How China and India will be more powerful that the U.S. by 2030

[DharmaDefender]

Thoughts? I know the Daily Mail isnt exactly the most reliable source but the headline and contents did catch my eye, minus the panic-inducing tone. How do you think this will impact the Tibetan movement and obviously the Dorje Shugden ban, if any therell be any such impact at all?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2245987/How-China-India-powerful-US-2030.html

How China and India will be more powerful that the U.S. by 2030: Study claims Asian cultures will supersede America and Europe in 20 years as global middle class grows

• Global Trends 2030 predicts that two-thirds of the world's population will live in cities by 2030
• Also said that China and India will overpower long-reigning U.S. and E.U

.

• But also predicts competition for resources, including food, space, and water, will be fierce
• Global warming and climate change also major factors of future decades

Middle class people will dominate the world in 20 years, a major US government report said yesterday.

It said the number of people who can count themselves as middle income will treble to three billion and the number of people living in poverty will halve.

But the report warned that the increased consumption of millions of newly enriched middle class people may strain resources, including food and water, unless innovation and peace allow rising demand to be met.

The report, published by the National Intelligence Council, suggested that the economies of China, India and Brazil will generate the new middle class, who will produce better education standards, better health, and the advance of women into greater wealth and power.

It added: ‘Individual empowerment will accelerate substantially owing to poverty reduction and a huge growth of the global middle class.

‘For the first time, a majority of the world’s population will not be impoverished, and the middle classes will be the most important social and economic sector in the vast majority of countries around the world. Demand for consumer goods, including cars, (will) rise sharply with the growth of the middle class.’

The new middle class will be mostly urban, with nearly two-thirds of the world's population will live in cities by 2030, with the majority of people connected by technology, protected by advanced health care and linked by countries that work together, perhaps with the United States and China cooperating to lead the way.

That's the best case scenario in a report, Global Trends 2030, released Monday by the U.S. government's National Intelligence Council.

In the worst case scenarios, rising population leads to conflict over water and food, especially in the Mideast and Africa, and the instability contributes to global economic collapse.

The study is the intelligence community's analysis of where current trends will take the world in the next 15 to 20 years, intended to help policymakers plan for the best and worst possible futures to come.

The report is broken down into what the National Intelligence Council calls megatrends that are likely to occur and game-changers — the what-if's that are less certain but would be so significant that they can't be ignored.

Among the major trends: the rise of a global middle class that is better educated, connected via technology and healthier due to advances in medicine. Power will no longer reside with one or two key nations, but be spread across networks and coalitions of countries working together.

In countries where there are declining birth rates and an aging population like the U.S., economic growth may slow. Sixty percent of the world's population will live in cities.

Yet even with these advances, food, water and energy will be more scarce.

'Nearly half of the world's population will live in areas experiencing severe water stress,' the report said. Africa and the Middle East will be most at risk of food and water shortages, but China and India also vulnerable.

Among the anticipated crises is the worry of global economic collapse, fighting among nations that don't adapt rapidly enough to change and the possible spillover of instability in the Mideast and South Asia to the rest of the world.

Technology is seen as a potential savior to head off some of this conflict, boosting economic productivity to keep pockets filled despite rising population, rapid growth of cities and climate change.
The report outlines several 'Potential Worlds' for 2030.

Under the heading 'Stalled Engines', otherwise known as the 'most plausible worst-case scenario, the risks of interstate conflict increase,' the report said.

'The U.S. draws inward and globalization stalls.'

In the most plausible best-case outcome, called 'Fusion,' the report said, 'China and the U.S. collaborate on a range of issues, leading to broader global cooperation.'

And under another heading, the report describes a world where 'inequalities explode as some countries become big winners and others fail. ... Without completely disengaging, the U.S. is no longer the 'global policeman.''

The report warns of the mostly catastrophic effect of possible 'Black Swans,' extraordinary events that can change the course of history.

These include a severe pandemic that could kill millions in a matter of months and more rapid climate change that could make it hard to feed the world's population.

Two positive events are also listed, including 'a democratic China or a reformed Iran,' which could bring more global stability.

One bright spot for the U.S. is energy independence.

'With shale gas, the U.S. will have sufficient natural gas to meet domestic needs and generate potential global exports for decades to come,' the report said.

[DS Star]

Imaging a world where every country fight for the scarce resources especially clean water and healthy food. With the US and Europe out of the picture, the international stage will be controlled by nations that don't care much for human rights, animals right and environment...

When US has no more power to be the 'global policeman', all these 'meddle class' nations would not be bother too much about democracy and human rights in their countries. The rich will be more powerful, the poor will be manipulated to the fullest. Animals will be killed and tortured openly for human's consumption, entertainment or mere enjoyment more than what we have now...

