Dalai Lama corrects himself on Chinese Panchen Lama

[dsnowlion]

Also once the Dalai Lama returns to Tibet, he will definitely need to STOP talking negatively on Dorje Shugden! Because China is positioning itself to be a country, a superpower nation that abides, respect and adheres to human rights' freedom of religion.

When one thinks more about the Dalai Lama's actions and what he is doing now, which is trying very hard to be on China's good books, you can't help but to wonder, why the sudden change of tune? I cannot help but to wonder, perhaps this is the whole illusory play that Kyabje Trijang Dorje Chang predicted and that there will come a time where the Dalai Lama is seen as doing something very contradictory, but we should not lose faith in either the Dalai Lama nor Dorje Shugden for they are both is working hand in hand to spread the Dharma. This prediction, the scenario seems to become more and more viable as we witness the unfolding events. And it does not make any sense why the Dalai Lama is pushing to return to Tibet knowing very well when he does go, he will be controlled by the Chinese gov, and everything he do will be controlled. Even his next incarnation. But he is acknowledging the China-backed Panchen Lama now as the real one too and mention he is the "official one". If you know the history on how the Dalai Lamas' incarnation are being recognised, you'll know it is usually the Panchen Lamas who does this job, and vice versa, the Dalai Lama recognises the Panchen Lama lifetime after lifetime. So indeed this is really interesting how the Dalai Lama now is showing his acceptance to the Chinese Panchen Lama.

So what does all this mean? What is all this for? What is the Dalai Lama trying to do in trying to get back to Tibet? It cannot be to fight China, because that is impossible, it can only be for a much higher purpose... to preserve and spread the Dharma once again from the land of the snow and to ensure that the future of Dharma would be safe in the right hands, or right lamas. This is my thoughts, perhaps just some crazy thoughts... but who knows until it happens eh? Until then, it seems to be going in the direction where it would be better for Dorje Shugden practitioners.

I'm surprised no one here was criticized for supporting the Dalai Lama.  Could anyone explain why it had to be certain people?

I guess to me it is as simple as is the Dalai Lama an emanation of Chenrezig or not. Well, His Holiness Trijang Rinpoche sure thought so because if he did not, why would he write such a thing in his book Music Delighting and predict the situation we are now experiencing and also advised us not to criticise or take sides between Dorje Shugden and the Dalai Lama. I am not attained so I would rather follow those who are and I would rather not collect more negative karma than I already have and to be some kind of arrogant clown.

[dsnowlion]

Did you really forget the other high lamas?  It's not always going to be the Dalai Lama is the only person able to find an incarnation of anyone!  There are other Gelugpa lamas that are to fulfill the role of finding his incarnation!  Perhaps even the Karmapa might join in!

Either way, why on earth would the government need to interfere?  What year do you think this is?  This isn't 1616 or whatever.  This is 2018, we are no longer making government based on religion(though there are political attempts to repress religion).  The Dalai Lama has already stated publicly that he will take rebirth outside of China in India or somewhere in the Himalayas perhaps as a woman or will be the last.  He will not be reborn as an American child.

This is a very GOOD POINT made and boy am I glad it is not 1616 anymore. Yes, there are many high Gelugpa lamas who would probably be asked to recognise the 15th Dalai Lama IF there's gonna be one. I also heard that the Dalai Lama MAY select his own incarnation before he leaves this life. If that happens, it will be historical, not that it has never been done by other lamas, but rather rare.

CTA will probably try their best to interfere just to be "relevant" but with the latest news unfolding, I think it's time for us to say goodbye to them. I don't think China needs them to help manage anything. 

[Questionable]

How does it feel "TrulyandAbsolutelyQuestionable" being thrown off Pastor Patel's "Ask a Question" blog on Tsem Tulku's website.

Does everything have to be blamed on Harold Musetescu?  Because he's not going to always be your scapegoat for excuses.  If you really want an end to all this rubbish, then why don't you do something?  Since protesting Harold is weak and simply an excuse for you "TrulyandAbsolutelyQuestionable" to see this as a "symptom of spirit harm," why not try other ways instead of just posting complaints on the internet about Harold?  You're not going to get much if you don't do anything.

