promoting goodness

[honeydakini]

I've been looking on YouTube videos and websites of Dorje Shugden recently and it is more and more apparent that 90% of the information out there is not about Dorje Shugden but about DorjeShugden vs Dalai Lama.

Mostly, it is about all the wrong things that the Dalai Lama is doing, the ban, the protests, the politics, the speeches, the letters, the court cases... ad nauseum!!

When I first started hearing about the dorje shugden issue and I tried to look for information about DS himself, I couldn't find very much so I kinda just gave up really quickly, not wishing to get too much into the politics of it at the time because I found it way too complicated and overwhelming.

I know I've said this a million times before but... bear with me.

Yes, it IS important to have this information up and to raise awareness of what is really happening, how people are suffering and impacted by the ban, and how these actions decreed by DL and his govt are having severe and detrimental effects. However, there seems to be a big vacuum on "the other side" that is: what is so GOOD or BENEFICIAL about Dorje Shugden and his practice that we would want to "fight" this cause and maintain our practices and devotion to him?

Newer people, or the world at large who we are trying to call for support, may be inclined to think, "okay, so this ban by DL is not good but so what? What's so GOOD about Dorje Shugden that's making this such a big hullabaloo and making people react to the ban so strongly?"

At the moment, the tone of the talk / writings/ videos / information & resources about Dorje Shugden seem to be mostly in the context of what the Dalai Lama is doing wrong wrong wrong all the time, which can come across as rather bleak, depressing or negative.

I'd like to call for a more positive stance to bring more balance - Consider questions like:
- what are the benefits of Dorje Shugden practice?
- Who are the great lamas who practice him and what incredible work are they doing to spread the Dharma?
- What personal benefits have you gained in your spiritual path through your practice and devotion to Dorje Shugden?
- why would a new person want to practice Dorje Shugden?
- what is the essence of Dorje Shugden's practice?
- What are the qualities that he embodies? What qualities do we develop by our sincere our practice?
 
I also especially like what the admin has suggested that we do about promoting Dorje Shugden here:
http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=19.0

I think that'd be much more uplifting, positive and inspirational than merely going on and on and on and on solely about Dalai Lama and what is being done/ not being done. What do you all think?

[WisdomBeing]

Dear Dakini..

You really are a Dakini. i hope this thread will be a refreshing change from the 'debates' on other threads. Not that debates are not good, but that we often don't see the forest for the trees.

The benefits of Shugden practice are really tremendous however i'm wondering if it's within the scope of this forum to discuss. Perhaps we could request from the admin to post it up once we get enough feedback from the forumites

Let me kick off by saying that my Guru told me that Shugden practice will always bring resources when we need it. Especially if our motivation is good. Shugden is really the wish-fulfillng jewel. So far in my experience, i have always found great security in Shugden.

What about yourself HDakini?


love
K

[honeydakini]

kate,
definitely that DS brings us what we need for our practices - whether it's material, or even emotional (e.g. we get support, or it helps us to gain more confidence in our practices.) It's hard to explain, but i do find that when I am more "good" about my practice (i.e. I spend more time doing offerings and doing my whole kangsol properly), I find my work goes much smoother and I am able to think more clearly in whatever I am working on at the time. I find also that as Dorje Shugden is one with Manjushri, relying on him and doing his practice has helped me a lot in my own work which requires much writing, composition and creativity. The ideas come better if I have been doing my practices well and focus well and sincerely.

i also remember reading that the entourage of Dorje Shugden are emanations of DS himself - the 9 mothers, the 8 guiding monks and the 10 assistants are ALL DORJE SHUGDEN, which means the entire mandala is 150% super charged enlightened energy. Rock on! So relying on Dorje Shugden and taking refuge in him is entirely safe and does help us create that direct connection with the enlightened mind. Anything we do in relation to Dorje Shugden and his entourage creates the causes for us to attain that same wisdom mind... which i find very exciting! If nothing else (or if that is perhaps a bit too esoteric for some to swallow), I find it very helpful just to study and contemplate on the verses of the kangsol (prayers) or praises, which speak of the enlightened qualities of DS and give us much guidance as to the direction of our own practices.

