Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview

[michaela]

This forum post was originally started in August 2018. At the time, many people were still convinced that the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje would return to India in November to attend the all-important Buddhist conference. We know now that it did not happen. The Karmapa Ogyen Trinley has become a Dominican Republic citizen and he was refused visa to enter India by the Indian government. It does not look like the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley will be returning to India any time soon.

[Alex]

Karmapa will not return to India. There is no benefit for him to return to India because it will be his prison once again. The CTA will probably pull some nasty stunts to trap him again and strip him of his freedom and his rights. CTA is desperate to have a successor to His Holiness because they need a person that has the power and fame to control over the Tibetans when His Holiness is no longer around anymore. Karmapa is the next best choice. Karmapa Thaye Dorje is ignoring them, and even Karmapa Ogyen Trinley is abandoning the CTA. Why would Karmapa Ogyen Trinley risk his own life and freedom and return to India when he is not required to do so? He is perfectly fine staying overseas and doing his duty as the Karmapa.

I think it is a good idea for him to not come back and risk his life. He is finally able to taste freedom after being shackled by the CTA for so many years and he should not throw this opportunity away.

[Tracy]

First, the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley complained about not being able to learn from great masters and teach Dharma. He was depressed because he didn't get to do what he is supposed to do as a Lama. He was also complaining about how he was made to get involved in politics which he hates.

The next thing he did was to run away from the CTA and India. Will he go back to India? I don't think so, who wants to be under the control of the CTA and made to do what they don't wish especially something that does not bring benefits to people. It is really embarrassing for the CTA that even their high lama is running away from them.

More and more Tibetans are losing their confidence in the CTA. They finally realise that the CTA is incapable, will not be able to fulfill their promise to the Tibetans and they are not able to give a better future to the Tibetans. As a result, more Tibetans are now leaving the exile community in India.

[Alex]

First, the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley complained about not being able to learn from great masters and teach Dharma. He was depressed because he didn't get to do what he is supposed to do as a Lama. He was also complaining about how he was made to get involved in politics which he hates.

The next thing he did was to run away from the CTA and India. Will he go back to India? I don't think so, who wants to be under the control of the CTA and made to do what they don't wish especially something that does not bring benefits to people. It is really embarrassing for the CTA that even their high lama is running away from them.

More and more Tibetans are losing their confidence in the CTA. They finally realise that the CTA is incapable, will not be able to fulfill their promise to the Tibetans and they are not able to give a better future to the Tibetans. As a result, more Tibetans are now leaving the exile community in India.

This is just another strong proof that anyone who is related to Tibetan government will suffer and become worst. They never help people to be better and they will only drag people down. That is why it is a wise choice for Karmapa Thaye Dorje to avoid them at the Monlam Festival. It is proven that all of the people who joined CTA will not end up well in a good position.

Now that Karmapa Ogyen Trinley had left CTA, there will be no one leading the Tibetans after His Holiness the Dalai Lama has passed away. That is why CTA is in a panicking mode now and trying to get whoever they can get their hands on.

Their effort of approaching Karmapa Thaye Dorje is clearly a desperate one. They rejected him before and even refused to give him ordination when he was first being recognized as the Karmapa. Why would they think that he will agree to help them back?

[Drolma]

First, the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley complained about not being able to learn from great masters and teach Dharma. He was depressed because he didn't get to do what he is supposed to do as a Lama. He was also complaining about how he was made to get involved in politics which he hates.

The next thing he did was to run away from the CTA and India. Will he go back to India? I don't think so, who wants to be under the control of the CTA and made to do what they don't wish especially something that does not bring benefits to people. It is really embarrassing for the CTA that even their high lama is running away from them.

More and more Tibetans are losing their confidence in the CTA. They finally realise that the CTA is incapable, will not be able to fulfill their promise to the Tibetans and they are not able to give a better future to the Tibetans. As a result, more Tibetans are now leaving the exile community in India.

The Karmapa Ogyen Trinley will be stupid to go back to India and be controlled by the CTA again. Fortunately, he is wise and he knows what game the CTA is playing. It was not easy to escape from the CTA, he certainly will not go back.

Between China and India, I think it will be better for Karmapa Ogyen Trinley to go back to China if the Chinese government allows him to go back. China has a better infrastructure and facility to preserve and spread Dharma. Since Karmapa Ogyen Trinley is also recognised by China and he has a lot of followers in China, he should go back. The other Karmapa can spread Dharma to people outside of China.

For Gelug tradition, they have the Dalai Lama spreading Gelug lineage outside of China and they have the Panchen Lama preserving Buddhism in China, it is actually a brilliant arrangement. Perhaps this will be the strategy of the Karmapas as well. One Karmapa will go back to China and one will remain outside of China. After all, it is not easy for the lamas to travel in and out of China.

