DL loves demonstrations - Taiwan

[vajralight]

http://www.telegraaf.nl/video/buitenland/4725138/__Dalai_Lama___Ik_hou_van_demonstraties___.html

video in english


vajralight

[yedi]

 ... he said that Dholgyal (Shugden) issue is not only a religious issue, but it became a tool for Chinese government. ... However, Dholgyal followers became like a subject to be used for both politics and propaganda by People Republic of China. ....

It became? This means, it had been not a tool for the Chinese Government until now and the Dorje Shugden followers had been also never payed by them and all other rubbish? Sounds like a confession. Okay, nothing new for me, I never met a Chinese in my life, who wanted to give me his money  (and why any Chinese should do so, since the Tibetans oppress and harass now each other, there is nothing to do for them anymore - except to sit fascinated infront of their monitors and to watch with huge eyes while drinking coke and noshing popcorn. Or Chinese rice crackers, I don't know. Probably they can even learn from the Tibetans, how to "clean" one's society properly.)

... they were separated and became clean, after religious and material connection are cut off. Among them Tibetans are very few. .... I think this will be clean before long. Therefore, it is not a question of religion; it falls under situation of politics only. ...  the public has responsibility to try to vanish their continuity, which is like air of poison, without letting it to increase in future. Therefore, you must take it into consideration

Goebbels couldn't express this idea of an 'end solution' nicer. I would really appreciate Samdong Rinpoche to spread more of such articles around for the Western public. Especially for the German press 

[Thom]

We've come a long way in such a short time. It's true after all that the darker moment of night is just before dawn. When I think of the nightmare of the persecution unleashed only a couple of winters ago, the fear those poor monks had to go through, the fear in the lay communities of those unfortunate Tibetans, the false Schism in the Sangha forcibly fabricated by the political power of the TGIE ... what a dark, dark moment! And now look, such glorious morning.
So it's great to recall the efforts of those who were able to stop at least the gross abuse, that wonderful union between the WSS and the Tibetan monks during the demonstrations, and all the efforts, secret and open, of all those who helped during that terrible moment. I think we writers and bloggers and webmasters can be quite happy and rejoice in our efforts.
No doubt we have to remain vigilant, and also to forgive without forgetting. No forgetting in order not to repeat errors of the past, mainly the mixing of religion and politics.
May we now concentrate in our practice and all Dharma endeavors.
Thank you Wisdombuddha.
May the precious teachings of Lord Buddha and of Lord Tsonkapa's lineage proliferate, may we practitioners of this most fortunate and pure lineage quickly become omniscient Buddhas to benefit all our mothers without exception. May all goodness expand to the end of space.
There's nothing that the Dalai Lama or the Tibetan Government in Exile can do to eradicate the practice of Protector Dorje Shugden because it's not within their power to do so, any more than it is within their power to stop the sun from rising every morning. Because he is a Wisdom Buddha, all beings will continue receive his care and protection and his practice will spread throughout the world, like the beneficial rays of the sun.

[yedi]

wow, thank you so much, really great thoughts 
Since the Dalai Lama is not part of our transmission lineage and also not the head of the Gelugpa sect, who is acutally the Ganden Tripa, there is no reason to define us over the Dalai Lama at all: not as Dalai Lama followers, not as Dalai Lama haters, not as Dalai Lama survivers and not as Dalai Lama whatever.
Probably just some kind of more or less painful emancipation process?

[LosangKhyentse]

Forgive my ignorance but can someone please answer the following questions:



1. Did the Western Shugden Society actually stop all protests agains the Dalai Lama?

2. If so, since when?

3. Why?

4. Was there any breakthroughs?

5. Does the WSS have any future plans?? To continue again at a later date or other methods to reverse the ban by the Dalai Lama??



Much appreciation ahead of time for taking the time to answer my questions.

[emptymountains]

@ a friend - See? Another redundant post! 

[a friend]

@Emptymountains: You are absolutely right. 
I think we all know by now that Thom feels that he was particularly hit by the DL's actions and we all know what he himself proclaims: that he can't get over it. So again, whatcha gonna do? 

@TK: I don't have any direct link with the WSS, but Wisdombuddha (who was one of our fellow members) in his own website says the following, that should partially answer your question:

Persecution stops, WSS stops

As the world media spotlight is never far away, the Dalai Lama and his followers are forced to be more cautious, and as a result we are hearing less about the persecution of Dorje Shugden practitioners in the Tibetan exile community in India. Recent information indicates that the Tibetan government have stopped the persecution because the Dalai Lama's reputation is decreasing in the world due to this mistake. If the Dalai Lama continues to speak out and act to destroy the practice of Dorje Shugden and the beloved Gelugupa tradition transmitted by the lineage holders Je Phabongkhapa and Trijang Rinpoche, as well as many other great Gelugpa Lamas and their disciples, he now knows that WSS demonstrators will continue to protest to bring this hypocrisy and injustice to the world's attention. The WSS wants peace. If the Dalai Lama and his government stop, the demonstrations stop. If they do not stop, the WSS does not stop.