It will be quite a scary world then...

[Big Uncle]

This is really not new news as the world has already seen the ascending economic power of China and to smaller extent, India. I think that it is a good balance of power now and the fact that, the Dorje Shugden ban has become more and more accessible in China. It is a well-known fact is that Dorje Shugden practice is growing in China because of the Dalai Lama's ban. Whether or not it is deliberate to spread Dorje Shugden is debatable but the consequences are obvious.

Hence, as China grows and matures as a world economic power, the world would slowly but surely turn towards China for its culture, history, pop culture, technology and especially its spirituality. Yes, at the moment, nobody would equate China with spirituality. But what's more important is not what outsides look at China, what would be more important is how the Chinese looks at itself. It has a long history with Buddhism and the most progressive of 'home-grown' spiritual traditions would be Buddhism and at the forefront would be Dorje Shugden.

In fact, Dorje Shugden would be ideal because it is a practice to alleviate obstacles and problems. This would appeal very much to the Chinese because it would be like a quick fix. Because of this, when more Chinese adopt Dorje Shugden, it would be inevitable that they would turn even more towards Buddhism because they gain faith through the results of this practice. I find this aspect very exciting and I rejoice how Dorje Shugden is position to eventually take on China.

[vajratruth]

As Big Uncle correctly pointed out, the report is hardly surprising and seems to be in line with previously anticipated trends. That China and India will rise as the new centres of global influence is already becoming apparent even today. The question is, where does that place Tibet, and by that I am referring to the stateless Tibet (instead of the Tibetan Autonomous Region under China’s sovereignty) and its exiled population?

India can grow and prosper all it likes but that prosperity is not going to benefit the Tibetan refugee settlement because it was never integrated into India’s socio, political and economic structure and is therefore totally disconnected from India’s growth.  As for China, in over half a century the Tibetan government in exile, instead of bridging the gap between them and an economic powerhouse, has alienated themselves even more. The socio-economic gulf between the Tibetans in exile and the rest of the world has been widening so fast the Tibetans in exile are rapidly becoming a stateless nation without any official world recognition, that produces nothing and has nothing to offer the world. How can it survive in an ever competitive world when it is so lame and still depending on handouts and sympathy?

From the latest statistics released by the CTA themselves in 2010, there are 35 Tibetan settlements in India. These settlements can be divided into different categories on the basis of their occupation. Of these, 14 are agricultural settlements, 9 are handicraft based communities and remaining 12 are agro- industrial and scattered communities. These are hardly industries that can carry the Tibetans in exile to be even somewhat in keeping with the rest of the world. The most prominent private “industry” amongst the exiled Tibetans today is making sweaters! The biggest employer in the community is the Tibetan government in exile (accounting for 35% of the work force) and their loosely held together departments.

I am NOT saying these things to gloat at the Tibetans in exiled but to highlight how poorly their own government has failed the people. And for so long! How can they catch up now? And if they do not find a way to keep up, they will very soon be the forgotten people of the world as nations immerse themselves with their own problems as the report indicates will probably happen.

On the other hand, I see the Tibetan Autonomous Region flourishing as China becomes more open in its foreign policies and progressively embrace liberal democratic values. China will learn very soon to relax its grip on the TAR and once it does, the Tibetan Cause would be accomplished, not out of Dharamsala with the CTA as its champion, but from within the TAR by the Chinese Government. At that point, the CTA's progressive redundancy would be complete.

Sometimes I feel that the CTA and its cabinet members have made successful careers out of being exile and they may even take the view that their personal interests are best served remaining in exile. How unfortunate for the ordinary Tibetan who remains a refugee after all this time.

[Ensapa]

As Big Uncle correctly pointed out, the report is hardly surprising and seems to be in line with previously anticipated trends. That China and India will rise as the new centres of global influence is already becoming apparent even today. The question is, where does that place Tibet, and by that I am referring to the stateless Tibet (instead of the Tibetan Autonomous Region under China’s sovereignty) and its exiled population?

India can grow and prosper all it likes but that prosperity is not going to benefit the Tibetan refugee settlement because it was never integrated into India’s socio, political and economic structure and is therefore totally disconnected from India’s growth.  As for China, in over half a century Tibet government in exile, instead of bridging the gap between themselves and an economic powerhouse, has become even more alienated from them. The socio-economic gulf between the Tibetans in exile and the rest of the world has been widening so fast the Tibetans in exile are rapidly becoming a stateless nation without any official world recognition, that produces nothing and has nothing to offer the world. How can it survive then if it still living on handouts today?

