Dalai Lama loses his cool with peaceful Buddhist nun

[WisdomBeing]

Wow. This is the first direct confrontation between a Shugden practitioner and HH the Dalai Lama that I have seen. The Dalai Lama sounds flustered and upset. Take a look at the video and see what you think?

Dalai Lama loses his cool with peaceful Buddhist nun
http://falsedalailama.com/dalai-lama-loses-cool-peaceful-buddhist-nun/
Posted on February 24, 2014
The mask is slipping.

A peaceful Buddhist nun gives a message to the Dalai Lama from the International Shugden Community, requesting religious freedom for Shugden Buddhists, at his hotel – the ultra-luxurious Ritz Carlton in San Francisco. His angry response speaks for itself.

Dalai Lama loses cool with peaceful Buddhist nun

[dsiluvu]

Whatever the reason the Dalai Lama is giving, it still does not justify to ban another person's religion/faith/belief what so ever!

If the excuse is that it is "spirit worship" than might as well ban 50% of the faiths and beliefs on this planet like Vodoo, Santanic, Wicker, Newage, Bon (which is from Tibet and is still be practised today, how Dalai Lama does not ban this spirit/nature worship???) Taoist and the list can go on very long!

So not an EXCUSE to have such a discrimination on His own people. This is by far the worst kind of DISCRIMINATION I've encountered and it is being created by BUDDHIST who is suppose to be the world's most peaceful religion?!! SHAMEFUL.

[samayakeeper]

Why is it that the practice of Dorje Shugden is considered worship of a spirit but reliance on unenlightened dharma protectors by the Dalai Lama is not? For instance, Nechung.

For the Dalai Lama to appear upset in public did not augur well for his public image, more so when the nun was polite and was speaking in a polite and respectful manner. it is puzzling why the Dalai Lama behaved so.  What and how would the Dalai Lama react and say to the vociferous crowd protesting as he stepped out of the vehicle he was driven in? Maybe louder and appearing more upset.

Dalai Lama, stop lying! 

[WisdomBeing]

Interesting point DSiloveu. Actually, since Buddhists do not believe in a Creator God, then the Dalai Lama could proclaim Christianity as spirit worship, since the Christian God is not said to be enlightened. Now that would really be putting the cat among the pigeons! Not to mention what the Muslims would think about views on THEIR God. So once we start condemning another faith/belief, we start going into murky waters and wars begin. This is exactly why Buddhism is SUPPOSED to teach harmony and respect for other religions. Including Dorje Shugden please and thank you very much.

[WisdomBeing]

Just to add more info to this video.. there's an article on PRWeb which I just came across.

http://www.prweb.com/releases/2014/02/prweb11609135.htm?

Dalai Lama's Reaction to a Peaceful Protestor at the Ritz Hotel
The Dalai Lama is shown pointing his finger at and stating "no, no, no, no" in an exchange with a peaceful protestor in an amateur video taken today as he left his hotel. Buddhist protestors, including monks and nuns from the International Shugden Community, chanted “Dalai Lama give religious freedom” as he arrived at Davies Symphony Hall, stating that they would shadow all his talks this week in California.

(PRWEB) February 23, 2014
The Dalai Lama is watched by a crowd of greeters whilst in an animated exchange with a peaceful Buddhist Shugden nun, as she asked for religious freedom for Shugden people while handing him a leaflet as he left the Ritz Carlton today. As his private security urged him to leave the conversation, the Dalai Lama returned to address the nun directly, while shaking his finger at her and saying that this was not a matter of religious freedom as her practice was not a religion.

The San Francisco streets around the hotel were blocked off for more than 20 minutes as his motorcade took him to the Davies Symphony Hall where he was to speak, and was then met by more than 200 Buddhists including monks and nuns protesting loudly and continuously. The demonstrators held large signs and chanted “Dalai Lama give religious freedom” and “Dalai Lama stop lying”.

Spokesperson for the International Shugden Community, the group organizing the demonstration, Len Foley says “We do not ask that he likes our religion but that religious freedom should apply to all traditions whether he likes them or not. This is our only point. Why is this so hard for him to agree with? As a powerful leader he must implement a policy of religious freedom and non-discrimination for all.”

International Shugden Community protestors have stated that they will continue to demonstrate against him at all his events until he publicly agrees to allow equal rights and religious freedom for the Shugden people.
More information at http://www.falsedalailama.com

[Q]

The ISC have been doing an excellent job with their peaceful demonstrations in California for the last 3 days. I suppose, for the last 3 days, all HHDL could hear are their voices shouting 'Dalai Lama Pls stop lying' or 'Dalai Lama give religious freedom' lol!

