Author Topic: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden  (Read 23952 times)

Mana

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« on: August 31, 2012, 12:24:28 AM »


Dear friends,

This was extracted from the FPMT site and it is a forward by Lama Zopa for a compilation of talks by Dalai Lama against Shugden by a Mongolian Monastery.

What do you feel? Do you think people should just let the anti-Shugden issue rest already? Why keep up the schism? Isn't there much more IMPORTANT teachings to translate for the Mongolian public? Why bring up  this undemocratic issue within the spread of Buddhism in Mongolia?

Mana


*************************


Recently Lama Zopa, who was unmistakably recognized by Dorje Shugden (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/?p=20),  wrote a foreword for a book speaking against Dorje Shugden, this is taken from the FPMT website:

http://www.fpmt.org/media/newsletters/archives/1024-fpmt-international-office-news-august-2012.html
Further Advice Regarding Shugden 

Rinpoche recently wrote this foreword in English and Tibetan for a book being published only in Tibetan and Mongolian about Shugden (Dolgyal). The book is a compilation of His Holiness the Dalai Lama’s teachings on Shugden given between 2000 and 2007. The foreword was meant to just be a few pages, but in the end became longer, and is an incredible teaching.

 
Foreword


I am very happy that the monks of Idgaa Choizinling in the Mongolian city of Ulaanbaatar have translated into Mongolian the second book by His Holiness the Dalai Lama advising not to practice Dolgyal. This is good for oneself and others in this life and in all future lives. In order to definitely spread this advice in Mongolia, the former Namgyal Monastery Abbott Kyabje Jhado Rinpoche promised to print this, which is extremely kind.

The Idgaa Choizinling monks thought this would be a very, very special protection for the Mongolian people, as well as for those in other countries, to prevent deep damage and also an offering to His Holiness the Dalai Lama, for the success of His holy wishes. They also felt this would be a protection for individual people as well as for the teachings of Buddha, by keeping the teachings pure.

As I was asked for a foreword by the gekyö of Idgaa Choizinling, in the beginning I mentioned that it would be a few pages long, but it got a bit longer. I hope it is of some benefit to the readers’ minds.

If the Idgaa Choizinling monks didn’t bring this knowledge into Mongolia possibly no one would. So this is very precious and people are extremely lucky to be able to receive this advice from His Holiness the Dalai Lama.

 

______________________________________________________

 

For the world in general and especially for the people of the Snow Land of Tibet to have concordant thinking, without bias, in friendship and like a family in a harmonious relationship that is completely unified as one and to preserve and disseminate the stainless, precious teachings of the Buddha in this world, I, bearing the name of a reincarnation, Thubten Zopa, humbly present, in love and friendship, these honest true facts.

For the benefit of those who do not understand, in order to discover this, please undertake an honest investigation without the stained mind of biased discrimination.

This reliance on Dolgyal, be it by pure Dharma practitioners or by those for business or financial reasons, I wonder if this has not been more harmful than the forceful annexation of Tibet by the Chinese Government and the destruction of the teachings of the Buddha.

We may ask, “Why is this?”

Many of those who rely on Dolgyal have received teachings and initiations in the presence of His Holiness the Dalai Lama and have relied on His Holiness as their most kind Guru (Virtuous Friend). Nevertheless, later they have come to regard His Holiness as an enemy.

As you know very well, if you see your root Guru as an enemy, you have to experience the sufferings of the evil gone realms (lower realms) endlessly.

As it is stated in the Root Tantra of Guhyasamaja: “Even if you accumulate the five most heinous negative karmas (without break of another life), it is still possible to attain the state of a Buddha in this life. But, if you have despised your Guru, it is impossible to attain buddhahood in this life.”

If one belittles or criticizes the Guru, one belittles and criticizes all the Victorious Ones. If one first relies on a Guru and then later makes mistakes in devoting to that person as a Guru it becomes an extremely great loss in ones life, because the Guru is the action of all the Buddhas to subdue oneself. Manifesting as the Guru, the Guru is the form of action of all the Buddhas. Even the teacher who teaches you reading, even that teacher, even if you secretly despise and criticize, then you have criticized or belittled the Guru, and that becomes the same as belittling or criticizing all the tendirections Buddhas. This is from the text The Essential Nectar.

One’s Virtuous Friends are the actions of all the Victorious Ones manifesting as one’s own Guru. Not having respect for them is like not having respect for all the Victorious Ones. There is no heavier ripening aspect result.

After having had the thought “This is my Savior,” one becomes the disciple and then belittling that Guru is the same as having belittled all the Buddhas, and from that one will achieve suffering all the time. For many eons one will not meet with a Virtuous Friend or the precious teachings of the Buddha, and one will be reborn in the inexhaustible hells for many eons and have to experience unfathomable suffering.

Not only that, when one is not a bodhisattva, getting angry at a bodhisattva, even for a second, destroys a thousand eons of roots of virtue, as stated by the great bodhisattva Shantideva:

“Whatever wholesome deeds,
Such as offering to the Buddhas and generosity,
That have been amassed for a thousand eons
Are destroyed by one instant of anger.”

This is in dependence upon the power of the object, which becomes very powerful with a Buddha; even more powerful than this is one’s Guru. Due to this, for many eons one will never meet with a Virtuous Friend and never meet with the teachings of the Buddha as well.

Therefore, relying on Dolgyal is extremely harmful to oneself. I think this is also a great harm to the world in general, as well as to sentient beings and to the teachings of the Buddha.

Dolgyal is one who, in the past, broke samaya (pledges) and made harmful, mistaken prayers to the teachings of our Founder/Teacher: Buddha. This has been stated by one who knows the past and future.

Those who strongly practice Dolgyal eventually end up dying in the most dangerous manner. For example, Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk, learned in scriptures and from the great seat of Sera Me Monastery, who invited the reincarnation of Pabongka Rinpoche to Tibet and made the incarnation take the life-entrusting initiation of Dolgyal and the Heruka Body Mandala from Gonpa Sa Rinpoche. One day when travelling in a vehicle, they came up on a pass and although there were many people in the vehicle, he alone fell out of the window, down the cliff and died.

Again, a business man, Dorje Gyaltsen, who was a very strong practitioner of Dolgyal in secret, when tormented by sickness, he asked his wife to go to the usual place to propitiate Dolgyal. Not having known that he was a daily practitioner of Dolgyal, his wife, although very shocked, had no choice but to comply with his wishes to go and make the tea offering (relying on Dolgyal for the success of actions) on his behalf. Then directly from the mouth of the sick person came the words, “Up until now, Dolgyal has deceived me. I can see the actual ghost form of that vicious one. I have been deceived. I have been mistaken until now. I apologize and confess to my Gurus.”