So yeah, sometimes it's slow. It's not like a miraculous overnight transformation and there are days that I think DS must want to get up and slap me around the head (when it's late, when I haven't done my daily prayers and am falling asleep in front of my altar) but the benefits come gradually if you are consistent and always when you least expect it - a nice surprise! I find for example that in the middle of writing a particularly difficult passage for example, I sometimes need to only think of Dorje Shugden, to have a much clearer mind, a different perspective and the words to write with.

I'm excited about this thread and hope many more people will share their own experiences

[a friend]

To the 2 dakinis here: very beautiful, very nice to be able to describe your own experience. Thank you for telling your personal tale.
It´s a difficult thing to talk about a Dharma practice, about your spiritual experiences, and unusual too. Anything you say could be taken as flaunting some personal realization, which is a no-no in our system. The only thing I dare say is that He is inseparable from my Guru and that sometimes I realize that he truly is there "like the shadow of my body", even though 99% of the time I am dumb enough not to recognize it. But that 1% when I realize it then I just can´t believe that yes, he is always there with his oceanic compassion and deep love. Boy it helps to go on with life, practice, even when it is not easy!

About the abundance in the internet of discussions about DL this and DL that ... There are several things to say about this. I have the feeling that some among you are too young to have experienced what really happened, and you probably didn´t meet with those giants that came from the Land of Snows, our Lamas, and don´t know exactly what was done to them, to the lineage, and what they thought and felt about it. We the oldies, or at least some among us, were witnesses, we know some things that we are not going to try to express because it´s enough shame to have to repeat what you see there: he did this, he did that. It´s horrible to have to do this, to have to point to what somebody did wrong.
It´s funny how life is. When you newbies arrived at this Forum, this old a friend was suggesting to tone down some things, and trying to suggest people to forget about "DL did this or DL did that" as much as possible, particularly now that Shar Ganden and Serpom seem secure. But when you came here with your niceties about DL, forgive the sincerity, then again we were forced to talk to reestablish some sensible expression of conventional reality, and some people were forced to grab their strongest verbal expressions to make themselves understood by you. So in a way the opposite result was obtained. It´s true that your coming here was also useful because we were able to say some things in the context of Dharma that had not been said previously, since we had not experienced the need for saying them. So this was positive.
About the rest of the internet, I don't go myself to other places to dispute with people that do not look for information but just defend the point of view of their leader without any personal investigation. But I understand the WSS people that go around and try to compensate the lies, the misinformation being spread, with their own discourse. I don´t have time to do what they do, but I respect that they do it.

I am all for remaining silent about DL. With two conditions: that he´s not again attacking our communities and that other people are not trying to give justifications for the ban (for the reasons that I already stated ad nauseam). Other people think differently, they prefer to keep on reminding the world what he has done. Their arguments are good so I'm not going to say that they are wrong.

[mika]

Actually, I don't have any idea what is going on with the politics things between dalai lama and dorje shugden. I don't get it - how can a Dharma teacher be having a fight with a deity? It just doesn't make any sense - sounds like something out of a mangga!!!! Call me naive but I just ain't never interested in all this kinda stuff. And most of the time I just find it too confusing and way too tiring to keep up. I guess I understand that for some people that might be so much a part of their practice tho so it's kinda hard to separate the two. i tried reading a few of the postings but it got really confusing. I couldn't really tell what "this side" or "that side" meant or how anything really tied up with each other. How would u even start to understand it!

I know honeydakini (my friend also) doesn't like all this stuff but she still has a big mouth so she likes to talk a lot haha but I must say i appreciate postings like this. I like to hear the personal stories because it's something i can relate to - or hope to relate to in future anyway (if i practice properly!) i like that post about the nuclear masters or something. I like stories - but also to know that they're not just stories but real. Something to work towards

peace, everyone!