From the latest statistics released by the CTA themselves in 2010, there are 35 Tibetan settlements in India. These settlements can be divided into different categories on the basis of their occupation. Of these, 14 are agricultural settlements, 9 are handicraft based communities and remaining 12 are agro- industrial and scattered communities. These are hardly industries that can carry the Tibetans in exile to be even somewhat in keeping with the rest of the world. The most prominent private “industry” amongst the exiled Tibetans today is making sweaters! The biggest employer in the community is the Tibetan government in exile and their loosely held together departments.

I am NOT saying these things to gloat at the Tibetans in exiled but to highlight how poorly their own government has failed the people. And for so long! How can they catch up now? And if they do not find a way to keep up, they will very soon be the forgotten people of the world as nations immerse themselves with their own problems as the report indicates will probably happen.

On the other hand, I see the Tibetan Autonomous Region flourishing as China becomes more open in its foreign policies and progressively embrace liberal democratic values. China will learn very soon to relax its grip on the TAR and once it does, the Tibetan Cause would emerge, not out of Dharamsala with the CTA as its champion, but from within the TAR.

Sometimes I feel that the CTA and its cabinet members have made successful careers out of being exile and they may even take the view that their personal interests are best served remaining in exile. How unfortunate for the ordinary Tibetan who remains a refugee after all this time.

Whether or not they're still refugees or whether or not they have obtained freedom, it is actually just a state of mind. If they allow archaic systems such as mixing religion and secular politics to thrive and prevail, they're just setting themselves up for failure as this will no longer work during this day and age. As they keep playing the victim card, the only thing it does is irritate China more and more and make China think less and less of them and their antics will only irritate India more and more as it would make them look like ungrateful people who do not really have any of India's interest in mind.

[samayakeeper]

Why irk and fight a soaring dragon? That's what the CTA is doing. They should their all their resources and effort and focus on the big issue of making friends with China and through dialogues and agreements, obtain autonomy for Tibet and for Tibetans. So many Tibetans have left the country after losing hope that they may not have the opportunity to return to their motherland. Just do what is good for your people, CTA, and stop making life difficult for your people who have strong spiritual faith in Dorje Shugden.

[Ensapa]

Why irk and fight a soaring dragon? That's what the CTA is doing. They should their all their resources and effort and focus on the big issue of making friends with China and through dialogues and agreements, obtain autonomy for Tibet and for Tibetans. So many Tibetans have left the country after losing hope that they may not have the opportunity to return to their motherland. Just do what is good for your people, CTA, and stop making life difficult for your people who have strong spiritual faith in Dorje Shugden.

It's just not about putting in resources to make friends with China alone. They should really also develop Dharamsala to make things comfortable for themselves and also to show their appreciation to the Indian government. But instead they put in so much unnecessary resources to enforce the banning of Dorje Shugden which is not necessary at all because a government should not enforce a religious edict. What they have is a recipe for failure and disaster that they will not be able to stand up from it or recover their losses when everything ends and they will regret it immensely as all the effort could have been used for improving their lives and perhaps, free Tibet.

[Galen]

As of now, China and India are already economic power that other nations are looking up to. People are flocking to China to do business as the disposable income is higher and consumption power is high due to the size of the population. Opportunities are abundance in these two countries. So, it is no surprise that China and India would become more powerful than the USA in 2030. Americas and the European nations are shrinking in their economies and people are losing their jobs.

China being the superpower that they are now are also reviving their cultural past that was so rich and lost during the Cultural Revolution. The Chinese government is restoring many temples and ancient historical sites which are Buddhism related because they believe that spirituality is important in the growth of a nation. Many of the temple sites are now United Nations Heritage Sites like the Yong He Gong temple in Beijing, the Longmen Grottoes, the Shaolin Temple etc. They are embracing Buddhism again including Dorje Shugden practices. Like what Big Uncle said, Dorje Shugden is the most suitable for people at this age and time because he gives us what we need in our daily life and hook us into Buddhism.

There is really no point for the CTA to go against China. How can anthill compare to a mountain? The more the CTA is  against cChina, especially on the DOrje Shugden ban, the more China is going to promote it. The best way is to embrace it and let every Tibetan have their own free will to practice, whether DS or not. 

As for India, it is the lad where Buddha was born, gain enlightenment, taught and went into clear light. Places like Lumbini, Bodhgaya are sacred places which attracts flocks of pilgrims each year. Promoted correctly, India will become not only a economical superpower, but also a place where Buddhism is alive.