As he took his last breath, there were great fearful appearances and he died foaming at the mouth with an expression of being strangled. In the end, when his body was taken to the cemetery to be given to the vultures, even the vultures flew away without feeding on his flesh.

The other is the one whose kindness is greater than the Buddhas of the three times, the one whose name is difficult to mention, my great virtuous friend Gen Thubten Yeshe, who was a strong practitioner of Dolgyal. When passing away, before his the last breath, he showed very clearly the expression that Dolgyal was not perfect. This has been my personal experience, from being together at the time of his passing away.

For further information on this please read the letter recently sent from Tibet.

Here you have no one to point a finger at out of biased thoughts of discrimination. For these signs of misery and downfall you can point your finger only at Dolgyal, for these are very clear signs. These are just examples.

The letter from Tibet.

A collection of stories on manifested inauspiciousness in relation to Dolgyal.

In 2007, when visiting relatives in Baa Thang, I accepted an invitation to visit Sangwa Khato in the region of Baa, a town of twenty families. There, I heard directly from the people of the place about the manifested inauspiciousness in relation to Dolgyal.

Ten years ago, for the sake of timely rains and plentiful harvest in the region, they requested Baa Lakha Rinpoche for a divination of the prayers to be undertaken. Rinpoche advised them to build a stupa at a site seen from every direction. The stupa was built on top of a hill, in the upper part of the region. This was struck by a lightning, which destroyed half of it. When the people of the region rebuilt the stupa, again it was struck by a lightning and half destroyed. When they rebuilt it again, before long the stupa on its own became crooked.

At that time Drakara Chophel, who had spent some years living in Drepung Monastery in South India, became suspicious. So he had the inside fillings of the stupa searched and found a thangka painting of Dolgyal. Everybody suspected that this was the cause of it all. Those who identified with this burnt the thangka.

Later, upon further investigation of the Dolgyal thangka, they suspected the old monk Sangwa Kalsang from the area, who in the past was a practitioner of Dolgyal. But then, when His Holiness the Dalai Lama advised a few times about the necessity 4 of stopping the practice, some of them pretended to have stopped the practice. But in reality they had not done so and did the practice in secret. The Dolgyal thangka was placed in the stupa secretly, without the knowledge of the ordained and lay people of the region.

One day this old monk went to the home of a family to do the prayers of dispelling interferences with the ritual cake (torma), but when he went to throw the ritual torma, all of a sudden he lost consciousness and died in a state of inauspiciousness.

For the last six or seven years, since the rebuilding of the stupa, nothing of the sort has happened. The people of the region say in unison that they have had timely rains, good harvests and the whole area has been completely rejuvenated.

In the past, the temple of the town used to have a statue of Dolgyal, which the people of the area had taken outside the walls of the temple and buried within four solid walls. I have destroyed this statue and the walled encasement so that nothing remains of it.

Again, under the jurisdiction of Dho Kham Lithang region in the town of Drarukha, there is a small monastery called Zangcho Dratsang. At this monastery is a monk from Pompora House in Sera Me Monastery, South India, a Dolgyal practitioner by the name of Lobsang Norbu. After attaining a small level geshe degree, he returned to his hometown. Although he had used his title of geshe to become the principal person of the monastery, the ordained and lay people of his hometown did not like Dolgyal practitioners at all. He had also stated that he did not practice Dolgyal. But everyone, beginning with the ex-abbot of the Dratsang, Lama Jamyang, the entire ordained and lay community suspected him of being a practitioner.

To deceive the public and in order to have a huge gathering, one day, he announced the teachings on Maitreya’s Wheel of Dharma. On the day of the actual event, during a break in the sessions, a dog came and broke the hands of some of the statues that had been made from blessed clay. These statues were the holy objects of the temple. There has been such news of inauspiciousness.

Then, before long, lightning struck the monastery, broke the pole holding the victory banner in half and threw it in front of the monastery. After this, one night without any known reasons, the monastery caught on fire. Although the monastery was situated in the middle of the town, nobody noticed the fire. At daybreak, all that remained was the charred ground; everything had been burnt to ashes. There was such inauspiciousness.

These stories of actual events in the past, I offer to the Jewel of our world, His Holiness the Dalai Lama, in support of His Holiness’ strong discouragement of Dolgyal practice and hoping in some small way to help.

Presented with respect and prostrations on the 12th of November, 2011.

Although His Holiness the Dalai Lama did the practice of Dolgyal earlier in his life, after many years of examination he came to the very clear conclusion that this practice is very harmful to the Dharma and sentient beings. His Holiness’ advice not to practice Dolgyal has been greatly criticized and contradicted by some of the highly learned geshes of the main monasteries, who have written many books on this issue and publicized them well.

Recently, due to a highly learned scholar, Jangtse Geshe Gen Drati, criticizing His Holiness over this issue, his monastery staff went before their protector Dharma Raja (Dhamchen Choegyel) and requested an answer sign as to whether it was better to expel the geshe from the monastery or not. When it was answered that it was better to expel him, as the dough ball containing that answer came out, his writings criticizing His Holiness were read before the entire assembly of monks and he was expelled.

This kind of heavy negative karma, which brings the experience of unthinkable, inexpressible suffering for many eons, is mainly due to the mistake of relying on Dolgyal practice.

More kind than all the Buddhas of the three times, Refuge and Protector, Lord of the Victorious Ones, the All Knowing One, the Highly Seeing Sublime One, His Holiness the Dalai Lama, has been prophesied by our Founder, Buddha, the Destroyer Qualified Gone Beyond One. This was prophesied to a close entourage of the bodhisattva whose name was Limitless Supreme Awareness.

Also, from the Guhyasamaja Tantra Treasure, Founder Vajradhara said to the Dharma King Indrabhuti and so forth,

Amongst the limitless entourage of bodhisattvas, listen Limitless Supreme Awareness. You, bodhisattva, are a great founder of transmigrating sentient beings. Until samsara is empty, till then, you will become the holy object of refuge and savior of transmigrators. Especially in the country of Snow Land, you will take birth in a holy body of form to disseminate the teachings of the Three Baskets of Dharma and enjoy benefitting transmigratory beings. Limitless Supreme Awareness, the Snow Land is the place to be subdued by the bodhisattva mahasattva Arya Avalokiteshvara. This region of the Snow Land is the place that will be subdued by you. Bodhisattva Avalokiteshvara Limitless Supreme Awareness, in this place you will brightly illuminate the Dharma teachings of the Three Baskets and the unsurpassable Vajra Vehicle.

It has been thus stated.

