Is it true?

[Tenzin Gyatso]

There is talk here in Dharamsala concerning Shar Ganden wishing to join back with Ganden Monastery.

Reasons according to the hot talk here:

1.They are not getting enough sponsorship so feeding the monks is getting difficult.

2.They are feeling alienated (their own creation) from family, friends and their teachers left behind in Ganden.

3.They feel there is no end to this conflict and no point in contradicting His Holiness Dalai Lama any further as they have gained nothing.

4.Has anyone heard? They are seeking audience with HHDL to apologize and seeking permission to rejoin Ganden Monastery. They are willing to swear against Shugden's practice. 

It is good news. They will set a very good example to Shugden people all around the world.

Is this true though?

[Losang_Tenpa]

1.They are not getting enough sponsorship so feeding the monks is getting difficult.
Wrong, actually they have grown faster than any other monastery in the area. Doubled is size in about 3 years....and the best is yet to come!

2.They are feeling alienated (their own creation) from family, friends and their teachers left behind in Ganden.
Some perhaps, but this is one big family with many supporters all over the globe.

3.They feel there is no end to this conflict and no point in contradicting His Holiness Dalai Lama any further as they have gained nothing. 
Keeping samaya is 'gaining' much more than you may realize.

4.Has anyone heard? They are seeking audience with HHDL to apologize and seeking permission to rejoin Ganden Monastery. They are willing to swear against Shugden's practice. 
Absolutely ridiculous!

It is good news. They will set a very good example to Shugden people all around the world.

Is this true though? Of course not....not sure where you get your information but maybe seems just wishful thinking. No matter, Shar Gaden is moving forward and gets stronger as the days go by.

[Big Uncle]

1.They are not getting enough sponsorship so feeding the monks is getting difficult.
Wrong, actually they have grown faster than any other monastery in the area. Doubled is size in about 3 years....and the best is yet to come!

2.They are feeling alienated (their own creation) from family, friends and their teachers left behind in Ganden.
Some perhaps, but this is one big family with many supporters all over the globe.

3.They feel there is no end to this conflict and no point in contradicting His Holiness Dalai Lama any further as they have gained nothing. 
Keeping samaya is 'gaining' much more than you may realize.

4.Has anyone heard? They are seeking audience with HHDL to apologize and seeking permission to rejoin Ganden Monastery. They are willing to swear against Shugden's practice. 
Absolutely ridiculous!

It is good news. They will set a very good example to Shugden people all around the world.

Is this true though? Of course not....not sure where you get your information but maybe seems just wishful thinking. No matter, Shar Gaden is moving forward and gets stronger as the days go by.

However, I think that Shar Gaden would unite with Gaden Shartse one day when the ban has been lifted and not before. There's no doubt about that because by then, it would be time to spread Dorje Shugden practice all over and they can begin with the monastic institutions first. When the time comes, all of Gelug would have to embrace Dorje Shugden.

I think the respective Abbots of the great Gelug monasteries are all praying for the time to come soon. No real Abbot would want to see the lineage being split apart and the monastic institutions fragmented. By then, Dorje Shugden practice and lineage would be so huge and extremely beneficial. It is after all the shared lineage amongst all Gelug monastic institutions and since it is apparent that Dorje Shugden is an important and crucial element in our lineage, the great monasteries must incorporate Dorje Shugden.

I think it would be important that people realize that the previous Dalai Lama, regent and emperor of China enthroned Dorje Shugden as the principle protector of the Gaden lineage. He arose specifically to protect Lama Tsongkhapa's lineage. Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche wrote about this in his commentary, Music Delighting an Ocean of Conquerors. When the ban gets lifted, it would be high time all Gelug recognize this and officially incorporate it in the monastic system. That's what i think and so, all Dorje Shugden monasteries that have broken away from their mother monasteries should join back with their mother monasteries so they can pass on the lineage teachings. 

[wang]

 Reasons according to the hot talk here:

1.They are not getting enough sponsorship so feeding the monks is getting difficult.'

Tenzin,  your reason just shows how ignorant you guys to the actual situation is...

Just read an article in a Taiwanese blog who stayed in Garden monastery for some time, before the split.  She/he reported that  monks pratice DS was not giving the part they would have from public offering, simply because they  'not follow HHDL's advice, not because they pratice DS' according the Khensur Rinpoche. (Anyway this reasoning looks ...')

So monks practice DS already be treated as inferior group before the split and  be punished by not having offering they should have as a member of the monastery,  what is the point of going back if just for money...?

Be noted that this is an report by a anti-DS Taiwanese, she/he obviously don't know what it mean by 'fair'...