I must say this nun in the video is a very determined, powerful and strong practitioner of Dorje Shugden. Just seeing how stern, intimidating HHDL can be, if it was someone with a 'shaky' faith, they would have caved in under pressure. In fact, if you have seen enough interviews of HHDL and others, you will find that some interviewers actually perspire when they interview HHDL, because His presence is just so powerful lol! Well, nothing strange there, He is after all Chenrezig.

This time, I think the ISC have much more experience and contacts with the media to get their message across. I've been following the news reports and I must say that they are all over the web! In various news channels and websites: http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/news/isc-demands-religious-freedom-from-dalai-lama/

I really hope that through their effort, human rights group will pick up on the discrimination that DS practitioners suffer from. It is just so unfair to ban a religious practice, it is a breach of religious rights.

[Dulzie Bear]

Clearly the Dalai Lama let his well rehearsed demeanor slip. It really does the Dalai Lama no good to have lost his cool in public, especially when he has been trading on his image of a simple, gentle and peace-loving monk who trotted the world preaching religious tolerance. I am certain the Dalai Lama is aware of this and indeed we have never seen such aggressive posturing before in public (except to his own Tibetan people whom he lords over).

Over these recent years, calls for the Dalai Lama to justify his ban of the Dorje Shugden practice have become louder and yet he has yet to rise to the challenge simply because there are no genuine reasons. Imagine this - someone who is supposed to be the consummate expert in Buddhism cannot draw from over 2600 years of Buddhist history and teachings to legitimize his persecution of his own people.  If there were any genuine scriptural basis to support the Dalai Lama's many and varied accusations of the Shugden practice as being unholy and damaging, the controversy would have stopped in 1996 itself when the ban was instituted. Which Tibetan Buddhist monk or lay practitioner in his right mind would wish to oppose the Dalai Lama unless such a dangerous and unpopular stance was indeed more in accord with preserving the Buddha's teachings. 

I guess, in realizing that his mask is slipping and the charade might soon be over, the Dalai Lama did what any panicking liar under pressure would -  he attacked, seeing that it was the only form of defense available.   Such hostility towards a nun at this time, and in public view of citizens of a country known to treasure freedom of expression, is sure evidence that the Dalai Lama feels that his credibility is now under serious threat. Threat from what? From the truth.

[Manisha Kudo]

The Buddhist nun is not only brave but also skilful in delivering her request to the Dalai Lama. However, the DL's reaction was not only unkind but he also distorted the theme of happiness that he wished to promote. What is the DL trying to show us? Is he really a Bodhisattva that returns in a nirmanakaya form to participate in this illusionary play for the sake of all sentient beings?

As clearly articulated above, condemning DS as spirit worship and as such should be banned is ridiculous. The very fact of oracle-practice in itself dabbles with spirits and unenlightened beings. Further to this, enlightenment is a path for our mind's liberation and awakening. It seems that the DL has swayed many people to focus on whether this protector is enlightened or that is not because he is a spirit. Then, where is the practice? Something to think about, yes? 

[icy]

So the Dalai Lama manifested wrath to that gentle nun requesting for religious freedom. It is in a million chance to witness this wrath. The more Dalai Lama suppress Dorje Shugden, the more publicity is on this Great Protector making him widely spread all around the world; making him famous and planting karmic imprints. It has never in history before that a Buddhist Deity has this kind of wide media coverage and in all the major medias. Thanks to the Dalai Lama and the International Shugden Group!

When religion and politics are joined to the hip, it will cause the practice to spread like wild fire. This is the beginning of the DORJE SHUGDEN Renaissance.

[Losang_Tenpa]

When religion and politics are joined to the hip, it will cause the practice to spread like wild fire. This is the beginning of the DORJE SHUGDEN Renaissance.

All of the great Lamas in recent memory denounced the mixing of politics and religion, and for good reason.

[Kim Hyun Jae]

When we mix politics with religion, this is exactly the effect of what we do can see now, which is confusion and split of beliefs that causes disheartened minds.

Perhaps this effect is what we need to see with our own eyes, ie. HH the Dalai Lama to react in a wrathful way, which seemed he manifested quick anger, but is it really so? The video has brought in more readership and media coverage views than any paid advertisement. Is this the effect he wanted the world to see?

[christine V]

Dalai Lama always spoke about Freedom in religion, harmonious and peace.
In this video, the way Dalai Lama answered to the nun, the way H.H showed the anger were quite a surprised to the world.

With this video going into mass, it is not only bring negative influence on current Tibetan freedom, but also to Buddhism.
With the angry voice of Dalai Lama recorded, it totally do not reflect the peaceful and harmonious amongst Buddhist.
As for the brave nun, she is so polite and brave to approach Dalai Lama and spoke to H.H in peace voice. I gave great salute to the nun.
Hope with this act, Dorje Shugden practitioner have chances to open up the dialog with Dalai Lama.