If I further clarify this sutra quotation, when His Holiness the Dalai Lama visited Geshe Sopa’s center, Deer Park, to give some teachings, one day the staff of the center had an audience with His Holiness. They expressed to His Holiness that His Holiness has stated many times that he himself does not have bodhicitta and the realization of the right view. They said, “If His Holiness does not have the experience of these realizations, then ordinary beings like us don’t have any hope.” At that point, His Holiness, felt unbearable (compassion, not wanting them to lose faith) and it slipped out from his holy mouth that His Holiness did remember that in a past life His Holiness was a bodhisattva in the entourage of the Buddha in the arya land of India. His Holiness gave a very clear answer.

Therefore Tibetans from the Snow Land ought to know that they are unbelievably fortunate. In short, not just Tibetans, in this world many millions of people for eon after eon are led to peace and happiness, liberation and the state of omniscience. His Holiness does unbelievable great activities unlike any other great holy being preserving the teachings of Buddha.

If the Precious Victorious One, His Holiness the Dalai Lama, is not the actual Buddha and Arya Avalokiteshvara, then you can say that in this world there is no emanation of Buddha benefiting sentient beings. In this way bodhicitta and the entire teachings of the Buddha become false. Therefore, practicing Dolgyal and practicing the teachings of the Buddha become contradictory to oneself—one is practicing that which is false by regarding it as truth.

At the great seat of Gomang Monastery College, one great Lama who strongly practiced Dolgyal took the great responsibility and spread the practice. Due to that he broke His Holiness’s advice and became against His Holiness. When he passed away his heart cracked apart into many pieces, his eyeballs came out and so forth. This is just another example.

It is not only His Holiness the Dalai Lama, who after many years of examining, has advised against the practice of Dolgyal. Many others, who are like one sun rising eliminating the darkness in this world, who have done great extensive works for the teachings of Buddha and transmigratory beings, such as Khachen Yeshe Gyeltsen and Thugkyen Losang Chogye Nyima and many other high valid Gelug lamas and so forth, have also advised to stop the practice of Dolgyal. You can understand this if you look in the collections of their teachings. His Holiness the Dalai Lama has put together the advice that those great holy beings have given, and if you want to read them, please request the Private Office for the texts.

There have also been learned geshes and valid lamas who have practiced Dolgyal. For example Kyabje Pabonka Dechen Nyingpo, who did extensive benefit for the teachings of Buddha and transmigratory beings. People believed it was because he practiced Dolgyal that he was able to bring this extensive benefit through his holy actions. But this is a complete hallucination, without examining the facts, and because of it, many people have just practiced Dolgyal with blind faith.

In the past, Kyabje Pabonka Dechen Nyingpo practiced Most Secret Hayagriva, the circle of Dharma from the pure appearance of the Fifth Dalai Lama, but later stopped that practice. One day he told his attendant, “Tomorrow a fat monk will come to see me. Don’t allow him into my room.”

He said this precisely, but the attendant forgot what he said and when the fat monk came the next day, he allowed the monk to go into the room (this was as an obstacle for those not practicing Dolgyal and especially for those practicing Dolgyal). Later, when the attendant entered the room, it seemed the lama was not happy and looked sort of possessed. The thangkas of Most Secret Hayagriva and others had been taken down and the lama had changed in his actions.

But Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche and Kyabje Dechen Nyingpo are Buddha. Their practice of Dolgyal is the act of showing ordinary aspect for us. Showing ordinary aspect means showing mistakes. Otherwise there is no other meaning of showing ordinary aspect. Without showing this ordinary aspect for us, there is no method to guide us from samsara. Showing the aspect of having mistakes is what leads us to enlightenment. It is so extremely kind of the Guru to show this; it is like the Guru is giving us skies filled with wish-granting jewels.

Besides this example there are many ways the Guru shows the aspect of having mistakes. For example, showing the aspect of being sick so that we have to explain which foods harm and what not to eat. Another example is when there is no road or if there is a precipice and we have to explain to not go that way. There are many ways the Guru shows having mistakes. When the appearance of mistakes in the actions of the Gurus comes, it is extremely important to use that increase devotion, as this is the cause for oneself to achieve full enlightenment, or to support and increase the Guru devotion that one has generated in one’s own mind without degenerating.

It is mentioned in the tantric text Vajra Tent (Dorje Kur):

In the degenerate time, I, who am called Vajrasattva, will abide in the form of the spiritual master. With the aim of benefitting sentient beings, I will abide in ordinary form.

This is mentioned not only in the tantras but also in the sutras.

Buddha was giving a teaching on an extremely high mountain in the southern direction and at that time the bodhisattva Meaningful to Behold thought: now the Buddha is giving teachings to us, but in the future, after Buddha has passed into the sorrowless state, there will be no one who will give teachings. As he thought this, the Destroyer Qualified Gone Beyond, Guru Shakyamuni Buddha, proclaimed, “Hi, Meaningful to Behold, when the future comes I will abide in the body of the Abbott, I will abide in the form of the Master, and in order to ripen sentient beings I will show birth, old age, disease and death.”

Even the Guru is the actual Buddha, if from one’s own side one does not look at him as the Buddha, then, as it is mentioned in the Kadampa Geshe Potowa’s Blue Pepung, “Even if Manjushri and Chenrezig actually descend in front of you, it won’t benefit you at all, if from your own side you do not look at them as Buddha. You cannot receive any blessings and will not receive profit, only loss.”

Like the story of the Gelong Lekpai Karma, who served Buddha for twenty-two years. In all that time he only looked at the Buddha as a liar, and as a result he was born in the lower realms, the inexhaustible hot hell realms, for eons.

Even if from the Guru’s side he is not Buddha, if from one’s own side one devotes to him as Buddha, one receives only profit and no loss. For example, the old mother actually believed the dog bone was Buddha’s tooth, generated faith, and the blessings of the Buddha’s actual tooth entered and she received Buddha’s relics from the dog bone.

In reality, in this way, the disciple can attain the path and achieve enlightenment before the Guru does and is then able to do perfect works for sentient beings.

Also, the Fifth Dalai Lama mentioned, “To the mind that is hallucinated, the opposite mind, one’s mistakes manifest in the Guru’s actions. Realize that this is one’s own mistake and abandon it like poison.”

So by seeing mistakes in the Guru’s actions, according to the Lama Tsongkhapa tradition, it becomes a support to develop Guru devotion. Please think well on these quotations.

Seeing mistakes in the Guru is like having a black mark on one’s own face and seeing it in a mirror. That is a sign that one’s own face has the black spot, not the reflection.

If the Guru takes poison, we don’t need to also eat poison. We need to examine what this means. Like the peacock, who by eating poison is able to live and become healthier and develop his magnificent color, if you are able to take poison and live, then it’s OK to take poison. If you can transform poison into nectar, you can definitely take it.