This is all I know about it and it sounds accurate in a general way. What is not so accurate is that the persecution has stopped. It has stopped somehow in Ganden and Sera for obvious reasons. But as we know the DL and his followers are relentless in encouraging and congratulationg Tibetans for the persecution of other Tibetans, so it's easy to guess that people continue to suffer segregation, shunning and everything that typically happens when people blindly follow a political leader. But it's not easy to keep track of what happens in the general lay communities and remote places inside and outside Tibet and India and around the world.
Anyway, I don't think that the WSS is linking the demos to the ban, only to the massive persecution of monks as the one that struck the great monasteries the previous winter. Smaller monasteries and isolated lay people are probably quite helpless.
Let's pray that this nightmare will end soon.

[LosangKhyentse]

Dear A friend,

Thank you for the information regarding WSS.

But you are right, openly it looks like the Tibetan Govt has lessened the persecution. But it is still going on quietly and within the Tibetan communities.

For example, it is happening very strongly in Kathmandu where there is a large sizable population of Tibetans. The local Tibetans still order many thangkas and statues of Dorje Shugden from the Nepalese artisans. To the Nepalese, they could care less regarding Tibetan Politics. Profit is profit. Dorje Shugden thangkas/statues are in high demand always.

The local artisans sizable portion of business come from the lay and Monastic Tibetans that surround. There are many large and small Tibetan Monasteries.

The local Tibetan govt office called, Gaden Khangsar on Lazimpat Road, Kathmandu, hires Tibetans and local Nepalese to spy on other Tibetans who are still practicing. To get into their homes is not always easy, so they stake out at the shops. Who is going in and ordering what thangkas and statues is a good indicator. Of course they target the Tibetans who order any Shugden images.

The Nepalese artisans usually work in an area that is open for the public to view and visit. But for Dorje Shugden artwork, they have a seperate room to do the work to hide from public eyes because of this spy ring from Gaden Khangsar.

Local Tibetans in Kathmandu are still heavily practicing Shugden, albeit, very secretly. The Nepalese artisans are the ones who say so because they are the ones doing all the artwork. The local Nepalese artisans and shops mention excitedly many times there are many Shugden people there secretly doing their practice/pujas because orders for Shugden Thangkas and statues are brisk. 

The comical part is that the Tibetans who protest or talk against Shugden discouraging his practice ARE THE ONES ACTUALLY STILL PRACTICING! Why, obviously to take the suspicion away from themselves as there are many spies paid for by the Tibetan govt to watch who is still practicing. Once a person is found out, the Tibetan Govt incites the local Tibetans to ostracize whoever are still doing it.

This is happening right now.

As mixed up as it seems, among the chaos in Kathmandu, H.H. Kyabje Pabongka Choktrul Rinpoche resides there and doing well.
H.E. Gangchen Tulku Rinpoche, the healer, also has a huge organization, schools, prayer halls, guest houses, incense/woodwork factories there also. Gangchen Rinpoche has many devotees and strong sponsors there who 100% support and serve Gangchen Rinpoche. Gangchen Rinpoche's own thangka artisans, cannot keep up with the amount of orders of Shugden paintings and Kache Marpo ordered from locals and abroad. Some of the thangkas are quite large over 10 feet in length. 

Dagom ladrang is based there with his assistants and students awaiting the new incarnation with pujas and many prayers.


If anyone have more information re WSS or why they have stopped their protests, please post up.

Thank you everyone.

[a friend]

@TK, Thank you so very much for the good news.

@Thom, I hadn't seen that song, (I just did), but as per your words you are still angry and anger is not a good motivation for doing things. I understand that you are still angry but it would be nice for yourself if you would try to look into it and say, I am not my anger. I feel angry but I am not my anger.
You can also try to establish a good motivation for saying "what it is". Think about it. Motivation is first.
Best to you!

[a friend]

@Thom:

Hi Thom, I hear you. I don't doubt what you are saying. Even though I don't know what he did against you and your family as magic goes, well, he did order exorcisms against our Protector and all of us, the devotees. But whatever he did against you all, the benefactors, is bad for him. Please don't make it bad for yourself by cultivating the grudge. I know, I know, it's easy said when you are not the one suffering but still, if I'm asking you to do something not to espouse your own outrage, it's just out of concern for yourself. You are not helping yourself Thom. Actually you are in a way helping him achieving whatever negativity he might've put on you, you are being his weapon against yourself, why giving him such power? Do you understand this? If you forgive you become free. If you go on and on and on then you are closing your own shackles and handing him the key. Is this what you want? Please don't harm yourself, don't give up your own power to another.
I was telling you to look at Kyabje Trijang Dorjechang's picture the other day, in order to help your mind. But you feel related to Kyabje Domo Geshe Rinpoche, I remember now. There is a picture in this website. Sometimes it's helpful just to look in the eyes of a Buddha.

[Gabby Potter]

I am pretty sure His Holiness does, because we are bringing Dorje Shugden to more people around the world through reporters, medias etc. I hope that more people would speak up and defend their own beliefs, there's nothing wrong about speaking up, we just have to do it the proper way.