[Galen]

Dear Tenzin Gyatso,

Your news on Shar Ganden wanting to reunite with Ganden is definitely not true. This is because Shar Ganden has grown and expanded more since the split. There are more buildings being built to accommodate more monks and renovations being done to the Prayer Hall. I know of this is because a friend of mine went to for the Ordination of Domo Geshe Rinpoche saw this all for himself. The hospital has also been completed.

And with Domo Geshe Rinpoche being there, definitely more sponsorship will be coming into Shar Ganden.

I also agree with Big Uncle that one day both Shar Ganden and Ganden will merge again when the ban on Dorje Shugden is lifted. We shall wait and see whether your news are true or not. I doubt so.

[Zach]

You must have been listening to a Liar Tenzin Gyatso. 

[Tammy]

1.They are not getting enough sponsorship so feeding the monks is getting difficult.
Wrong, actually they have grown faster than any other monastery in the area. Doubled is size in about 3 years....and the best is yet to come!

2.They are feeling alienated (their own creation) from family, friends and their teachers left behind in Ganden.
Some perhaps, but this is one big family with many supporters all over the globe.

3.They feel there is no end to this conflict and no point in contradicting His Holiness Dalai Lama any further as they have gained nothing. 
Keeping samaya is 'gaining' much more than you may realize.

4.Has anyone heard? They are seeking audience with HHDL to apologize and seeking permission to rejoin Ganden Monastery. They are willing to swear against Shugden's practice. 
Absolutely ridiculous!

It is good news. They will set a very good example to Shugden people all around the world.

Is this true though? Of course not....not sure where you get your information but maybe seems just wishful thinking. No matter, Shar Gaden is moving forward and gets stronger as the days go by.

Good try! But next time you plan to spread untrue statements, please quote the source(s), because without quoting the source of your information, how do you expect us to believe you just because you share the same name as the HHDL?

News and articles about the grand ceremony took place in Shar Gaden is all over the net and those who did not have the merits to witness it could still admire the grandeur via photos taken. Shar Gaden is definitely DOING VERY WELL. Wake up my friend.

[michaela]

Dear Tenzin Gyatso

Please read this thread about monks in Serpom and Shar Gaden.  It appears they are doing fine 

[michaela]

The thread:

http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=1625.0

[Manjushri]

Dear Tenzin Gyatso,

My question is where did you get this information from, and if you could provide a link to back up the "hot talk", because I ain't buying nothing honey. How do you know what the Shar Ganden monks feel, or how the dynamics/situation in Shar Ganden is when you're not in there?

Many novice monks joined Shar Ganden, and if the monastery couldn't provide for them, I do not think they would've accepted such a large group of novice monks.

Also, I know for a fact that it was Shar Ganden who raised and got the money to pay for the real gold painting/touch-up for Zong Rinpoche's and Trijang Rinpoche's stupa recently to make it as grand as it is today when Ganden monastery could not afford to. If it's any one who is in a more dire situation, I think it would be Ganden, no? Ganden Shartse's abbot is away promoting himself, and not doing much for Ganden Shartse, whilst Khensur Rinpoche of Shar Ganden is firmly grounded to the wellbeing of Shar Ganden.

Of course in future, when the ban is lifted, I do hope that Shar Ganden and Ganden will rejoin as one, as there is no need for separation anymore. All resources and forces can combine as one, to concentrate on protecting and spreading the lineage of Lama Tsongkhapa far and wide for the degenerate times that we are in and the practise of Dorje Shugden will grow, as he is the uncommon protector for Lama Tsongkhapa's teaching. No need for separations and divisions. I hope I'll live to see that day.

[Losang_Tenpa]

Another 65 novices are on the way to Shar Gaden right now to enroll. They will arrive in a few days.

[Karla]

Like I'd said in a previous post, just because a lot of people are doing something, it doesn't mean it's right. Come on. The whole world is doing a lot of things, en masse. It doesn't mean its good. Your kids are all watching violent, sick cartoons now on the television instead of the good old wholesome days of Sesame Street. Thanks to media, there's a lot more kids now in the world watching sick s&*t than the good stuff of old. It doesn't mean it's good.

Our times are so degenerate anyway that it's hard to tell whether something is truly good because it's good. Or whether it's "good" just because it's wealth, and physically big and a lot of people follow it.

I would stick with Gaden which has been tried and tested so I agree with you there Tenzin Gyatso. I hope they realise before it's too late and go back to the mother monastery.

[michaela]

Like I'd said in a previous post, just because a lot of people are doing something, it doesn't mean it's right. Come on. The whole world is doing a lot of things, en masse. It doesn't mean its good. Your kids are all watching violent, sick cartoons now on the television instead of the good old wholesome days of Sesame Street. Thanks to media, there's a lot more kids now in the world watching sick s&*t than the good stuff of old. It doesn't mean it's good.