AH LA LA LA LA HO
AH HO MAHA SUKHA.

From the teachings of Gyalwa Ensapa:

In short, whether we achieve great or small realization depends on whether we have meditated with great or small devotion. Therefore, may I keep as my heart practice the instruction to reflect only upon the qualities of the kind guru, source of all realizations, and not to look at faults. May I fulfill this commitment without any obstacle.

Until one is free from negative karma and obscurations, even if every single Buddha directly descends in front of you, you would have no fortune to see the supreme holy body, adorned with the holy signs and exemplifications, except this present appearance of the Guru (this means this ordinary appearance). To be able to see one’s own Guru in the supreme holy body adorned with the holy signs and exemplifications, it is said that one needs to achieve the path of great merit of the five Mahayana paths, such as the path of contemplation of continual Dharma and so forth.

In the past some outer beings (non-Buddhists) actually met the Buddha, but they saw him as an ordinary person, not having the pinnacle or even the one fathom of light rays from the holy body or the other holy signs and exemplifications and so forth.

Arya Thogme (Asanga) saw Maitreya Buddha in the form of a female dog whose lower body was covered in wounds and maggots.

Also, Ngagpa Chöpa, the great yogi, and Getsul Tsimbulwa saw the mind-sealed deity Dorje Pagmo as an ordinary lady who had leprosy.

Even the learned and highly attained yogi Naropa, as well as all the human beings in the town, saw the highly attained Tilopa, who was the actual Buddha Vajradhara, as a beggar, burning and eating fish alive.

Do not arise heresy even for one split second in the glorified Guru’s actions.
See whatever actions he does as good.
With this devotion, may the blessings of the Guru enter my heart.

His Holiness does not accept this prayer because the holy minds of Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche, Trijang Rinpoche and His Holiness are one. It is a teaching that their holy mind is one.

As it is mentioned in the text Calling the Guru from Afar, by Kyabje Dechen Nyingpo,

The wisdom of great bliss of all Buddhas, one taste with the dharmakaya,
Is itself the ultimate nature of all kind lamas.
I beseech you, Lama, dharmakaya,
Please look after me always without separation, in this life, future lives, and the bardo.

This quotation is for people like me, who are extremely ordinary and filled with superstition, full of obscurations and negative karma.

His Holiness the Dalai Lama is the principal one who holds all the teachings of Buddha and spreads this in the world, therefore it is so important to follow His Holiness’s request.

In this world there are many religions, but our founder, the great kind mighty one, Shakyamuni Buddha, said, “You should examine my teachings well, bhikshus (learned ones), like burning, cutting and rubbing gold. Then take my teachings not just out of faith.”

Therefore, whatever we practice in Buddhism, we must examine it well, just as Buddha has advised, and Buddha gave us the freedom to do this. This is what I am expressing; please understand this.

Therefore, to follow the advice of His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the omniscient one, this is particularly for oneself and generally for the Tibetans to be harmonious in life, under one constitution and to be in unity.

This is for problems not to arise life to life, for the sun of happiness to rise in the world, for there to be perfect peace and happiness in this world, and for oneself and others to achieve liberation from samsara and the state of omniscience. It is for the stainless teachings of Buddha to spread in this world, and especially for the stainless Tibetan Mahayana Buddhism to increase and not decrease. It is for this reason that His Holiness the Dalai Lama has advised that the practice of Dolgyal stop.

Even though some learned high lamas and geshes saw His Holiness the Dalai Lama as the enemy and criticized His Holiness’s view, still His Holiness’s holy speech and view did not change.

It is mentioned that the subduer of the Snow Land of Tibet is Chenrezig and very clearly explains that Chenrezig not only does the holy action of working for others and not oneself but also has great bodhicitta and powerful compassion. He only does the holy actions of guiding and saving the six types of sentient beings and showing compassion, like all the ten direction buddhas. This is the arya supreme one, Chenrezig.

In the past, when I have met with His Holiness the Dalai Lama, I have expressed, with my big mouth, that myself being a representative, on behalf of the whole world in general and in particular the Tibetan people, that even though the lamas and geshes have criticized His Holiness, such as by writing books against him, still His Holiness has never wavered in advising us to stop the practice of Dolgyal, so for that, from the heart, how unfathomably greatly kind His Holiness is.

By reading this letter if you get upset, then just as the great compassionate Buddha practiced the paramita of patience to the harm-givers, please practice patience and live your life with a happy mind. This is important. Thank you very much.

 

Written by Lama Zopa Rinpoche in Tibetan. Translated by Rinpoche and Ven. Tsen-la. Scribed by Holly Ansett, lightly edited by Nicholas Ribush. Buddha Amitabha Pure Land, July 3–11, 2012. Checked by Lama Zopa Rinpoche.

 

The original article is here: http://www.fpmt.org/images/stories/organization/announcements/shugden/Mongolian_shugden_book_foreword_Engl.pdf

 


Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2012, 02:11:03 AM »
First impression? It does not sound like what Lama Zopa would have wrote. The intonation, the general feeling and the perspective is all not Lama Zopa's. It does not sound like Lama Zopa at all. It sounded more like someone else wrote it and then it was attributed to Lama Zopa. Also, this forward differs greatly on his stance on Dorje Shugden from his previous teachings on him and he has never referred to Dorje Shugden as Dolgyal before: http://www.lamayeshe.com/index.php?sect=article&id=335 the word Dolgyal was not found anywhere. It could also be true that he was referring to another spirit and not Dorje Shugden when writing things, then taken out of context (which happens), but in general, It does not feel like him at all. I dont really believe that Lama Zopa wrote this because it sounds too aggressive. Lama Zopa usually sounds quite calm and passive in his transcripts and writings. So, I dont think this foreword was written by him, probably someone did and attributed to his name and he has to accept it to not offend the CTA, perhaps.

Why Mongolia? I feel that HHDL plans to take leadership of the Gelugs in Mongolia, and the symbol to his control is that they give up Dorje Shugden. think about it -- why only talk about giving up Dorje Shugden ONLY AFTER Jetsun Khalka has passed away? Before this there was rarely any talk of this nature there. Perhaps CTA is trying to exert their influence in Mongolia for whatever reason and decided to go with the Dorje Shugden route as definite proof of the Mongolians' loyalty towards the CTA. Jetsun Khalkha has avery close relationship with the Gelugs, but ironically they banned his first incarnation, Tarantha...

That aside, this does prove that CTA is very desperately trying to get people to be on their side, for then to publish such a book...how sad.

Heartspoon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 202
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2012, 04:21:22 AM »
Oh, how surprising !