[WisdomBeing]

Just to update more news on this thread so you can rejoice in the fact that there is interest in this news piece. The title of this article is more provocative, which is probably the only way to bring attention to this topic in today's media world where the voice of the downtrodden is drowned by news of the Oscars.

Dalai Lama Caught on Camera Insulting Buddhist Nun and Criticizing Ancient Buddhist Practice
 
http://www.consumerelectronicsnet.com/article/Dalai-Lama-Caught-on-Camera-Insulting-Buddhist-Nun-and-Criticizing-Ancient-Buddhist-Practice-3084252

(PRWEB) February 26, 2014

In an incident captured on an iPhone camera by a surprised hotel guest, the Dalai Lama was seen pointing his finger at and refusing to accept a request for religious freedom by a quiet Buddhist nun.

As his entourage encouraged him to leave, he returned to criticize the nuns spiritual tradition by denouncing it as not a religion but as spirit worship, and therefore not eligible for religious freedom.

The nun was part of a group of Buddhist practitioners who have been requesting dialogue with the Dalai Lama for 18 years, asking him to give religious freedom to Shugden Buddhists by lifting a ban he imposed in 1996 on their 400-year old spiritual practice.

Spokesperson, Len Foley, for the International Shugden Community, a group representing the rights of Shugden Buddhists said We have tried to have a discussion with him for many years now. This is the only time a Shugden Buddhist has gotten close enough to him to question him directly. His reaction brings us great sadness.

Len Foley continues, By imposing this ban, his words and actions have and are causing millions of people to suffer by creating division between them and destroying their harmony and peaceful life. There have been many incidences where his followers have been incited to extreme anger with Shugden practitioners, resulting in public humiliation, provocation, intimidation and threats, including dismissing them from their jobs, refusing basic, and even medical services to them. We do not ask that he likes our religion but that religious freedom should apply to all traditions whether he likes them or not. This is our only point. Because we cannot get dialogue with him, the only voice we have is to demonstrate against him at all his events including this week in California and next week in DC.

(Cabinet of Tibet Government in Exile - Dharamsala 'Points of the Kashag's statements concerning Dogyal, 31 May 1996,http://www.dalailama.com/messages/dolgyal-shugden/kashags-statement, Aug 1st, 2008).

More information at http://www.falsedalailama.com

Other news articles on the demonstrations include:
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Dalai-Lama-The-Forum-Los-Angeles-California-Tibet-247050521.html
http://www.abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local&id=9441887

Read the full story at http://www.prweb.com/releases/2014/02/prweb11618649.htm.

[icy]

As I see it on the video replay many times over, the nun is indeed calm, gentle and patient. Her voice to the Dalai Lama is placid and stable but broken into by an irritable voice of the Dalai Lama saying DS worship is not a religion and he knows the teaching. I find it weird the Dalai Lama saying this and he is the only one saying this – but all his GURUs also know the teaching very well and comes from an unbroken and authentic lineage of Great Masters. Who is the Dalai Lama trying to challenge?

The Dalai Lama must know that religion is not defined by Tibetan masters but is defined by the UN CHARTER that any form of worship is to be respected and this goes to all democratic countries. Haven’t Tibetans celebrated a democratic administrative governance and call themselves democrats? Doesn’t this discrimination contravene and violate its own constitution?

Isn’t this all so ridiculous?

[vajrastorm]

A gentle Buddhist nun peacefully and quietly asks for dialogue with HH Dalai Lama on the ban on Shugden practice, and also requests for His Holiness to stop speaking against Dorje Shugden practice because it was creating violence against them.The unexpected burst of anger, from the Dalai Lama ,in response to the nun's peaceful request, caught everyone by surprise. Imagine this being caught on camera and viewed by a large number of people!

The International Shugden Community, had no choice but to stage a peaceful demonstration as a means of coming face -to-face with him. All avenues of dialogue with the Dalai Lama had been closed in their faces.

What the Dalai Lama angrily said to this peaceful nun was, " This is not a matter of religious freedom.No, no, no ,no... this is worship of a spirit. So that is wrong".

But the crux of the matter is that this is about religious freedom, not about the worship of a spirit, as the Dalai Lama claims. In Tibet,  and even outside of Tibet, Tibetans are allowed, by the Dalai Lama, to practice the Bon religion, which is about spirit worship as well. So why not allow Dorje Shugden?

In the country where this encounter and exchange between the nun and the Dalai Lama took place, i.e. US, religious freedom is enshrined in the constitution. But , with the Tibetans-in-exile, the Dalai Lama has written into their constitution that the worship of Shugden is not allowed! He has declared it illegal to practice Shugden. His denouncement of the public worship of Shugden is on grounds that it creates schism and violence. On the contrary, in effect, it is the speeches of the Dalai Lama against Shugden practice that is creating the violence and the schisms against Shugden practitioners!

May HH Dalai Lama keep his word of retiring from politics and may the ban be lifted soon.