The Future of the Gelugpa Vajrayana Lineage

[brian]

What Geshela have been doing is wonderful! i read his books before i believe in Buddhism. In many ways i found his way of teaching is easy to understand and no wonder Geshela has a lot of centers all thru the western world. Geshela's influence is very strong in the west and even when Geshela has retired, the tradition in NKT goes on and it is great that Geshela has founded a great set of westerners in Buddhism and i believe NKT will grow even stronger and Geshela has created a legacy in the west where many will find it hard to emulate.

[Ensapa]

on NKT, perhaps their current model suits their purpose and their needs best as without a doubt, Geshe Keslang would have already tailored it to suit the dispositions of the western students. The system he established in NKT is very similar to the one in Ganden monastery, where the head abbot retires and the next one takes over. GKG has retired already and NKT has a new spiritual head now. GKG is more or less empowering more and more westerners to partake the Dharma and to become real lineage holders, so i doubt he needs to ever return back to CTA ever as they are already rock solid on their own.

What GKG did by creating a new system for NKT is revolutionary and inspiring! Despite the ban when it first started and the amount of threats and pressure and difficulty he had to face, yet Geshela still managed to spread the Dharma... i believe that is how Dorje Shugden has helped Him and NKT

He has created a new tradition where he created his own Dharma teachers within the western pupils and to me this is continuing the lineage... Tsongkhapa's lineage is not just for Tibetans... and I believe more are doing so... where the lineage is passed on to the locals which I find beautiful and this is called growth/expansion. So there is no need to worry about language barriers and visa problems and on top of that protector issues haha.

Whether or not they are separated (so it may look and seem) but in actuality we're all from the same family tree as GKG teachers are the same lineage masters, hence Gelug and Je Tsongkhapa's essence of the teachings continues. The colours of the thread may be different but it is interwoven in to just 1 big design... Enlightenment eh.

It's just another road, another path. Aside from the Dorje Shugden issue, his students dont really get involve in much politics. Perhaps GKG does not want NKT to be tainted with politics of any sort and thus cut ties with many old traditions of Ganden. Some may see that as a good thing, some may see that as a bad thing but for me, whatever it is, it is working and NKT is growing faster than ever. It has more centers than FPMT and they have a very comprehensive and detailed course system that allows people to learn the Dharma wherever they are. It is a very good initiative to help spread the Dharma. NKT has also ordained many members of the sangha and that is an achievement that not many lamas can achieve in the west. It is not easy at all to ask someone of this day and age to take on the monastic vows. There will always be detractors, for every 1000 students there's bound to be around 1-2 people who are not satisfied or who perceive whatever that is happening to them as harm. I would not pay too much attention to them, but it could sometimes be constructive feedback. Just saying.

I dont really see the "splits" as a huge issue. After all, organizations etc are in reality, different labels. Different traditions all lead to the same point but they use different methods and presentations. To see each as distinct and get distraught over it shows our lack of understanding of how things really are. If the result of the split is that more people get in touch with the Dharma...people who are normally not interested in the Dharma become connected because of the split, then would the split still be a bad thing, or is it a good thing now? In more ways than one, I feel that it is a good thing if that is the outcome. But its only sad and painful when people start to get confused by all the criticism and they give up their initial tradition for the "right" one. It's not so much the politics that hurt, but seeing the amount of people breaking their samaya to be on the right side that is sad.

[WisdomBeing]

The future of the Gelugpa Vajrayana tradition will endure. Dorje Shugden is the Protector of our lineage and as we believe and trust in him, I do believe that our lineage will continue. Perhaps it might evolve to suit the times ahead. Perhaps it might even change into a new school, but the core is that Dorje Shugden manifested to protect Tsongkhapa’s teachings and thus the Gelugpa lineage, and all of us here who say that we are Dorje Shugden practitioners should not lose sight of that.

[Ensapa]

The future of the Gelugpa Vajrayana tradition will endure. Dorje Shugden is the Protector of our lineage and as we believe and trust in him, I do believe that our lineage will continue. Perhaps it might evolve to suit the times ahead. Perhaps it might even change into a new school, but the core is that Dorje Shugden manifested to protect Tsongkhapa’s teachings and thus the Gelugpa lineage, and all of us here who say that we are Dorje Shugden practitioners should not lose sight of that.

Gelugpa is a living lineage, with masters that are still alive. There are various Gelug lamas these days who take on an unconventional approach to planting the seeds of Dharma in the minds of people such as Segyu Rinpoche, Lama Osel and Gomo Tulku. And there is nothing wrong with that even if the methods differ from Lama Tsongkhapa's, as long as the message gets across. Even the current Trijang Rinpoche is teaching and training students as a lay lama as opposed to as a monastic but it does not change his attainments and his realizations, not even one bit. And I believe here in this forum, none of us doubt the attainments of these masters. Starting another lineage or splintering from the main lineage could actually be an alternate method of spread the Dharma, if things in the main lineage become too hairy for some reason and these masters wish that their disciples not be affected which is why they had to split. This is how id like to see it anyway. In a traditional sense, splitting from a monastery or lineage is a very bad thing, but sadly, during times like these, things have to manifest the way that they appear to be, for now.

The Gelug lineage that has been passed down to Pabongkha Rinpoche is still intact, and we still have all the teachers  who hold the full transmissions from Pabongkha Rinpoche and they are thriving despite the political issues that surround them. The Dharma protector is alive and real, and he will protect the lineage and prevent it from degenerating. If we doubt even this, then we are saying that Dorje Shugden does not exist. If we worry about Gelug's future, then we are directly doubting Dorje Shugden's vows, ability and power because he has promised to protect the Gelugpas, and him failing to do so means that he is ineffective. I say that we should have trust in our protector. After all, he has never failed us.

[Dondrup Shugden]

There is a Chinese saying that REAL GOLD IS NOT AFRAID OF HOT BURNING FIRE. The Gelugpa tradition was founded by Je Tsongkapa, this era's second Buddha.  After 2600 years Shakymuni Buddha's teachings, the Dharma is still in place, so how can Gelugpa disappear.

All the discrimination against DS Lamas within the Gelugpa tradition will not leave the tradition and those who wanted to leave have done so.

If the new sectors formed DS lamas are genuine the time will come when a Great Buddhist will unite them all.
Why not, when their stand is for the propitiation of DS and DS does not split people and He is the Protector of Je Tsongkapa's doctrine.