Today, my neighbors all met together. They were very excited.
For a very good reason. You see something unheard of happened...
For the very first time, a new form of practice will be available.

It's such an earth-shaking scoop that you had better be seated
before reading on, or I fear someone could accidentally lose the use
of his legs...

Our "rich, powerful and much admired by the community" neighbor
had the extraordinary skill to find for us a new way of practicing Dharma:
 
Using critical thinking is not anymore requested

From now on, if we have any doubt about anything a single answer will
be sufficient for anything thrown our way:

"it's like that" because our 'rich, powerful and much admired by the community'
neighbor said "it's like that".

How surprising ! And Je Tsonkhapa who had to do all those unbelievable practices.
Today, it's incredibly easier, me thinks...

The kids are so happy - Immunity granted

When I came back home, kids were stoning my house.
Nothing special, you know, it happens each time our
"rich, powerful and much admired by the community"
neighbor expounds to them his new system of practice.

Here they all call me the "old-fashioned" one or the one
who refuses to think like all of us.

I tried to speak with the kids, but they laughed out loud.
Our "rich, powerful and much admired by the community"
neighbor granted all of them immunity since they adopted
his new kind of practice.

You see life tremendously changed for them, they are so
happy: from now on, they will not have to face any
consequence for their acts.

Our "rich, powerful and much admired by the community"
neighbor has promised that he will take upon himself all
the karmic consequences of their acts.

If only I could obtain such a deal for myself.
Unbelievable...

Elixir of immortality

Tonight I went again to the woods and I met an old original who spent years alone in solitude.
He wishes to find the Elixir of immortality and searches tirelessly.
He had very big news for me: he doesn't need to search anymore, our "rich, powerful and much
admired by the community" neighbor has found it.

It works like that:

Until now, for the old-fashioned ones,

Bad speech, calumnies directed towards someone are like blessings, long life ceremonies for this person.
Being subjected to them clears obstacles, eliminates bad karma. If one keeps patience while being subjected
to those forms of abuse, it greatly increases the merits and thus contributes to increase one's life span.

Very simple: one doesn't need to ask for them, one doesn't need to pay for them, one doesn't even need
to know that it is happening. In any case he will benefit from it.

So one should really rejoice if he has to exert patience when subjected to harm.

But there is a big problem : of course, the poor being who is doing such deeds is putting himself in exactly the reverse position. Frightening !

From now on,  the new practice of our "rich, powerful and much admired by the community" neighbor:

Thanks to his newly found practice, as his disciples don't have to face the karmic consequences of their
acts, thanks to the immunity graciously granted by our neighbor, logically everyone will benefit from
the forms of abuse mentionned above, the person who is doing the bad deeds as well as the one who is
subjected to harm. Death is old news: now it will be almost impossible to die.

Big problem resolved: this way, he has really found the famed elixir of immortality

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2012, 04:56:21 AM »
Oh god. I found a horrible lie in this foreword of his. This is the time where we need scholars such as Trinley Kalsang to check and validate.

Quote
There have also been learned geshes and valid lamas who have practiced Dolgyal. For example Kyabje Pabonka Dechen Nyingpo, who did extensive benefit for the teachings of Buddha and transmigratory beings. People believed it was because he practiced Dolgyal that he was able to bring this extensive benefit through his holy actions. But this is a complete hallucination, without examining the facts, and because of it, many people have just practiced Dolgyal with blind faith.

In the past, Kyabje Pabonka Dechen Nyingpo practiced Most Secret Hayagriva, the circle of Dharma from the pure appearance of the Fifth Dalai Lama, but later stopped that practice. One day he told his attendant, “Tomorrow a fat monk will come to see me. Don’t allow him into my room.”

He said this precisely, but the attendant forgot what he said and when the fat monk came the next day, he allowed the monk to go into the room (this was as an obstacle for those not practicing Dolgyal and especially for those practicing Dolgyal). Later, when the attendant entered the room, it seemed the lama was not happy and looked sort of possessed. The thangkas of Most Secret Hayagriva and others had been taken down and the lama had changed in his actions.
How can Pabongkha Rinpoche be possessed?! what kind of propaganda is this? Pabongkha himself wrote that he voluntarily gave up the Nyingma teachings because he realize it would set a bad example to his students of not focusing on one tradition. HE NEVER BLAMED IT ON DORJE SHUGDEN. Why are so many people twisting his words? This sounds like balooney. Lama Zopa would NEVER show an form of disrespect to Pabongkha Rinpoche or Trijang Rinpoche and this is just too much and it is very clear that Lama Zopa is not the author of this foreword.

But Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche and Kyabje Dechen Nyingpo are Buddha. Their practice of Dolgyal is the act of showing ordinary aspect for us. Showing ordinary aspect means showing mistakes. Otherwise there is no other meaning of showing ordinary aspect. Without showing this ordinary aspect for us, there is no method to guide us from samsara. Showing the aspect of having mistakes is what leads us to enlightenment. It is so extremely kind of the Guru to show this; it is like the Guru is giving us skies filled with wish-granting jewels.
Buddha? you just said Pabongkha Rinpoche was possessed? Can a Buddha be possessed by a spirit? Such crude words being used to refer to the lineage lamas. Again, there is no way this is Lama Zopa's writing. If Gurus show us the ordinary aspect all the time, then what is the difference if we take our friend as our Guru?  Showing the aspect of having mistakes is what leads us to enlightenment...? how exactly does a Guru make mistakes and lead us to enlightenment? Lelung Rinpoche did by having sex with women claiming that they were dakinis, that was clearly a mistake and nobody got enlightened from that. 

Besides this example there are many ways the Guru shows the aspect of having mistakes. For example, showing the aspect of being sick so that we have to explain which foods harm and what not to eat. Another example is when there is no road or if there is a precipice and we have to explain to not go that way. There are many ways the Guru shows having mistakes. When the appearance of mistakes in the actions of the Gurus comes, it is extremely important to use that increase devotion, as this is the cause for oneself to achieve full enlightenment, or to support and increase the Guru devotion that one has generated in one’s own mind without degenerating.
So..your stroke was a mistake? I dont think it is the showing of mistakes, in your explainations, i would like to respectfully disagree. In these cases, it is very clear that the Guru is giving the students a chance to impart information to him so that the students may receive the merits of 'educating' the Guru. It can also be the obscurations from the students' side that cause the Guru to appear to not know.

In any case, Lama Zopa would never say things like that. It is so inconsistent from his previous statement about Pabongkha Rinpoche, Trijang Rinpoche and Dorje Shugden. No way this was written by him.

Heartspoon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 202
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2012, 08:35:49 AM »
Nowadays, some of HH the Dalai Lama's followers have their own special pride. They claim that HH the Dalai Lama is so superior that they themselves should be considered superior.

