Kangso, Who's who?

[Mohani]

Hi friends,
Every time I do Kangso some questions come up for me about the various deities.
I use the Tharpa Kangso.
Does anyone know who the four Tathagatas Rinchen Mang, Sug Dze Dampa, Ku Jam La and Jigpa Tamcha Dang Dralwa are. Their names come up in a praise in the 'Giving the torma to the local guardians' section.

Are they the four Great Kings (with different names)who live half way up Mount Meru?

Alexis do you know? I remember you saying you helped to translate a Kangso with the guidance of Dagom Rinpoche.

Cheers,

[Mohani]

Thanks Alexis,
It's nice to see the meaning of their names.. Do you know if that translation is available these days?

[DSFriend]

Alexis, thank you for the information.

[Big Uncle]

Mohani,

I just know the english (translated) names from David Molk's translation, not the meaning or who they are. They could very well, as you have said, be the buddha names of the four gardians. That would be very logical.

"Hommage to the tathagata Many Jeweled One.
 Hommage to the tathagata Supreme Beautiful Form
 Hommage to the tathagata Infinite Bodied One.
 Hommage to the tathagata Free From All Fear." p. 44

Thank you for the translations but I don't think it is the four guardians as they are not Buddhas or Tathagatas yet. My feelings is that they are epithets for Buddhas we already know. Anybody else know?

[Lineageholder]

Thank you for the translations but I don't think it is the four guardians as they are not Buddhas or Tathagatas yet. My feelings is that they are epithets for Buddhas we already know. Anybody else know?

I think it is four guardians, envisaged as Buddhas.  The offerings are made at the point in the sadhana where we make offerings to the local and regional guardians, but I don't know for sure so if anyone else can shed light on this, it would be helpful 

[honeydakini]

If I am not mistaken, I remember someone once telling me these names  are epithets/ correspond to Manjushri, Avalokiteshvara and Vajrapani - i.e. Tsongkhapa. I can't remember which name corresponds with which Buddha or how, but I do distinctly remember there being a link with these three Bodhisattvas. I am not 100% sure on this though, so would appreciate any other thoughts or info.

[thor]

HD, you're right

Rinchen Mang = Shakyamuni
Sug Dze Dampa = Chenrezig
Ku Jam La = Manjushri
Jigpa Tamcha Dang = Vajrapani

These are from my notes during a commentary on Dorje Shugden's kangsol given by my teacher sometime back ~ 2 years ago

[Midakpa]

Shakyamuni doesn't wear jewels. What does "many jeweled one" really mean?

[WisdomBeing]

Shakyamuni doesn't wear jewels. What does "many jeweled one" really mean?

I understand 'jeweled' to mean 'endowed with the qualities of Enlightenment' or 'endowed with the Three Jewels of Buddha, Dharma and Sangha'.

[crazycloud]

I'm sorry, I think this is incorrect. The prostrations tho these four "tathagatas" comes during the section on making torma offerings to the local guardians. They are referred to as tathagatas because this pleases them and creates auspiciousness.

[Zach]

4 gaurdians ? Hmmm im just looking up at the feild of merit as i type at at the base of the tree there are 4 protector gaurdians, any connection perhapes ? 

[DharmaDefender]

Shakyamuni doesn't wear jewels. What does "many jeweled one" really mean?

I understand 'jeweled' to mean 'endowed with the qualities of Enlightenment' or 'endowed with the Three Jewels of Buddha, Dharma and Sangha'.

I would've understood it to mean attainment of the Six Paramitas? Seems to fit the idea of 'many jewelled' better hehe I suppose ultimately, both are the same?

[Mohani]

Dear Zach,

They are the 'Four Great Kings' on the bottom of the tree.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Heavenly_Kings

[Zach]

Dear Zach,

They are the 'Four Great Kings' on the bottom of the tree.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Heavenly_Kings

Okay maybe of no connection what so ever then 

[honeydakini]

Shakyamuni doesn't wear jewels. What does "many jeweled one" really mean?

I understand 'jeweled' to mean 'endowed with the qualities of Enlightenment' or 'endowed with the Three Jewels of Buddha, Dharma and Sangha'.

I understand that the symbology of jewels in Buddhist imagery stands to reflect the enlightened qualities they embody. for bodhisattvas in particular, the 6 ornaments that they are adorned with correspond to the 6 paramitas. Am not sure if this is the case for Shakyamuni also though?