"Why so much anger?"

Since when did I blame everything on you?  All I stated was that you are an example of anti-Shugdenpas discriminating us for such things and laughing at us fighting each other over such things like supporting the Dalai Lama or not.

I'm afraid I cannot do much as I am hours away from the nearest Shugden temple or even meditation retreat from where I live.  However, since you seem to be in contact with Kechara very well, your guru, and the oracle, why don't you do something yourself?  I'm afraid I cannot do as much as you can, so why don't you use this opportunity to actually do something?  Since you are an adult and with closer connections, why don't you try yourself?  Let's see who the correct Karmapa is.  Let's see what we can do to actually end this schism.  Go on, you have more opportunity than me.

[Questionable]

Did you really forget the other high lamas?  It's not always going to be the Dalai Lama is the only person able to find an incarnation of anyone!  There are other Gelugpa lamas that are to fulfill the role of finding his incarnation!  Perhaps even the Karmapa might join in!

Either way, why on earth would the government need to interfere?  What year do you think this is?  This isn't 1616 or whatever.  This is 2018, we are no longer making government based on religion(though there are political attempts to repress religion).  The Dalai Lama has already stated publicly that he will take rebirth outside of China in India or somewhere in the Himalayas perhaps as a woman or will be the last.  He will not be reborn as an American child.

This is a very GOOD POINT made and boy am I glad it is not 1616 anymore. Yes, there are many high Gelugpa lamas who would probably be asked to recognise the 15th Dalai Lama IF there's gonna be one. I also heard that the Dalai Lama MAY select his own incarnation before he leaves this life. If that happens, it will be historical, not that it has never been done by other lamas, but rather rare.

CTA will probably try their best to interfere just to be "relevant" but with the latest news unfolding, I think it's time for us to say goodbye to them. I don't think China needs them to help manage anything.

Oh China is busy with its own stuff.  After Mao and so on, it now has to deal with America(though I'm not too sure on the entire reincarnation law of not being able to reincarnate unless you ask the government and the Dalai Lama sees this law as ridiculous).  Still, may Tibet at least find peace including with its people of all kinds.

[Harold Musetescu]

"I guess to me it is as simple as is the Dalai Lama an emanation of Chenrezig or not. Well, His Holiness Trijang Rinpoche sure thought so because if he did not, why would he write such a thing in his book Music Delighting and predict the situation we are now experiencing and also advised us not to criticize or take sides between Dorje Shugden and the Dalai Lama."

That was the old Trijang Rinpoche and not the present one Mr dsnowlion.

The previous Trijang Rinpoche lived in India.

The present Trijang Rinpoche fled India out of fear for his life and first moved to Switzerland and now lives in the USA.

The previous Trijang Rinpoche never had bodyguards.

The present Trijang Rinpoche always travels with bodyguards.

Why does the present Trijang Rinpoche need bodyguards??

Could it be YOUR Buddha of Compassion and his ban???

YES!!!!!!

[Questionable]

"I guess to me it is as simple as is the Dalai Lama an emanation of Chenrezig or not. Well, His Holiness Trijang Rinpoche sure thought so because if he did not, why would he write such a thing in his book Music Delighting and predict the situation we are now experiencing and also advised us not to criticize or take sides between Dorje Shugden and the Dalai Lama."

That was the old Trijang Rinpoche and not the present one Mr dsnowlion.

The previous Trijang Rinpoche lived in India.

The present Trijang Rinpoche fled India out of fear for his life and first moved to Switzerland and now lives in the USA.

The previous Trijang Rinpoche never had bodyguards.

The present Trijang Rinpoche always travels with bodyguards.

Why does the present Trijang Rinpoche need bodyguards??

Could it be YOUR Buddha of Compassion and his ban???

YES!!!!!!

Please state your source or show your source for his bodyguards please.