[WisdomBeing]

Dear A Friend,

Thank you for your sharing. I must say it resonated with me deeply and made me pause. I guess it is because i feel you speaking from your heart and that touches me. Yes I do know that i'm a real young chicken in this issue - though I'm learning as fast as i can. Thank goodness for the resources available in websites like this where i am SURE that a group of people has spent thousands of hours collating the information because of their love for Dorje Shugden. Maybe it's not even a group but just one or two guys beavering away in their garage. Whoever they are - much gratitude and may they receive the blessings of Dorje Shugden for their hard work to continuously provide a resource for people like us.

Anyway, I digress.

I have learned too that I have to respect what you and others have gone through and suffered as a result of the Dalai Lama's actions. TK's posting was quite an eye opener for me when she or he said that you should continue to express yourselves. TK is right. Everyone should express how they wish to, from where they come from - with the right motivation, which i believe you and others like Lhakpa Gyaltshen do.

On a personal level, I don't like how the WSS function and I don't like the tone of their book, 'A great deception', but i would still recommend people to read it to gain a different perspective. I also think they should continue to do what they are doing (their protests etc) because they are drawing attention to Dorje Shugden and as Brendan Behan said, "There is no such thing as bad publicity". From what i see on youtube, the WSS protests are very ordered, peaceful and non-violent, it is other parties which wreak havoc..

I am always heartened when I think of what was posted by Thomas Canada regarding what he heard from Kache Marpo who said that Dorje Shugden followers would never be able to find the financial resources to propagate DS throughout the world to an extent as it is happening now with the controversy. So he seemed quite happy about the ‘publicity’. If Dorje Shugden is happy, I am very happy!

Anyway, TK says we're on the same side, with the same lineage and the same practices and the same Protector. I agree.

I just wanted to say I very much enjoyed this post of yours which gave me more insight, and I hope we can continue to interact in this vein as I would like to learn more.

I wish you well and much happiness.

Love,
Kate

[thor]

Actually, I don't have any idea what is going on with the politics things between dalai lama and dorje shugden. I don't get it - how can a Dharma teacher be having a fight with a deity? It just doesn't make any sense - sounds like something out of a mangga!!!! Call me naive but I just ain't never interested in all this kinda stuff. And most of the time I just find it too confusing and way too tiring to keep up. I guess I understand that for some people that might be so much a part of their practice tho so it's kinda hard to separate the two. i tried reading a few of the postings but it got really confusing. I couldn't really tell what "this side" or "that side" meant or how anything really tied up with each other. How would u even start to understand it!

I know honeydakini (my friend also) doesn't like all this stuff but she still has a big mouth so she likes to talk a lot haha but I must say i appreciate postings like this. I like to hear the personal stories because it's something i can relate to - or hope to relate to in future anyway (if i practice properly!) i like that post about the nuclear masters or something. I like stories - but also to know that they're not just stories but real. Something to work towards

peace, everyone!

Hey mika,

don't concern yourself overmuch with the controversy or the different sides. Best to concentrate now on the basic principles of Buddhism before you venture into deeper waters. This forum is a friendly place where you can ask more questions and you will definitely get an answer!

[harrynephew]

Dear All,

I totally agree with Honeydakini with her points and her vision, we've got a direction going here:) which is good. In the spirit of Buddhism, the result of our practice shows in our daily life and how we carry things and messages in order to benefit ourselves and others. Let's focus on how to make the practice of DS bigger and mightier.

The Lamas of the lineage have already set themselves in place by doing their thing. let us support people out there who need to know more about DS and proliferate the teachings from here.....

to the world!!!

cheers
HN

[a friend]

Thank you Kate for your considerate, kind answer.
Happy Full Moon of Lord Buddha´s Miracles!

The advertising approach made me smile I have to say.
Our personal feelings are of no importance. Our Lamas, the lineage, what was destroyed that could´ve been there for sentient beings, those are things that should not be overlooked. That should not be given to the world as if it had been some type of wonderful happy event. But enough of that.

Today is a happy day and yes, we belong all of us to one side: the side of our Buddhas and the side of all our mother sentient beings without exception, and the side of our pure teachings of Ganden Mountain. The Protector is always going to protect this, even a speck of pure intention, even the smallest effort made with a pure heart.