[Ensapa]

As of now, China and India are already economic power that other nations are looking up to. People are flocking to China to do business as the disposable income is higher and consumption power is high due to the size of the population. Opportunities are abundance in these two countries. So, it is no surprise that China and India would become more powerful than the USA in 2030. Americas and the European nations are shrinking in their economies and people are losing their jobs.

China being the superpower that they are now are also reviving their cultural past that was so rich and lost during the Cultural Revolution. The Chinese government is restoring many temples and ancient historical sites which are Buddhism related because they believe that spirituality is important in the growth of a nation. Many of the temple sites are now United Nations Heritage Sites like the Yong He Gong temple in Beijing, the Longmen Grottoes, the Shaolin Temple etc. They are embracing Buddhism again including Dorje Shugden practices. Like what Big Uncle said, Dorje Shugden is the most suitable for people at this age and time because he gives us what we need in our daily life and hook us into Buddhism.

There is really no point for the CTA to go against China. How can anthill compare to a mountain? The more the CTA is  against cChina, especially on the DOrje Shugden ban, the more China is going to promote it. The best way is to embrace it and let every Tibetan have their own free will to practice, whether DS or not. 

As for India, it is the lad where Buddha was born, gain enlightenment, taught and went into clear light. Places like Lumbini, Bodhgaya are sacred places which attracts flocks of pilgrims each year. Promoted correctly, India will become not only a economical superpower, but also a place where Buddhism is alive.

Here's another possibility for the CTA: India growing so big that they need the land that the loaned to the CTA 50 years ago to accommodate their own people. And there is nothing the CTA can do about it or prevent that if India chose to do something like that. If I was CTA, I would stop making China my no.1 enemy because they can only grow stronger and stronger and they will never weaken while CTA has been stagnant for the longest time, and to develop Dharamsala as a thank you for India, until India feels so grateful that they allow the Tibetans an extended stay on their lands instead of wasting time, effort, energy and resources to implement the Dorje Shugden ban.

[DharmaDefender]

As of now, China and India are already economic power that other nations are looking up to. People are flocking to China to do business as the disposable income is higher and consumption power is high due to the size of the population. Opportunities are abundance in these two countries. So, it is no surprise that China and India would become more powerful than the USA in 2030. Americas and the European nations are shrinking in their economies and people are losing their jobs.

China being the superpower that they are now are also reviving their cultural past that was so rich and lost during the Cultural Revolution. The Chinese government is restoring many temples and ancient historical sites which are Buddhism related because they believe that spirituality is important in the growth of a nation. Many of the temple sites are now United Nations Heritage Sites like the Yong He Gong temple in Beijing, the Longmen Grottoes, the Shaolin Temple etc. They are embracing Buddhism again including Dorje Shugden practices. Like what Big Uncle said, Dorje Shugden is the most suitable for people at this age and time because he gives us what we need in our daily life and hook us into Buddhism.

There is really no point for the CTA to go against China. How can anthill compare to a mountain? The more the CTA is  against cChina, especially on the DOrje Shugden ban, the more China is going to promote it. The best way is to embrace it and let every Tibetan have their own free will to practice, whether DS or not. 

As for India, it is the lad where Buddha was born, gain enlightenment, taught and went into clear light. Places like Lumbini, Bodhgaya are sacred places which attracts flocks of pilgrims each year. Promoted correctly, India will become not only a economical superpower, but also a place where Buddhism is alive.

The point isnt so much that the CTA cannot go against China, or that theres no point in them even attempting. I liken the whole situation as being like a drop of ink in an ocean versus a glass of water.

At the moment, the effect of the CTA and their politicking is like a drop of ink in a glass of water - it stains everything and has a lot of effect on the Buddhist scene because lets face it, without Chinas open doors, the scene is pretty limited.

When China reaches its peak (whether in 2030 or earlier) and becomes more open, the Buddhist scene and the potential for Dorje Shugden to spread will grow exponentially. At the time, whatever the CTA tries or insists will be like a drop of ink in an ocean...insignificant and no matter how much they protest and shout about it, it will never come to anything.

The CTA by virtue of their ill-motivation and inability to be kind to others will eventually lose influence and power in the world. Its just a matter of time and a question of when.

[Ensapa]

The point isnt so much that the CTA cannot go against China, or that theres no point in them even attempting. I liken the whole situation as being like a drop of ink in an ocean versus a glass of water.

At the moment, the effect of the CTA and their politicking is like a drop of ink in a glass of water - it stains everything and has a lot of effect on the Buddhist scene because lets face it, without Chinas open doors, the scene is pretty limited.