[Harold Musetescu]

Here are some links to youtube videos showing Trijang Rinpoche with his bodyguards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm2orTz269A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ysb1IQir_iE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PONhQbAMK2U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lujBu6xwGIE&t=236s

You didn't answer my question about Pastor Patel removing your question about ME from his blog Questionable.

Cat got your tongue?

[Questionable]

Here are some links to youtube videos showing Trijang Rinpoche with his bodyguards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm2orTz269A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ysb1IQir_iE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PONhQbAMK2U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lujBu6xwGIE&t=236s

You didn't answer my question about Pastor Patel removing your question about ME from his blog Questionable.

Cat got your tongue?

Okay, so you have indeed proven yourself on Rinpoche's bodyguards.

You didn't answer my questions, so why should I answer yours?  I can see Pastor is very fearful of you seeing how this went.

[Harold Musetescu]

Hello Questionable

Strike ONE
"Thank you very much, Harold.
I see indeed I was wrong about Shugdenpa lamas not being in scandals.  My bad."

Strike TWO
"Okay, so you have indeed proven yourself on Rinpoche's bodyguards."

Strike THREE
"You didn't answer my question about Pastor Patel removing your question about ME from his blog Questionable. Cat got your tongue?"

YOUR OUT QUESTIONABLE, YOUR OUT!!!!

 

[Questionable]

Hello Questionable

Strike ONE
"Thank you very much, Harold.
I see indeed I was wrong about Shugdenpa lamas not being in scandals.  My bad."

Strike TWO
"Okay, so you have indeed proven yourself on Rinpoche's bodyguards."

Strike THREE
"You didn't answer my question about Pastor Patel removing your question about ME from his blog Questionable. Cat got your tongue?"

YOUR OUT QUESTIONABLE, YOUR OUT!!!!

 

Interesting.  I never knew this was a game.  Tell me how to play.  I wish to know in that case.

[Harold Musetescu]

"Interesting.  I never knew this was a game.  Tell me how to play.  I wish to know in that case."

Of course you knew that this was a game all along.

You know how this game is played.

If you don't know then ask your anti Dorje Shugden teacher Lama Grigori Tulku Rinpoche from Greece.

Besides I not really interested in playing this game with a little teenage girl which is what you have claimed to be.

Come back and play when your all grown up.

Or just stay on the Dharma Wheel website with your "Global Moderator" Guru.

[Questionable]

"Interesting.  I never knew this was a game.  Tell me how to play.  I wish to know in that case."

Of course you knew that this was a game all along.

You know how this game is played.

If you don't know then ask your anti Dorje Shugden teacher Lama Grigori Tulku Rinpoche from Greece.

Besides I not really interested in playing this game with a little teenage girl which is what you have claimed to be.

Come back and play when your all grown up.

Or just stay on the Dharma Wheel website with your "Global Moderator" Guru.

Grigoris is a lama?

Interesting how you state this lama of his in a negative way.  If that's the case, wouldn't technically every lama that isn't a Shugdenpa be under this category?  The Sakya Trizin, The Dalai Lama, the Karmapa, Garchen Rinpoche, Namkhai Norbu, Lama Dawa Chodak, Jamyang Khyentse Wangpo, Lama Tsultrim Allione, Lama Pema Dorje, Lama Kunga Thartse Rinpoche, Tsultrim Chodron,etc.  You mean to tell me that only Shugden lamas are authentic and the rest will go to hell?  Are you serious?

[Harold Musetescu]

Stop ranting like the little teenage girl you are.

All I did was point out that YOUR teacher Lama Gregoris Tulku Rinpoche the Global Moderator at dharmawheel.net is anti Dorje Shugden.

Suddenly you jump to your idiotic claims about all these other Tulkus who I never mentioned.

So full of hate you are little one.

Want to go for strike FOUR?

Get what you need to get off you chest by sending me a PM.

[Harold Musetescu]

Hello Unquestionable

Strike FOUR against you.

You stated in your last post -

"Interesting how you state this lama of his in a negative way.  If that's the case, wouldn't technically every lama that isn't a Shugdenpa be under this category?  The ........ the Karmapa.......".