Thank you.

[honeydakini]

Thank you Kate for your considerate, kind answer.
Happy Full Moon of Lord Buddha´s Miracles!

The advertising approach made me smile I have to say.
Our personal feelings are of no importance. Our Lamas, the lineage, what was destroyed that could´ve been there for sentient beings, those are things that should not be overlooked. That should not be given to the world as if it had been some type of wonderful happy event. But enough of that.

Today is a happy day and yes, we belong all of us to one side: the side of our Buddhas and the side of all our mother sentient beings without exception, and the side of our pure teachings of Ganden Mountain. The Protector is always going to protect this, even a speck of pure intention, even the smallest effort made with a pure heart.

Thank you.

What a nice post! Thank you friend I'm rather happy about this happy thread! (that sounds trite, i know, but...)

I understand what you are saying about how we must not overlook what has been destroyed and what could have been there for sentient beings, which are now not. However, what is emerging on a parallel are the incredibly strong masters and their centres/ monasteries all around the world that are bouncing back stronger than ever and keeping the lineages and practices very much alive. There is criticism from the dalai lama / Tibetan camp that the westerners or non-tibetans are defiling the practices / we don't know what we're doing ad nauseum, but I beg to differ - i think that in many ways, the non-tibetan practitioners are working very well with the existing wonderful of teachers of old Tibet. We don't bring in all the cluttered hundreds of years of politics, or cultural references which could confuse the actual practices... giving us the chance to well, actually practice! (i hope)

I have observed that no matter how badly things get for the lamas, they arise stronger than ever and it never dampens their faith in the practice. That is the most wonderful and important thing to be preserved! The buildings, the monasteries and even the statues (sob) which were so mercilessly destroyed saddens me so much... but then again, I take heart when I see the practitioners, who hold everything that the buildings, monasteries and statues represent in their mind and practice. They are the real meaning of the buildings, the monasteries and the statues. they are the real meaning of dorje shugden.

Like you so beautifully said, "The Protector is always going to protect this, even a speck of pure intention, even the smallest effort made with a pure heart." And with lamas, centres and ardent practitioners like these, you can be certain that DS will be around for a long time yet! New buildings, monasteries, centres, altars, images will arise, and with an even greater passion, sincerity and faith than ever before.
 

[a friend]

Dear Honeydakini,

Thank you for your words. Let´s share in your optimism and do whatever we can to justify it!

It´s curious that you thought of buildings and sacred objects ... I´d forgotten that many of those were destroyed too ... Some of those can be somehow replaced. Other things, not.
But today let´s only think of the future, and join Lord Je Tsongkhapa in his prayers of dedication, like the ones he utters at the end of his Praise to the Buddha:

Since it is through the great kindness of a Lama
That one even meets with such teachings
Revealed by the consummate Teacher,
I dedicate the virtue of composing this work
to all beings without exception.
May it serve as a cause for them to be taken
Under the care of holy spiritual guides.

May the teachings of the One who only benefits others
Remain undisturbed by the winds of bad thoughts,
until samsara's end.
And may the world always be filled with beings
who have gained faith in the Master
Through achieving correct understanding
of his teaching system.

In all my future lives,
even at the cost of life or limb,
May I never stop or for a single moment slacken
In upholding this, the Muni's excellent system,
that clarifies the true nature of dependent arising.

[Lee Dhi]

Dear HoneyDakini,

Mission accomplished! Your new posting has certainly added a more uplifting, positive and inspirational angle to the discussions. Although I must thank all the other individuals who have kindly and with great effort contributed to the contents of this website, making it one of the most informative, comprehensive and well-supported website about DS I have come across!

I am extremely blessed to have my Guru and Dorje Shugden in my life. My Guru is is a living example that compassion and wisdom can be practiced every moment with every person despite the most testing situations. Through my, still extremely basic, practice Dorje Shugden, I have been blessed with greater peace and consideration for others. Even as I reflect on the gift i have received from my Guru and DS, I am so overwhelmed by deep gratitude that I will never be able to repay.