HH the Dalai Lama, it is true, is very great, but it does not necessarily follow that one who claims to be among His followers is also great. The greatness of a master depends upon his realization. Blind allegiance to a master cannot make a practitioner superior.

It is common for them to look down on the practitioners of Dorje Shugden, thinking of them
as ignorant practitioners whose practice is not supported by right understanding of the Dharma's true meaning.

Some of them claim that the Dorje Shugden practitioners don't belong anymore to their Gelugpa tradition. Others, go as far as claiming that the Dorje Shugden practitioners are not to be considered as Dharma followers.

These are attitudes commonly found among Tibetan Buddhist monks and lay people.
They may be common attitudes, but they are not Buddhist attitudes.

One who despises another Buddhist school despises the Buddha. He impairs the transmission of the Dharma. The presence of the Dharma is jeopardized by such an attitude, and one becomes cut off from its transmission. This is so because one's refuge vows are based upon reliance on the Enlightened One, His Teachings, and the Holy Community. If one rejects Dharma one breaks one's refuge vow and thereby becomes cut off from the Dharma. By rejecting this Dharma that is the only door to happiness for beings and oneself, one accumulates inexhaustible sin.

Therefore, the Buddha taught that one should also not despise the Dharma of non-Buddhists for it is their source of happiness and benefit. One should not despise or harbour contempt for the doctrines of the Hindus, Christians, or other non-Buddhist religions because this attitude of attachment to one's own side while rejecting the possibility of differences is harmful to one's own spiritual career.

Those people who harbour voiced or unvoiced contempt for the teachings and the lineage of other schools incur great sin and terrible consequences. Worst of all, this attitude is as unnecessary as it is harmful.

One whose Dharma career is tainted by narrow-mindedness and attachment to one's own interests while rejecting those of others will never overcome the many obstacles to the attainment of wisdom or insight.

Sectarianism turns the pure Dharma into poison. Through it, one accumulates great sin. In this life one will be frustrated in one's own Dharma efforts. Upon death, one will fall into hell as swiftly as an arrow shot from a bow. These are the consequences of spending a lifetime in rejecting others' spiritual efforts on such narrow-minded grounds.

Therefore be mindful not to indulge in this attitude that brings so much unsought harm upon yourself. Do not create obstacles to your own Dharma. Strive instead for pure faith and maintain that faith in all manifestations of the Three Jewels, no matter whether they are represented in one school of Tibetan Buddhism or in another. Painstakingly nurture your refuge vows and pure faith and thereby grow truly in the Dharma.

spikyeddie

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 14
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2012, 04:35:20 PM »

Those who strongly practice Dolgyal eventually end up dying in the most dangerous manner. For example, Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk, learned in scriptures and from the great seat of Sera Me Monastery, who invited the reincarnation of Pabongka Rinpoche to Tibet and made the incarnation take the life-entrusting initiation of Dolgyal and the Heruka Body Mandala from Gonpa Sa Rinpoche. One day when travelling in a vehicle, they came up on a pass and although there were many people in the vehicle, he alone fell out of the window, down the cliff and died.

Again, a business man, Dorje Gyaltsen, who was a very strong practitioner of Dolgyal in secret, when tormented by sickness, he asked his wife to go to the usual place to propitiate Dolgyal. Not having known that he was a daily practitioner of Dolgyal, his wife, although very shocked, had no choice but to comply with his wishes to go and make the tea offering (relying on Dolgyal for the success of actions) on his behalf. Then directly from the mouth of the sick person came the words, “Up until now, Dolgyal has deceived me. I can see the actual ghost form of that vicious one. I have been deceived. I have been mistaken until now. I apologize and confess to my Gurus.”

As he took his last breath, there were great fearful appearances and he died foaming at the mouth with an expression of being strangled. In the end, when his body was taken to the cemetery to be given to the vultures, even the vultures flew away without feeding on his flesh.

The other is the one whose kindness is greater than the Buddhas of the three times, the one whose name is difficult to mention, my great virtuous friend Gen Thubten Yeshe, who was a strong practitioner of Dolgyal. When passing away, before his the last breath, he showed very clearly the expression that Dolgyal was not perfect. This has been my personal experience, from being together at the time of his passing away.


If Lama Yeshe has passed away in a dangerous manner, with his mind disturbed, then shouldn't he be reborn in lower realms? But it's unmistaken that his reincarnation, Lama Osel was found. This does not make sense at all.

Losang_Tenpa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 691
    • Email
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2012, 04:34:37 AM »
Very sad to see Lama Zopa using these types of fear tactics.

It is especially disturbing to see him say negative things about Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk, who was perhaps the greatest living scholar of logic and reasoning. Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk completed a commentary to all four chapters of the text by Dharmakirti called  the Commentary on Valid Perception, a formidable accomplishment since each chapter is practically a separate philosophical classic in its own right. His commentary is over 1000 pages long. This level of scholarship is unparalleled in recent times.

Don't you think that the greatest scholar of logic and reasoning would know the true qualities of Doje Shugden? Of course!!

Dorje Pakmo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 129
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2012, 07:10:22 AM »
Hmmm…. This is a very cleverly thought out and written piece of work. It may or may not be Lama Zopa’s writing, but it is definitely written to discourage Dorje Shugden’s practice and to highlight the inauspiciousness the will befallen one if one chooses to ignore the advice of HHDL to stop practicing Dorje Shugden.

However, if its Lama Zopa’s writing, then Rinpoche forgot to mention the fact that he himself was recognized as a Tulku through this supreme Protector who he is now writing against. This was the Protector who actually pronounced and installed him as a true incarnation through the Oracle of Dungkar Monastery. If it is true…. Then what happened? Then this also creates doubt as of whether Rinpoche himself is a true incarnation or NOT? So weird…..
There are so many contradictions and doubts that arise from Rinpoche’s writing.

Quote
There have also been learned geshes and valid lamas who have practiced Dolgyal. For example Kyabje Pabonka Dechen Nyingpo, who did extensive benefit for the teachings of Buddha and transmigratory beings. People believed it was because he practiced Dolgyal that he was able to bring this extensive benefit through his holy actions. But this is a complete hallucination, without examining the facts, and because of it, many people have just practiced Dolgyal with blind faith.

In the past, Kyabje Pabonka Dechen Nyingpo practiced Most Secret Hayagriva, the circle of Dharma from the pure appearance of the Fifth Dalai Lama, but later stopped that practice. One day he told his attendant, “Tomorrow a fat monk will come to see me. Don’t allow him into my room.”