Sorry put you are WRONG AGAIN.

The previous and present Karmapas are pro Dorje Shugden unlike your anti Dorje Shugden teacher.

Here is a link to a post I did about the Pro 16 and 17 Karmapas.

http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=6124.0

Harold Musetescu
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 334

"16th Karmapa publicly PRAISED King Dorje Shugden in 1976"

« on: May 17, 2018, 03:05:35 AM »

Quote

We know that the 17th Karmapa has public stated that the then 5th Dalai Lama murdered Karma Kagyu Tulkus and destroyed both their lineages and monasteries.

Were you also aware that the 16th Karmapa was publicly PRO Dorje Shugden?

Here is my link to the story about the 17th Karmapa and what he said at the Kagyu Monlam in 2018.

http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=6035.0

On March 12, 2016 Tsem Tulku wrote an article about how the 16th Karmapa was PRO Dorje Shugden.

It was titled "The Prophecy of the 16th Karmapa".

Here is the link http://www.tsemrinpoche.com/tsem-tulku-rinpoche/great-lamas-masters/the-prophecy-of-the-16th-karmapa.html

His article states that as far back as 1976 the 16th Karmapa had publicly praised King Dorje Shugden.

Here are quotes from Tsem Tulku's article.

Quote
In 1976, His Holiness the 16th Karmapa Rangjung Rigpe Dorje graced the opening of Urgyen Rinpoche’s new monastery called Ka-Nying Shedrub Ling in Nepal and gave a prophetic proclamation. This Nyingma monastery was built on a farmland just north of the ancient and legendary Boudhanath Stupa in Kathmandu...This monastery was built under the guidance and direction of the 16th Karmapa....According to an account in Kyabje Dagom Rinpoche’s collected works (sungbum), the Karmapa came across a statue of Dorje Drolo during an inspection of the new monastery. Dorje Drolo is a wrathful emanation of Guru Rinpoche. This particular image was pressing down upon a smaller figure of a monk with a round hat, under his feet, that resembled the Dharma protector Dorje Shugden. The Karmapa stood in the presence of the statue for a while and then pointed at the statue and asked, “Who is the person that ask for this statue to be made? This isn’t Nyingma nor Sakya, certainly not Gelug and not Kagyu either. I didn’t ask for it to be made! This is not one of the deities you can rely on…”

“Although the time is a little early, in the future you will definitely need to rely on this deity (Dorje Shugden).”– His Holiness 16th Karmapa

The Karmapa was speaking to a line of abbots and masters but nobody came forward to own up. So, the Karmapa ordered for the statue to be removed immediately. A man came up with an axe and a shovel to remove the image. The Lamas who were present would definitely remember this incident and in the account, a seventy-five year old man from Chamdo by the name of Samcho had witnessed this.

This prophecy by His Holiness Karmapa is an unusual one because he had no known history or prior relations to the practice of Dorje Shugden. The Karmapa himself is the head of Karma Kagyu and there is no known history between the Karma Kagyu and the practice of Dorje Shugden either. The prophecy could be indicating that when the political issues surrounding the practice ceases to be, there will be future growth and proliferation of Dorje Shugden’s practice. Karmapa was known for his powerful clairvoyance. When he made such a prediction, it will come true. THE 16TH KRMAPA AND THE CURRENT ONE HAS NEVER MADE ONE NEGATIVE COMMENT ABOUT DORJE SHUGDEN EVER......".

Well "Unquestionable" if my count is right that's SRIKE FOUR.

Thanks for making me look sooooo GOOD and you sooooo DUMB.

 

[Questionable]

Hello Unquestionable

Strike FOUR against you.

You stated in your last post -

"Interesting how you state this lama of his in a negative way.  If that's the case, wouldn't technically every lama that isn't a Shugdenpa be under this category?  The ........ the Karmapa.......".

Sorry put you are WRONG AGAIN.

The previous and present Karmapas are pro Dorje Shugden unlike your anti Dorje Shugden teacher.