I pray that more and more people will have the good karma to meet a Guru and have the blessing to receive Dorje Shugden practice.

[harrynephew]

Yes!

we should all strive to promote the goodness of DS and in turn set the wheel of Dharma turning forever in the tradition of Lama Tsongkhapa!

The trainees who walk in your footsteps
Breath the fresh air of the Great Way.
They would die for the good of the world.
Hence I sing this praise to you of Ganden Mountain.

Anyone who disparages your doctrine must face
The terrible wrath of the Dharma protectors.
O Tsongkhapa, who abides in truth's power,
I sing this praise to you of Ganden Mountain.

may the songs of praises to gaden mountain be forever sung!

[Big Uncle]

Thank you HoneyDakini for a refreshing post. I too would like to share my experiences of Dorje Shugden. I have been soliciting Dorje Shugden's divine assistance for almost 6 years now. I am not exactly the picture of a perfect practitioner as I lapse in my devotion to my teacher at times and sometimes my schedule encroaches upon my daily prayers and mantras. However from Dorje Shugden's side, he never fails to help me even when I am down and when I really need help (Read: Desperate). I don't come from a background where I believe that the Buddha's exist easily but I have witnessed many times how he has helped to transform my worst situations into a completely uplifting one. I am completely amazed and to think, I didn't really believe he existed in the first place. I just did my practice because my own teacher told me to. You know, seeing Lama's compassion and teachings conjoined with Dorje Shugden's assistance, I am slowly but surely believing that the Buddhas do exists. That Lama Tsongkhapa, Yamantaka, Vajrayogini, Manjushri, Pelden Lhamo and all the other yidams and protectors must exist too because Dorje Shugden exists.

[Lee Dhi]

A little more goodness to promote: Guru Devotion.

We have this saying, MIND OVER MATTER. This saying has survived the trial of time. So it should be valid to interpret that our mind plays a primary role in our lives: determining our views, experiences, actions, feelings etc.

Since a spiritual Guru is the one who gives us knowledge to transform our minds in our efforts to reach the ultimate goal of enlightenment. Would it not be valid to state that our Guru is a very important individual in our lives?

He teaches all the good virtues and does everything possible: teaching, encouraging, scolding, bribing…everything…so that we practice Dharma purely. Our Guru does not only focus on this lifetime, he is working with us to protect us in our future lives.

Everything he or she passes to us is purely for our benefit. Therefore, on a basic humanly level, not yet taking into consideration spiritual reasons, we must have deep gratitude and devotion to our kind Guru(s) and:

•   Return his love by being kind to others.
•   Serve others as our Guru has served us by imparting the Dharma upon us.

We are not fortunate enough (mostly due to our own Karma) to meet a Buddha in this lifetime and, even if we did meet Buddha Shyakamuni 2500 years ago, we did not manage to overcome our self-grasping, self-cherishing and ignorance to gain enlightenment then. Therefore, we rely on our kind Gurus to pass on the pure teachings of Lord Buddha to us. This is the reason why, in Tibetan Buddhism, taking refuge in the Guru is more important than any other refuge.

Our Guru is present to correct us should we develop any misunderstanding of the Dharma. He/She is also there to seize any regression we make in our Dharma practice. In many cases (especially in cases of Resident Lama, i.e Lama who has a permanent home in a particular country), the Guru “personalizes” the teachings to best fit his/her student for their Dharma growth. A Guru also protects a student’s stable faith in the Dharma.

There are countless other things a Guru does to benefit the Dharma growth of spiritual students. In return, all we need to do is develop our minds for our own benefit and the benefit of other. If we are not devoted to such a Guru to ensure that his/her teachings prosper and touch as many individuals as possible, who else should we logically and spiritually devote our precious human life to?

The above are my understanding of a Dharma teaching from a video <Guru for Hire, Enlightenment for Sale>, which ignited within me the experience of GOODNESS that still exists in this world. If I made any error in my statement, I sincerely apologize to Spiritual Guide, Tsem Tulku Rinpoche, from whom I was so fortunate to receive this teaching.