He said this precisely, but the attendant forgot what he said and when the fat monk came the next day, he allowed the monk to go into the room (this was as an obstacle for those not practicing Dolgyal and especially for those practicing Dolgyal). Later, when the attendant entered the room, it seemed the lama was not happy and looked sort of possessed. The thangkas of Most Secret Hayagriva and others had been taken down and the lama had changed in his actions.

But Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche and Kyabje Dechen Nyingpo are Buddha. Their practice of Dolgyal is the act of showing ordinary aspect for us. Showing ordinary aspect means showing mistakes. Otherwise there is no other meaning of showing ordinary aspect. Without showing this ordinary aspect for us, there is no method to guide us from samsara. Showing the aspect of having mistakes is what leads us to enlightenment. It is so extremely kind of the Guru to show this; it is like the Guru is giving us skies filled with wish-granting jewels.

Besides this example there are many ways the Guru shows the aspect of having mistakes. For example, showing the aspect of being sick so that we have to explain which foods harm and what not to eat. Another example is when there is no road or if there is a precipice and we have to explain to not go that way. There are many ways the Guru shows having mistakes. When the appearance of mistakes in the actions of the Gurus comes, it is extremely important to use that increase devotion, as this is the cause for oneself to achieve full enlightenment, or to support and increase the Guru devotion that one has generated in one’s own mind without degenerating.

What exactly did the above words mean? Is it hinting that because Kyabje Pabongka stopped practicing the Most Secret Hayagriva hence got possessed by an evil spirit? And then continued to teach the Dharma to his students and gave initiations and practice of this evil spirit to his students knowingly that the practice is going to do harm and cause inauspiciousness?

And then continued to say that Trijang Rinpoche and Pabongka Rinpoche is Buddha and they are manifesting faults out of kindness to guide us out of Samsara? Oh… How can that be? The Buddha teaching his disciples to propitiate to an evil spirit because they are kind and wanted to show their ordinary aspect, that they do make mistakes too?

Come on! It just doesn’t make any sense….

Quote
When the appearance of mistakes in the actions of the Gurus comes, it is extremely important to use that increase devotion, as this is the cause for oneself to achieve full enlightenment, or to support and increase the Guru devotion that one has generated in one’s own mind without degenerating.

The students who have received any form of teachings from his / her kind Guru will hold them so dearly that they will never give it up no matter what. That is true Guru Devotion and trust that the Guru will only have the best interest for his students and nothing else! What else need to be said if the teaching was taught down by the Holy Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche? 

It is cleverly written to twist the whole story around but without much facts and truth to back it up other than some horror stories of grotesquely Dorje Shugden’s practitioners will end up if they continue on his Holy practice, because HHDL said so.

At the end of the writing, it is ended with,

Quote
By reading this letter if you get upset, then just as the great compassionate Buddha practiced the paramita of patience to the harm-givers, please practice patience and live your life with a happy mind. This is important. Thank you very much.
I personally think, if this letter was in fact written by Lama Zopa Rinpoche, then he is again highlighting how absurd the anti Shugden campaign can be! And that all Shugden practitioners should read this letter over and over again to generate greater faith and not let simple and unfounded words sway or misguide us. Do forgive those who speak against or harm us, the TRUTH will prevail.
DORJE PAKMO

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2012, 08:43:09 AM »
Very sad to see Lama Zopa using these types of fear tactics.

It is especially disturbing to see him say negative things about Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk, who was perhaps the greatest living scholar of logic and reasoning. Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk completed a commentary to all four chapters of the text by Dharmakirti called  the Commentary on Valid Perception, a formidable accomplishment since each chapter is practically a separate philosophical classic in its own right. His commentary is over 1000 pages long. This level of scholarship is unparalleled in recent times.
I find it equally disturbing on how did a car accident got blamed to Dorje Shugden. This is ridiculous. So does this mean that we can blame AIDS and cancer and natural disasters on Dorje Shugden also? Why not go to as far as blaming Lama Yeshe's cancer on Dorje Shugden and Lama Zopa's stroke on him as well? Why not blame Dalai Lama's need for glasses as a result of Dorje Shugden? Ridiculous indeed. What is more surprising is how supposedly modern people can believe in such things. This is how Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk died:
Quote
Ten days before Dungkar Rinpoche died, the famous religious teacher Geshe Yeshe
Wangchuk was killed in a car accident in Kongpo. The 69-year old Geshe - the Tibetan
title equivalent to a Doctor of Divinity - was vice chairman of the Tibetan branch of the
Chinese Buddhist Association. Originally from a Tibetan area of north Yunnan, he joined Sera monastery at the age of 16, one year before the Chinese invasion, and later spent a
year in prison. In 1986 he became the first person to be awarded the degree of Geshe
Lharampa since 1959, and was regarded as one of the key remaining religious leaders in
Tibet. He visited India in 1982 and was reportedly persuaded to return to continue his
teachings in Tibet by the Dalai Lama.
What window? How can a person fall out of a car window? I do not see the logic. Can you?
Don't you think that the greatest scholar of logic and reasoning would know the true qualities of Doje Shugden? Of course!!

The author of this article has much hatred for the Gelugs. It cannot be Lama Zopa because he has high regard for Gelugpa unless he was sent into a 'retreat' which is actually a brainwashing camp to make him hate Dorje Shugden as his enemy and after he came out from it he resented Gelug and wrote this foreword. As I have pointed out in my previous post, the way he talked about things is radically different.

Zach

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 566
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2012, 08:54:01 AM »
This is pretty ridiculous if this is written by Lama Zopa. why use the same holy teacher Je Pabongkha to make the point that the practice was both wrong and later on praise Je Pabongkhas exposition on a particular work in order to support the Dalai lama's equally ridiculous and non historically credible stories.

As said previously Lama Zopa's earlier statements and advise as found in the Lama Yeshe Wisdom archive do not actually match what is being said here so it is fairly safe to assume that if this is not a deliberate mistranslation or falsehood then Lama Zopa will have been receiving  some very sever coercion  from the private office of the Dalai lama as a result of people having directed others to Lama Zopa's rather neutral and reasonable advise on Dorje Shugden which was maybe why it was buried fairly deeply in the Lama Yeshe Wisdom archive to begin with.

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2012, 09:11:49 AM »
This is pretty ridiculous if this is written by Lama Zopa. why use the same holy teacher Je Pabongkha to make the point that the practice was both wrong and later on praise Je Pabongkhas exposition on a particular work in order to support the Dalai lama's equally ridiculous and non historically credible stories.