Here is a link to a post I did about the Pro 16 and 17 Karmapas.

http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=6124.0

Harold Musetescu
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 334

"16th Karmapa publicly PRAISED King Dorje Shugden in 1976"

« on: May 17, 2018, 03:05:35 AM »

Quote

We know that the 17th Karmapa has public stated that the then 5th Dalai Lama murdered Karma Kagyu Tulkus and destroyed both their lineages and monasteries.

Were you also aware that the 16th Karmapa was publicly PRO Dorje Shugden?

Here is my link to the story about the 17th Karmapa and what he said at the Kagyu Monlam in 2018.

http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=6035.0

On March 12, 2016 Tsem Tulku wrote an article about how the 16th Karmapa was PRO Dorje Shugden.

It was titled "The Prophecy of the 16th Karmapa".

Here is the link http://www.tsemrinpoche.com/tsem-tulku-rinpoche/great-lamas-masters/the-prophecy-of-the-16th-karmapa.html

His article states that as far back as 1976 the 16th Karmapa had publicly praised King Dorje Shugden.

Here are quotes from Tsem Tulku's article.

Quote
In 1976, His Holiness the 16th Karmapa Rangjung Rigpe Dorje graced the opening of Urgyen Rinpoche’s new monastery called Ka-Nying Shedrub Ling in Nepal and gave a prophetic proclamation. This Nyingma monastery was built on a farmland just north of the ancient and legendary Boudhanath Stupa in Kathmandu...This monastery was built under the guidance and direction of the 16th Karmapa....According to an account in Kyabje Dagom Rinpoche’s collected works (sungbum), the Karmapa came across a statue of Dorje Drolo during an inspection of the new monastery. Dorje Drolo is a wrathful emanation of Guru Rinpoche. This particular image was pressing down upon a smaller figure of a monk with a round hat, under his feet, that resembled the Dharma protector Dorje Shugden. The Karmapa stood in the presence of the statue for a while and then pointed at the statue and asked, “Who is the person that ask for this statue to be made? This isn’t Nyingma nor Sakya, certainly not Gelug and not Kagyu either. I didn’t ask for it to be made! This is not one of the deities you can rely on…”

“Although the time is a little early, in the future you will definitely need to rely on this deity (Dorje Shugden).”– His Holiness 16th Karmapa

The Karmapa was speaking to a line of abbots and masters but nobody came forward to own up. So, the Karmapa ordered for the statue to be removed immediately. A man came up with an axe and a shovel to remove the image. The Lamas who were present would definitely remember this incident and in the account, a seventy-five year old man from Chamdo by the name of Samcho had witnessed this.

This prophecy by His Holiness Karmapa is an unusual one because he had no known history or prior relations to the practice of Dorje Shugden. The Karmapa himself is the head of Karma Kagyu and there is no known history between the Karma Kagyu and the practice of Dorje Shugden either. The prophecy could be indicating that when the political issues surrounding the practice ceases to be, there will be future growth and proliferation of Dorje Shugden’s practice. Karmapa was known for his powerful clairvoyance. When he made such a prediction, it will come true. THE 16TH KRMAPA AND THE CURRENT ONE HAS NEVER MADE ONE NEGATIVE COMMENT ABOUT DORJE SHUGDEN EVER......".

Well "Unquestionable" if my count is right that's SRIKE FOUR.

Thanks for making me look sooooo GOOD and you sooooo DUMB.

 

I mean the present Karmapas, not the previous one. Yes, I am aware that he supported Shugden, but our Oracle seems to not be giving us the answer to this(so let's make a statement demanding who the real Karmapa is).

While I have 4 strikes, how many do you have?  You have made so many posts with ridiculous unsubstantiated claims of one of the Bamo Sam being an emanations of Red Tara, it seems that is is YOU who has more strikes.

Please look in the mirror, your arrogance, ignorance, and wrath are once again rising.  For the time, take up Avaloliteshvara's practice please before going on to protectors.  You clearly need to destroy your self-ego.