When China reaches its peak (whether in 2030 or earlier) and becomes more open, the Buddhist scene and the potential for Dorje Shugden to spread will grow exponentially. At the time, whatever the CTA tries or insists will be like a drop of ink in an ocean...insignificant and no matter how much they protest and shout about it, it will never come to anything.

The CTA by virtue of their ill-motivation and inability to be kind to others will eventually lose influence and power in the world. Its just a matter of time and a question of when.

The wheels are already in motion for China to grow even more and more as their economic power is rising. Chinese people who have migrated all over the world and have succeeded in the countries that they migrated in are slowly returning to China and some of them even bought back heritage items that were stolen from China during world war 1 and donating it back to China. So in a sense, China has a lot of supporters to help them grow bigger and bigger. China is also putting in a lot of effort to restore Buddhism to its former glory as well, complete with Dorje Shugden and CTA cannot do much now, even, they cannot do anything about it in the near future when China really takes off, soon.

[WisdomBeing]

“If every 8 year old in the world is taught meditation, we will eliminate violence from the world within one generation.” This quote by HH the Dalai Lama has been going viral on the internet but is meditation the answer to a selfish future controlled by two of the most populous countries in the world? China’s population in 2012 is 1,343,239,923, followed by India with 1,205,073,612, and then the United States at a relatively paltry 313,847,465.

Our world has never seen the simultaneous, sustained accelerated growth of two nations that together account for one-third of the planet's population. For the past two decades, China has been growing at an astounding 9.5% a year, and India by 6%. Given their young populations, high savings, and the sheer amount of catching up they still have to do, most economists figure China and India possess the fundamentals to keep growing in the 7%-to-8% range for decades.

In a world where there is a scarcity of resources, a ravenous growing, consuming and wasting population spells disaster for the earth – on a human as well as environmental capacity. Will meditation help? Perhaps, perhaps not. I guess it depends on what people meditate on. If they meditate on caring for others, benefiting others, patience, generosity, discipline… the we would not have to worry about what will happen to the world because the world would be looked after by the very people who are more than capable of destroying it.

If more people could have access to the Buddhist philosophy and learn how to live together harmoniously, it would not matter who is the larger economic power because the richer nations would help the poorer ones and they would actually benefit themselves in the end. All is needed is wisdom – perhaps from the Buddha of Wisdom, Dorje Shugden, whose practice is already being gently nurtured in China, one of the future big powers.

[Ensapa]

In a world where there is a scarcity of resources, a ravenous growing, consuming and wasting population spells disaster for the earth – on a human as well as environmental capacity. Will meditation help? Perhaps, perhaps not. I guess it depends on what people meditate on. If they meditate on caring for others, benefiting others, patience, generosity, discipline… the we would not have to worry about what will happen to the world because the world would be looked after by the very people who are more than capable of destroying it.

Moral and a decay in ethics can already be seen in both China and India. For this reason alone, both countries have a very strong need for spirituality, not just something they can believe in but something that gives them an explanation about life and on what is it all about, that there is more to life than just material things. China has woken up to this fact and they are now promoting Buddhism with a lot of zeal, they dont promote other religions the same way they did with Buddhism. India will need Buddhism too in due time where the middle class surges in number.

[WisdomBeing]

China may be promoting Buddhism now but Buddhism has to be real in order to work. I am not sure how far China knows that Buddhism is about renunciation. Renunciation of the material which is the basis of its growth right now. I think China would like to use Buddhism as a tool to control its subjects – but I am actually not sure if China or India would be ready for Buddhism in its truest form. The rural folk who are not as materially successful thus materially less dependent in these two countries may find solace in Buddhism as did the agriculture-based Tibetans, but as the rural folks get a taste for the material, the desire for transient pleasures may win over the spiritual.

[Ensapa]

China may be promoting Buddhism now but Buddhism has to be real in order to work. I am not sure how far China knows that Buddhism is about renunciation. Renunciation of the material which is the basis of its growth right now. I think China would like to use Buddhism as a tool to control its subjects – but I am actually not sure if China or India would be ready for Buddhism in its truest form. The rural folk who are not as materially successful thus materially less dependent in these two countries may find solace in Buddhism as did the agriculture-based Tibetans, but as the rural folks get a taste for the material, the desire for transient pleasures may win over the spiritual.

There is a very huge possibility that China is trying to use Buddhism as a tool to control the people, but on the other hand, the moral decay that can be observed in the Chinese people is quite alarming. And at the same time, as if it was a response to that, China seems to be paying a lot of attention to Buddhism and they are building temples and sponsoring the sangha. Has anyone asked the question why is it only Buddhism that China promotes and supports and not the other religions? Not even Taoism and Confucianism? Because it is the time for China to have another golden era of Buddhism.