As said previously Lama Zopa's earlier statements and advise as found in the Lama Yeshe Wisdom archive do not actually match what is being said here so it is fairly safe to assume that if this is not a deliberate mistranslation or falsehood then Lama Zopa will have been receiving  some very sever coercion  from the private office of the Dalai lama as a result of people having directed others to Lama Zopa's rather neutral and reasonable advise on Dorje Shugden which was maybe why it was buried fairly deeply in the Lama Yeshe Wisdom archive to begin with.

Without a doubt, this was written by someone else and attributed to Lama Zopa against his will to prove his support towards CTA. CTA hates Pabongkha Rinpoche from the start, since he was known as Chankya Rolpa Dorje. All of their materials express explicit hate for Pabongkha Rinpoche and people who side with the CTA hate Pabongkha Rinpoche for the same reason. No other Gelug Lama would dare to write such a thing against Pabongkha Rinpoche at all. Lama Zopa has always been extremely respectful to the lineage lamas and there is no way he could write something like that. The foreword does contain his talking style, as it matches some of his other teachings, but the content itself was extremely off compared to his older teachings. To me, no matter how many times I read it, I dont feel like it was written by Lama Zopa, but by someone who tries to write in Lama Zopa's style while championing the ban and then attributing it to him.

Also, Lama Zopa has suffered a stroke and how could he have written the foreword with his own hands? CTA must be extremely desperate to garner support to use Lama Zopa's name and to have to do a rain check on mongolia to see who is on their side and who is on the side of the Lineage Lamas. Extremely sneaky of them to wait until Jetsun Khalka has passed away before doing this.

Big Uncle

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1995
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2012, 09:29:14 AM »
You know what? It doesn't matter that it was not written by Lama Zopa, it would have been written by an attendant but the fact that it does bear Lama Zopa's name and it was not contested says a lot. However, I too do not believe that Lama Zopa would say such things about Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche and Dorje Shugden.

If you read his prior writings on Dorje Shugden, Lama Zopa writes vaguely and tells people not to denigrate the lineage Lamas like Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche and Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche and he says not to put down Dorje Shugden but encourages people not to practice Dorje Shugden because of the Dalai Lama's qualities and not what he said about Dorje Shugden. That sounds more like Lama Zopa than this foreword.

It is sad that more of such books are being proliferated in the Mongolian speaking world where Dorje Shugden is relatively strong and the ban has not really penetrated.

Zach

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 566
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2012, 09:42:20 AM »
This is pretty ridiculous if this is written by Lama Zopa. why use the same holy teacher Je Pabongkha to make the point that the practice was both wrong and later on praise Je Pabongkhas exposition on a particular work in order to support the Dalai lama's equally ridiculous and non historically credible stories.

As said previously Lama Zopa's earlier statements and advise as found in the Lama Yeshe Wisdom archive do not actually match what is being said here so it is fairly safe to assume that if this is not a deliberate mistranslation or falsehood then Lama Zopa will have been receiving  some very sever coercion  from the private office of the Dalai lama as a result of people having directed others to Lama Zopa's rather neutral and reasonable advise on Dorje Shugden which was maybe why it was buried fairly deeply in the Lama Yeshe Wisdom archive to begin with.

Without a doubt, this was written by someone else and attributed to Lama Zopa against his will to prove his support towards CTA. CTA hates Pabongkha Rinpoche from the start, since he was known as Chankya Rolpa Dorje. All of their materials express explicit hate for Pabongkha Rinpoche and people who side with the CTA hate Pabongkha Rinpoche for the same reason. No other Gelug Lama would dare to write such a thing against Pabongkha Rinpoche at all. Lama Zopa has always been extremely respectful to the lineage lamas and there is no way he could write something like that. The foreword does contain his talking style, as it matches some of his other teachings, but the content itself was extremely off compared to his older teachings. To me, no matter how many times I read it, I dont feel like it was written by Lama Zopa, but by someone who tries to write in Lama Zopa's style while championing the ban and then attributing it to him.

Also, Lama Zopa has suffered a stroke and how could he have written the foreword with his own hands? CTA must be extremely desperate to garner support to use Lama Zopa's name and to have to do a rain check on mongolia to see who is on their side and who is on the side of the Lineage Lamas. Extremely sneaky of them to wait until Jetsun Khalka has passed away before doing this.

Very much so.

Ensapa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4124
    • Email
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2012, 01:15:50 PM »
You know what? It doesn't matter that it was not written by Lama Zopa, it would have been written by an attendant but the fact that it does bear Lama Zopa's name and it was not contested says a lot. However, I too do not believe that Lama Zopa would say such things about Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche and Dorje Shugden.
Perhaps at this moment it cannot be contested, probably because the CTA is threatening Lama Zopa or something. They have done it before in the past to other Lamas, such as Trijang Rinpoche and they will do it again to other Lamas. Lama Zopa is too big already and he has no choice but to comply or risk the spiritual well being of his students in FPMT centers. this is what it looks like anyway.

If you read his prior writings on Dorje Shugden, Lama Zopa writes vaguely and tells people not to denigrate the lineage Lamas like Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche and Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche and he says not to put down Dorje Shugden but encourages people not to practice Dorje Shugden because of the Dalai Lama's qualities and not what he said about Dorje Shugden. That sounds more like Lama Zopa than this foreword.
This foreword appears to be very inconsistent with the rest of his teachings and what he stood for. It is horrible that CTA would resort to this just to garner more support. I wonder what kind of negative karma will they gain from this and how it would eventually dissolve them into just a bunch of settlements in India with no government at all. Self destructive behavior at its finest.

It is sad that more of such books are being proliferated in the Mongolian speaking world where Dorje Shugden is relatively strong and the ban has not really penetrated.
Has anyone noticed that CTA and HHDL did not dare to touch mongolia while Jetsun Khalka was still alive? Jetsun Khalka is a strong Dorje Shugden practitioner and he would be enraged at this move of wanting to ban Dorje Shugden. The only reason why CTA wants to do this is to test and see how many mongolians would pledge their loyalty to HHDL and to CTA. BTW, in one of his previous incarnations, Jetsun Khalka merged Gelug and Nyingma practices together. No punishment from Dorje Shugden. I wonder why. hmmm.

I wonder tho how many people will realize that it was not really written by Lama Zopa and start demanding answers? or they will just accept it blindly as usual? hmm.

kris

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 919
Re: Lama Zopa writes a foreword AGAINST Shugden
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2012, 01:37:09 PM »
I am confused... The article started by saying that if we despise or criticize our Guru, then the bad karma is very heavy and very bad. So, if my Guru who is very kind and compassionate and He teaches me Dorje Shugden, then what should I do? Despise Him and get the bad karma? I know HH Dalai Lama is very famous, but He has never come to my country before and has never taught me any Dharma, but my Guru has taught me Dharma etc. How can I despise my Guru just because of what HH Dalai Lama said??