be defended anymore, it should go.  It should go sooner rather than later.

Thus, if there are any bigger pictures to be served here, it will be further investigation of Buddhist teachings and the validity of arguments basing the ban.  Pure acceptance of what HHDL said as right without further investigation, will not serve the cause of him implementing the ban in the first place.

So Michaela... we are actually on the same page... it is just a very subtle mindset that sets us apart. I am not saying I am right, I dare not assume that but I know HHDL IS and has PURE motivation because my trust in the Buddhas is beyond my own human perception and logic.

I wish you a blessed day and week to come! I really enjoy our discourse and debate!
 

[michaela]

Dear Lineage Holder

I agree with you that “the bigger picture” arguments are often misused to justify and tolerate the existence of the ban.  In addition, there are so many imaginations running high when defending a specific argument using the word “perhaps” and “if” bluring the focus of the argument at hand.

However, I never doubted that HHDL is a living Buddha and he has a good intention to benefit beings.  When I do not agree with his specific actions I just argue against the action and not the personality.  One of the main reasons for this is Trijang Rinpoche thinks that HHDL is a living Buddha and Trijang Rinpoche encourages us to not lose faith in HHDL or DS.

My best wishes for you 

[Ensapa]

Dear Lineage Holder

I agree with you that “the bigger picture” arguments are often misused to justify and tolerate the existence of the ban.  In addition, there are so many imaginations running high when defending a specific argument using the word “perhaps” and “if” bluring the focus of the argument at hand.

However, I never doubted that HHDL is a living Buddha and he has a good intention to benefit beings.  When I do not agree with his specific actions I just argue against the action and not the personality.  One of the main reasons for this is Trijang Rinpoche thinks that HHDL is a living Buddha and Trijang Rinpoche encourages us to not lose faith in HHDL or DS.

My best wishes for you 

The 'bigger picture' does indeed exist. Proof of the bigger picture is what the previous Trijang Rinpoche has wrote, and further proof of it is how so many pro Dorje Shugden monasteries around, especially Shar Ganden and Serpom  are still doing the prayer for Dalai Lama's long life in their dedications. This to me shows very clearly that there is a "bigger picture" and that we can be Dorje Shugden practitioners without being against the Dalai Lama even though the ban has caused divisions and much pain to us, Dorje Shugden practitioners. So yes, I do respect the Dalai Lama but I do not agree to his ban or rather, how it was implemented.

[DharmaSpace]

With time  Dorje Shugden has gotten more prominence and acceptance throughout the world, and no matter what the Dalai Lama has said and what TGIE has thrown at the Dorje Shugden practitioners and the practice Dorje Shugden practice has just gotten that much stronger. There are much more Dorje Shugden monasteries manifesting as a result of the ban, the lifting of the ban is being worked on by the many key dorje shugden lamas.

The Dorje Shugden ban although in the beginning it looked to be very formidable and powerful, but it has led to the differentiation between people who were truly devoted to their lamas, practices and those who ran at the sign of trouble.  So only those who had real conviction to Dorje Shugden stayed on to carry on the practice. Evidence does suggest a bigger picture is at play here.

The Dalai Lama is enlightened that is for sure, does he not know what exactly he is doing, why would an enlightened do anything to harm the cause of Buddhism. 

[Ensapa]

With time  Dorje Shugden has gotten more prominence and acceptance throughout the world, and no matter what the Dalai Lama has said and what TGIE has thrown at the Dorje Shugden practitioners and the practice Dorje Shugden practice has just gotten that much stronger. There are much more Dorje Shugden monasteries manifesting as a result of the ban, the lifting of the ban is being worked on by the many key dorje shugden lamas.

The Dorje Shugden ban although in the beginning it looked to be very formidable and powerful, but it has led to the differentiation between people who were truly devoted to their lamas, practices and those who ran at the sign of trouble.  So only those who had real conviction to Dorje Shugden stayed on to carry on the practice. Evidence does suggest a bigger picture is at play here.

The Dalai Lama is enlightened that is for sure, does he not know what exactly he is doing, why would an enlightened do anything to harm the cause of Buddhism.

However it is, i would see that all the damage done by the ban can be reversed as all it takes for that to happen is the Dalai Lama saying that he was mistaken about Dorje Shugden and the ban, and therefore everyone is free to practice Dorje Shugden again, and that they are welcomed to his teachings. It isnt something that is set in stone, the ban, so i strongly believe that it will be reversed when the time is right and all the damage that the ban has done to Buddhism will also be undone at the same time. Think about it: if HHDL was really serious about the ban, he would have erased all traces of Dorje Shugden in the Buddhist texts and scriptures and from that day onwards, Dorje Shugden would be forgotten for good. That did not happen, so the Dalai Lama's intentions with the ban is quite clear for me from here.

[Gabby Potter]

Although I'm not a direct disciple of His Holiness, but I definitely believe that His Holiness has his reasons for implementing the ban. For an enlightened being like HH, there's no way for Him to do something like this to hurt people, why would He do that? I don't think He will receive any rewards by doing this.

[Matibhadra]

Although I'm not a direct disciple of His Holiness, but I definitely believe that His Holiness has his reasons for implementing the ban.

Every criminal has his reasons to commit his crimes, and the evil dalai is no exception. The evil dalai's reasons are his wish to impose on Tibetans an absolute theocracy based on his own personality cult, while protected by the Western press which always sells him to the naive as the great herald of human rights.

And why? Because just like any petty subservient Western-sponsored dictator, he would give away his country to the West, exactly as did his predecessor, the and anti-Dorje Shugden witch-hunter the evil 13th dalai, for instance, when he traitorously gave away to the brutal British invaders and colonizers a huge chunk of Tibet, now known as “Arunachal Pradesh” in India.

For an enlightened being like HH, there's no way for Him to do something like this to hurt people, why would He do that?

To hurt people and for personal profit, just like any evil puppet dictator, which is definitive evidence of the evil dalai's ordinary, corrupt, and perverse nature.

I don't think He will receive any rewards by doing this.

Of course he will. He will be rewarded by his Western bosses with such things as Nobel Prizes, corruption money, favorable untruthful press coverage, meetings with corrupt political leaders, and whatever else befits his role as a subservient puppet-dictator and posterboy of Western anti-China and anti-Buddhist war propaganda. Afterwards he will be rewarded with a place of honor in the garbage bin of history, together with Pinochets, Pahlavis, Suhartos, Mubaraks, and so many other petty criminal puppet-dictators at the service of US-led relentless war against humanity.