[Tracy]

The Karmapa Ogyen Trinley will be stupid to go back to India and be controlled by the CTA again. Fortunately, he is wise and he knows what game the CTA is playing. It was not easy to escape from the CTA, he certainly will not go back.

Between China and India, I think it will be better for Karmapa Ogyen Trinley to go back to China if the Chinese government allows him to go back. China has a better infrastructure and facility to preserve and spread Dharma. Since Karmapa Ogyen Trinley is also recognised by China and he has a lot of followers in China, he should go back. The other Karmapa can spread Dharma to people outside of China.

For Gelug tradition, they have the Dalai Lama spreading Gelug lineage outside of China and they have the Panchen Lama preserving Buddhism in China, it is actually a brilliant arrangement. Perhaps this will be the strategy of the Karmapas as well. One Karmapa will go back to China and one will remain outside of China. After all, it is not easy for the lamas to travel in and out of China.

You are right to say the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley is clever not to go back to India. If he goes back to India, he will be controlled by the CTA again. This time, the control from the CTA will be tighter than before, it will be a real prison for him.

To the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley, it doesn't matter where he goes. What he wants is to be able to spread Dharma to benefit people. He will go wherever he is needed or wherever he can benefit people. He is a real Dharma practitioner because what matters to him is to benefit people.

 It will be good if he goes back to China because many people there need Dharma and they are hungry for Dharma. He will be able to train good quality Dharma teachers in China too. But again, we will never know his plan but one thing for sure is, he will continue to benefit all sentient beings.

[Alex]

You are right to say the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley is clever not to go back to India. If he goes back to India, he will be controlled by the CTA again. This time, the control from the CTA will be tighter than before, it will be a real prison for him.

To the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley, it doesn't matter where he goes. What he wants is to be able to spread Dharma to benefit people. He will go wherever he is needed or wherever he can benefit people. He is a real Dharma practitioner because what matters to him is to benefit people.

 It will be good if he goes back to China because many people there need Dharma and they are hungry for Dharma. He will be able to train good quality Dharma teachers in China too. But again, we will never know his plan but one thing for sure is, he will continue to benefit all sentient beings.

Yes, I agree with you. Karmapa Ogyen Trinley should not go back to India because he is going back to a trap. CTA has not been treating him well for the past two decades, and they will not treat him any better if he returns to their side. He is lucky to be able to escape from their clutches one year ago, and he should not repeat the same mistake.

CTA is dying to get him on their side and use him to manipulate the poor ignorant Tibetans who blindly follow whatever their government says. CTA needs a high lama to use as a puppet to exert the control onto their people. Since His Holiness the Dalai Lama is getting old, and he can pass away anytime, CTA needs to have someone on standby to take over.

The Karmapa will be the best choice and CTA will surely jump on him on any opportunities they have. They have tried to snatch Karmapa Thaye Dorje onto their side, but fortunately, Karmapa Thaye Dorje is smart enough to avoid them. No one ever gets better when CTA is associated with them. They are like a curse to whoever that joins them on their sinking boat.

[Drolma]

Where is Karmapa Ogyen Trinley now and what is he doing? The other Karmapa went to Europe with the family and he brought his baby son along. It was almost like bringing the baby Sharmapa to meet all their followers. We can see that all the students hold the baby very dear.

This is an indication that the baby is not an ordinary baby. It is highly possible he is the reincarnation of Sharmapa. The Dharma work of the 'white' Karmapa seems to be growing and he is getting more exposure. But the 'Indian' Karmapa is so quiet. Not much news about him.

Everyone is very curious about the future of the Karma Kagyu lineage. After the two Karmapa have met up, what's next? The 'India' Karmapa was involved in a sex scandal, how is the issue now? So many questions to answer but yet no one is answering.

[Tracy]

Where is Karmapa Ogyen Trinley now and what is he doing? The other Karmapa went to Europe with the family and he brought his baby son along. It was almost like bringing the baby Sharmapa to meet all their followers. We can see that all the students hold the baby very dear.

This is an indication that the baby is not an ordinary baby. It is highly possible he is the reincarnation of Sharmapa. The Dharma work of the 'white' Karmapa seems to be growing and he is getting more exposure. But the 'Indian' Karmapa is so quiet. Not much news about him.

Everyone is very curious about the future of the Karma Kagyu lineage. After the two Karmapa have met up, what's next? The 'India' Karmapa was involved in a sex scandal, how is the issue now? So many questions to answer but yet no one is answering.

The two Karmapas have jointly written a long life prayer for Sharmapa Rinpoche, isn't it a great news? The two Karmapas have put their differences aside and work together to reunite the Kagyupas. They have set a very good examples for the Tibetans. Power and money is not everything, it is more important to maintain peace and harmony if we want to improve and ensure the continuity of a tradition. The CTA has to learn from the Karmapas.