Our times are so degenerate anyway that it's hard to tell whether something is truly good because it's good. Or whether it's "good" just because it's wealth, and physically big and a lot of people follow it.

I would stick with Gaden which has been tried and tested so I agree with you there Tenzin Gyatso. I hope they realise before it's too late and go back to the mother monastery.

Dear Karla

Just by saying that you will follow Gaden because it “has been tried and tested” you have just refute your earlier claim that “just because a lot of people are doing something, it doesn’t mean it’s right.”

You need to be clear here, what do you mean by having been “tried and tested?”  in what way?  Is it because you consider them as an older institution, so they are doing the right thing when they expelled DS practitioners from their monastery just because they chose to practice practice their faith?

And you agree with Tenzin Gyatso that the reason Shar Gaden is considering to comeback to Gaden is purely due to shortage of money, and afraid of being alienated from their families?  Firstly, the other respondents above have responded to you that Shar Gaden is doing ok financially.  So Tenzin Gyatso’s claim that is only based on hearsay is not true at all.  Secondly, more and more families are sending their children to Shar Gaden because they believe this is a good institution. 

Honestly, I do not understand what are you agreeing here?  By choosing to agree with Tenzin Gyatso’s claim above, you have chosen to believe in hearsays that is not even true.  Do learn and study up the materials available in this website and support your argument intelligently.

[beggar]

Like I'd said in a previous post, just because a lot of people are doing something, it doesn't mean it's right. Come on. The whole world is doing a lot of things, en masse. It doesn't mean its good. Your kids are all watching violent, sick cartoons now on the television instead of the good old wholesome days of Sesame Street. Thanks to media, there's a lot more kids now in the world watching sick s&*t than the good stuff of old. It doesn't mean it's good.

Well karla, i see your point there. But you have a look at WHO it is within the masses that are following the practice. This isn't just some television show or some brand of snack. This is a spiritual practice! Yes, there are a lot of people out there who are also practicing things that are not correct or even harmful. It doesn't mean that's good either.

What's important is to consider who it is that is engaging, teaching and spreading the practice. Checking things through thoroughly and examining our spiritual teachers and path BEFORE we engage in it is important. That's the whole point of having resources like this website, the thousands of books out there, and our teachers. Think things through with logic, not just out of a spur of a moment.

Consider the lamas who have been engaging, teaching and spreading the practice, read their biographies, meet them if you have a chance, examine the works they have written and you will see that they aren't just anyone. They aren't just some kid out there who is watching a sick cartoon. Examine the results and actions of such practitioners and you will realise that they aren't ordinary, that they truly have realisations and attainments from the Dharma that we are far away from.

Here on the forum, we choose to follow this practice because our teachers have given it to us and we have tremendous respect, devotion and love towards our teachers. We choose to follow it not because it is something followed by the masses, but because of the attainments and qualities  (not quantity!) of Lamas who have promoted it through time. The very point of this website is that NOT many people are practicing because so many have given it up. This is very much a minority practice actually, if you want to look at it in terms of numbers. So much more of the world is following the Dalai Lama so Dorje Shugden practitioners are very much outnumbered! So your argument about "following the masses" doesn't hold much ground there.

[harrynephew]

Here on the forum, we choose to follow this practice because our teachers have given it to us and we have tremendous respect, devotion and love towards our teachers. We choose to follow it not because it is something followed by the masses, but because of the attainments and qualities  (not quantity!) of Lamas who have promoted it through time. The very point of this website is that NOT many people are practicing because so many have given it up. This is very much a minority practice actually, if you want to look at it in terms of numbers. So much more of the world is following the Dalai Lama so Dorje Shugden practitioners are very much outnumbered! So your argument about "following the masses" doesn't hold much ground there.

I think what beggar has just said really hit a chord with me. A Guru-disciple relationship is really personal and if a Guru has given you something especially a teaching, it is something you should treasure in life. It's not really out of blind faith or anything because prior to meeting your Guru, you must have 100% conviction to who that Guru means and what Guru is to you. Another person with or without spiritual authority cannot take those sets of teachings, experiences and learning from you because it has been transmitted to you with love, compassion and very much the kindness of the teachers who have well preserved these teachings and made it accessible to us!

Very wonderful news from Shar Gaden that 67 more novices have just joined and it is amazing what Shar Gaden can do to help preserve and promote the lineage of Lama Tsongkhapa and Dorje Shugden to the next generation who will be potential teachers spreading the Gaden tradition furiously to the world!